Bob Hobden wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote
"CorporalJones" wrote ...
Was it in this NG that I read that with ponds it was no longer
required to clear a hole in the ice to protect wildlife.
Followed that recommendation and ended up with multiple floating
frogs and goldfish.
So much for the experts!!!

That usually only happens if the water quality is nasty (high nitrite
content), oxygen levels low, and lots of rotting detritus on the
bottom leading to gasses of decomposition. A saucepan of boiling water
placed on the ice will thaw a nice round hole allowing the gas
exchange with the air. Never break a hole as the shock wave can kill
and injure fish.


and you can always do what I do and keep your external pond filter
system running 365, but at low speed in winter, so water is always
circulating. Running water is less likely to freeze especially as the
pump will create some heat.

BTW There are kits at fish keeping outlets that you can use to test your
water quality, it's the test for nitrites you want, which will point to
any water quality problems that need addressing for the future.
The Tetra test kits work well but some with colour wheels can be a bit
expensive although they last a lifetime.

However - never take water from the bottom of the pond, and never
circulate it to the bottom.

Water contracts as it cools, but begins to expand again after reaching
4° C, so unless it's really cold for a very long time, there's always
water in the liquid state there.

If you circulate the water so the bottom layer is disturbed, the pond
will be able to freeze solid much quicker.

It's better by far to either bore a hole with a tank-cutter, or as
suggested, melt one (keeping the hot water within the pan)

--
Rusty

Janet Baraclough wrote:
The message
from CorporalJones contains these words:

Was it in this NG that I read that with ponds it was no longer required
to clear a hole in the ice to protect wildlife.

I don't recall such a post

Probably a directive from the Ministry of Agony Fish and Fools.

Followed that recommendation and ended up with multiple floating frogs
and goldfish.
So much for the experts!!!

What experts? This is a discussion group for gardeners, not an
advisory service.

--
Rusty

Martin wrote:

The canals of Leiden are not just full of crap but also dead carp.

OverLeiden?

--
Rusty

Divingbrit wrote:
On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 19:31:04 GMT, CorporalJones
wrote:

Was it in this NG that I read that with ponds it was no longer required
to clear a hole in the ice to protect wildlife.

This was posted somewhere , or a report on TV / Radio / internet, as I
also learned that it is no longer required. The souce was a university
I believe.

'no longer required' sounds like a repealed law.

I've never known any of the laws of nature to have been repealed.
(Except possibly once, in a ressurection...)

It made sense to me, but agree that if you had rotting materiel giving
off gas, then that too could have been trapped.

question
Do dead frogs float? I lost a couple in the summer last yar and their
bodies sank.

It doesn't take long (in warm weather) for them to bloatfloat.

--
Rusty

CorporalJones wrote:

/snip/

The pond is quite healthy, the water clears very quickly in the spring
although I have a constant battle with chickweed
Will look for a small pond heater as I have an adjacent power supply

I think your battle is probably with something else - chickweed is a
relative of the pink family...

--
Rusty

On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 18:07:23 GMT, CorporalJones wrote:

clearing the space and the earthworks to re-align my boundary fence has
turned up numerous frogs, frog-lets and newts, all these have been
safely ensconced into my greenhouse so they should be OK until I release
them outside in the spring

Won't the green house be too warm, even un heated it will still get
relatively warm in the sun, for them to hibernate properly? And if
they are awake there won't be any food for them...

Think I'd just move them to cover similar to where they where found.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 18:07:23 GMT, CorporalJones wrote:

clearing the space and the earthworks to re-align my boundary fence has
turned up numerous frogs, frog-lets and newts, all these have been
safely ensconced into my greenhouse so they should be OK until I release
them outside in the spring

Won't the green house be too warm, even un heated it will still get
relatively warm in the sun, for them to hibernate properly? And if
they are awake there won't be any food for them...

Think I'd just move them to cover similar to where they where found.

I left a tray - well, the bottom four or five inches of a plastic 5
gallon drum - in the greenhouse, having taken the cocoa tree out of it.

There were three flattish flints in there to raise the pot a bit, and
today I noticed that the fogs which had taken-up residence under the
stones were frolicking amongst the lemons.

Where the temperature is warm enough for them to wake up, it's warm
enough for worms and creepy-crawlies. Moving a bag of old papers
revealed a fine and wriggling wormery.

--
Rusty

On 31/01/2010 00:12, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 18:07:23 GMT, CorporalJones wrote:

clearing the space and the earthworks to re-align my boundary fence has
turned up numerous frogs, frog-lets and newts, all these have been
safely ensconced into my greenhouse so they should be OK until I release
them outside in the spring

Won't the green house be too warm, even un heated it will still get
relatively warm in the sun, for them to hibernate properly? And if
they are awake there won't be any food for them...

Think I'd just move them to cover similar to where they where found.


I have a few frogs that took residence in the greenhouse some time ago
out of their choice.
I have a water sump on two sides of the greenhouse for my grow bags,
often find a blob of spawn in it in the spring with ensuing froglets.
I leave them to co-exist with the plants, as I don't exercise any
chemical control they seem to do their bit but there are exits if they
choose to leave.
They do hibernate under the staging (which is full of pots, plants etc)
the only hassle is I can't have a sort out until they come out of
hibernation but I can live with that.

--
Corporal Jones
"I don't like it up me"

On 30/01/2010 20:12, Rusty Hinge wrote:
CorporalJones wrote:

/snip/

The pond is quite healthy, the water clears very quickly in the spring
although I have a constant battle with chickweed
Will look for a small pond heater as I have an adjacent power supply

I think your battle is probably with something else - chickweed is a
relative of the pink family...


Sorry I meant Duckweed, suppose that is the grown up version of
Chickweed :-)

--
Corporal Jones
"I don't like it up me"

CorporalJones wrote:
On 30/01/2010 20:12, Rusty Hinge wrote:
CorporalJones wrote:

/snip/

The pond is quite healthy, the water clears very quickly in the spring
although I have a constant battle with chickweed
Will look for a small pond heater as I have an adjacent power supply

I think your battle is probably with something else - chickweed is a
relative of the pink family...


Sorry I meant Duckweed, suppose that is the grown up version of
Chickweed :-)

Ducklingweed...

Chickweed grows into salad in my garden.

--
Rusty