Hi all

Could anyone ID this grapevine? I know it's not the best of images but I can
upload another in a few days if need be...thanks.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Grapevine.jpg



--


Regards
p.mc

"p.mc" wrote in message
...


Working link below

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Grapevine.jpg


--


Regards
p.mc

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010, p.mc wrote:


Could anyone ID this grapevine? I know it's not the best of images but
I can upload another in a few days if need be...thanks.

[IMG]http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j238/npilcs/Greenbank%20allotment
/Grapevine.jpg[/IMG]

It looks as though you're writing from Germany. This is a UK based
gardening group and the vines we are familiar with are not likely to be
those grown in Germany.

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France

Grape varieties often have misleading names. In the same way that Riesling Italico is neither any kind of Riesling nor comes from, nor is much grown in, Italy, likewise Black Hamburg doesn't come from Hamburg, and is in general not much grown in Germany.

But, seriously, identifying grape varieties from the many thousands that exist is an expert task and you are unlikely to find that on a general gardening forum. It would also help any expert you did contact to give information which might help them narrow it down, such as where you are growing it, how easily it ripens, what it tastes like, anything you know about where it came from, etc. For example, the kinds of varieties generally found in commercial vineyards are often very different from those found in gardens, so that helps narrow it down.

In fact many of the grape varieties we grow in England do come from Germany, because that is the main source of ampelographical research into cool climate grape varieties. Though I happened to be in Denbies Vineyard at the weekend (the largest vineyard in England) and their shop was selling Chardonnay and Pinot Noir vines for people to grow in their gardens, and I thought how ridiculous. It so happens that a few ideally located vineyards in England are making good sparkling wine from these varieties, but the chance of them giving a home gardener much joy is pretty low. I ate some beautifully ripe grapes off my Phoenix vine (a german variety) in mid-September, (trained against a south-facing wall), first year in the ground, despite the poor weather we had in late summer this year - I have good feelings about what this vine is going to do in future. I want also to grow a Boskoop Glory when I find one, that's a Dutch variety.

But it was bred in Germany - sorry should have said that.

On 28 Sep, 12:55, David Rance wrote:
On Mon, 27 Sep 2010, p.mc wrote:
Could anyone ID this grapevine? I know it's not the best of images but
I can upload another in a few days if need be...thanks.

[IMG]http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j238/npilcs/Greenbank%20allotment
/Grapevine.jpg[/IMG]

It looks as though you're writing from Germany. This is a UK based
gardening group and the vines we are familiar with are not likely to be
those grown in Germany.

David

I can't answer the question, but I have one that looks very similar
here in SE London. The most distinctive feature is that the grapes are
globular rather than the eggs of the ones seen in shops. Mine came
from a harvest festival decoration that I cut into lengths and
planted. One of them took and after 5 years I'm getting sizeable
grapes.

Chris

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010, Sacha wrote:

Could anyone ID this grapevine? I know it's not the best of images
but I can upload another in a few days if need be...thanks.

[IMG]http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j238/npilcs/Greenbank%20allotment
/Grapevine.jpg[/IMG]

It looks as though you're writing from Germany. This is a UK based
gardening group and the vines we are familiar with are not likely to
be those grown in Germany.

Not even 'Black Hamburg'? ;-)) I think that's the one that's growing
at Hampton Court - huge and amazing thing.

Well, I confess that I was thinking purely in terms of grapes for making
wine (which is what I've been doing today). But the OP gave us too few
details. Where was it growing? When was the photo taken, i.e. how ripe
are the grapes? So is it likely to be a black grape or a white one?

I have some Kerner vines but they don't ripen satisfactorily in England
as they're too late. I had some Müller-Thurgau once at the time that
they were popular in England in the '70s and '80s but had no success
with them. Although, of course, MT was developed in Switzerland from a
Riesling cross (which *is* German). MT changes its character according
to latitude. In the Mosel area it produces a light dry wine with a
Riesling character. In Austria it produces a heavy sweet wine. But in
England it generally produces a very thin wine with little character
which is why it has gone out of fashion here.

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France

"echinosum" wrote in message
...

echinosum;901513 Wrote:
likewise Black Hamburg doesn't come from Hamburg, and is in general not
much grown in Germany.
But it was bred in Germany - sorry should have said that.




--
echinosum

Hi all

Apologies for the brief info, this vine is growing in the UK Merseyside to
be precise.
The image was taken 2 days ago, fruit is small and hard, also not sure if
it's a black or white grape.

It's on a reclaimed allotment that my brother recently acquired due to the
previous
holder not tending, and is now in the process of clearing it up. I'm hoping
to get a few
images up here soon for ID, so to aid better management of original species
that are
residing on the plot.

Out of interest..."Germany". What gave you that impression? :-)

--


Regards
p.mc

On Wed, 29 Sep 2010, p.mc wrote:

Apologies for the brief info, this vine is growing in the UK Merseyside
to be precise.
The image was taken 2 days ago, fruit is small and hard, also not sure
if it's a black or white grape.

The grapes looked rather small which is why I thought the photo must
have been taken about two months ago. By this time they should be ripe
or very nearly. Almost impossible to tell whether it's black or white
though I've noticed that, around autumn time, the edges of leaves of
some black varieties tend to go dark red as though they are stained with
blood.

The fact that the grapes are so immature may possibly be due to a late
frost. Frosts will kill off any new shoots and so, after a few weeks,
they have to start again.

Out of interest..."Germany". What gave you that impression? :-)

Albasani.net in your header. I did a "whois" on it and it came up with
an organisation whose owner is Alexander Bartolich in Neuhofen. Just
shows that one can misinterpret the information! ;-)

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France

Sacha wrote:
On 2010-09-28 12:55:56 +0100, David Rance
said:

On Mon, 27 Sep 2010, p.mc wrote:


Could anyone ID this grapevine? I know it's not the best of images
but I can upload another in a few days if need be...thanks.

[IMG]http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j238/npilcs/Greenbank%20allotment
/Grapevine.jpg[/IMG]

It looks as though you're writing from Germany. This is a UK based
gardening group and the vines we are familiar with are not likely to
be those grown in Germany.

David

Not even 'Black Hamburg'? ;-)) I think that's the one that's growing
at Hampton Court - huge and amazing thing.

Actually, a fair number of vines intended for German vinyards have made
it over here, as the climate is (allegedly) very similar.

I used to know someone who planted a vinyard in East Anglia using a new
variety of early-ripening grapes - this was about twenty-five years ago...

--
Rusty

p.mc wrote:

"p.mc" wrote in message
...


Working link below

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j2.../Grapevine.jpg

Diffiult to tell with that amount of detail - but it's not impossible
AFAICT that it could be Boskoop's Glory.

Though i would have expected the grapes to have been riper by now - I've
picked all mine.

(Black Hamburg only just beginning to turn - both vines outdoors.)

--
Rusty

In article ,
Rusty Hinge wrote:

Actually, a fair number of vines intended for German vinyards have made
it over here, as the climate is (allegedly) very similar.

I used to know someone who planted a vinyard in East Anglia using a new
variety of early-ripening grapes - this was about twenty-five years ago...

Have they ripened yet?


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Wed, 29 Sep 2010, Rusty Hinge wrote:

Actually, a fair number of vines intended for German vinyards have made
it over here, as the climate is (allegedly) very similar.

Only the north of Germany. The south is much hotter.

It's a big country!

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France

"David Rance" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 29 Sep 2010, p.mc wrote:

Apologies for the brief info, this vine is growing in the UK Merseyside to
be precise.
The image was taken 2 days ago, fruit is small and hard, also not sure if
it's a black or white grape.

The grapes looked rather small which is why I thought the photo must have
been taken about two months ago. By this time they should be ripe or very
nearly. Almost impossible to tell whether it's black or white though I've
noticed that, around autumn time, the edges of leaves of some black
varieties tend to go dark red as though they are stained with blood.

The fact that the grapes are so immature may possibly be due to a late
frost. Frosts will kill off any new shoots and so, after a few weeks, they
have to start again.

Out of interest..."Germany". What gave you that impression? :-)

Albasani.net in your header. I did a "whois" on it and it came up with an
organisation whose owner is Alexander Bartolich in Neuhofen. Just shows
that one can misinterpret the information! ;-)

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France

"Ah right"...It's just a news server I like, it has the most relevant NGs I
prefer to subscribe to. Must admit though I'm having some issues using
Windows live mail program on this Windows 7 laptop. Although I can obviously
use newsgroups, it seems to mess me about when trying to add Photobucket
image links to posts. Also not remembering safe senders "who are" in the
list, but still optioning me to allow sender??? Don't have any of this on my
other WinXP machine using good old Outlook Express, but there's no support
for that program now, and Windows 7 wont run it...Sigh!!

--


Regards
p.mc

On Wed, 29 Sep 2010, Sacha wrote:

The man who used to own this house - Edward Hyams - was one of the
first to try growing vines for modern wine making in England. In fact,
he grew them here where our greenhouses are now. I don't think he was
terribly successful though he did write one of his many books on the
subject!

And he is mentioned by writers on English viticulture since. My first
book on the subject was written by Gillian Pearkes in 1969 and she
mentions Edward Hyams. I quote:

"Some thirty years later [after the demise of English viticulture which
had kept going down the centuries], in 1946 and 1948 respectively, Mr.
Barrington-Brock and Mr. Edward Hyams started vineyards, thus reviving
viticulture again in Britain, and in the comparatively short time since
their early efforts there has been a tremendous revival of theoretical
and practical interest in the vine in this country, so much so that
there are now [in 1969] 430 acres, nearly 150 established commercial
vineyards, in existence and many more being planned; moreover there are
between one and two hundred private vineyards of varying sizes now well
established."

And in her book she lists all the known vineyards at that time, both
commercial and private.

The reason for Edward Hyams lack of success would have been due to not
having suitable vines varieties for our climate. Indeed when Gillian
Pearkes was writing, and when I started growing grapes about six years
later, the two most popular vines were Seyve-Villard 5/276, a hybrid,
and Müller-Thurgau. Seyve-Villard is now renamed Seyval Blanc and is
still popular. MT is too prone to mildew and has fallen out of favour.
But there is now a multitude of vine varieties to choose from.

David

--
David Rance
writing from Le Mesnil Villement, Calvados, France