I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Well, it's no more a substitute for compost as stones would be for soil.
Basically it;'s a nutrient-free porous artificial rock. But I guess
that if your pond water has sufficient nutrients, the plants would
extract what they need from the water.

But then, they could equally extract the nutrients if they were just
held in place by stones or gravel. And those, of course, would be a lot
cheaper than hydroleca...

--

Jeff

On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.


I imagine it has similar properties to vermiculite and perlite. Yes,
very light when dry, BUT extremely heavy when wet. They recommend it for
roof gardens, which doesn't make much sense.

On 16/08/2014 13:43, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Sat, 16 Aug 2014 12:18:02 +0100, Spider wrote:

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Never used it, so can't answer your question, but Hydroleca is just a
trade name for Lightweight Expanded Clay Aggregate (the Leca bit),
widely available and probably a lot cheaper than Hydroleca. See
http://tinyurl.com/owjjpe5 for general info. At one time in Cornwall
large quantities (many lorry-loads) were used as fill in 'escape
lanes' at the bottom of long steep hills where lorries whose brakes
had failed could be brought to a reasonably safe halt. And no, I never
did avail myself of the resource (but I bet some did!)

If it does turn out to be a bit light (it may even float; it has a
malteser-like structure), you could always mix it with gravel to
weight it.


Allegedly it holds 40% of its own weight in water, which isn't a lot
comapared to vermiculite, but enough to stop it floating.

On 16/08/2014 13:43, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Sat, 16 Aug 2014 12:18:02 +0100, Spider wrote:

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Never used it, so can't answer your question, but Hydroleca is just a
trade name for Lightweight Expanded Clay Aggregate (the Leca bit),
widely available and probably a lot cheaper than Hydroleca. See
http://tinyurl.com/owjjpe5 for general info. At one time in Cornwall
large quantities (many lorry-loads) were used as fill in 'escape
lanes' at the bottom of long steep hills where lorries whose brakes
had failed could be brought to a reasonably safe halt. And no, I never
did avail myself of the resource (but I bet some did!)

If it does turn out to be a bit light (it may even float; it has a
malteser-like structure), you could always mix it with gravel to
weight it.




Thanks, Chris. I had a look at that link and one or two images seemed
to suggest it might float. If it's really light enough to float, I'm
not sure gravel would help much, unless it was quite chunky.

Perhaps I'll just have to buy some and see if it sinks or floats. I'm
sure I could use the rest for top-dressing pots if I can't use it in the
pond.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 16/08/2014 12:31, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Well, it's no more a substitute for compost as stones would be for soil.
Basically it;'s a nutrient-free porous artificial rock. But I guess
that if your pond water has sufficient nutrients, the plants would
extract what they need from the water.

But then, they could equally extract the nutrients if they were just
held in place by stones or gravel. And those, of course, would be a lot
cheaper than hydroleca...




Very sensible observations. Plant nutrients might well come from the
few fish I have, but if gravel/stones will do the job, I could try that.
Thanks.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 16/08/2014 12:39, stuart noble wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.


I imagine it has similar properties to vermiculite and perlite. Yes,
very light when dry, BUT extremely heavy when wet. They recommend it for
roof gardens, which doesn't make much sense.



Yes, I can see that it might be like vermiculite/perlite, except they'd
be really hopeless in a pond. I think I will experiment with gravel
first and see if that will suffice.

I had some idea that Hydroleca would be less muddy in a pond than the
proper compost, and be more widely available. I don't often see aquatic
compost for sale, so was looking for a substitute.

Thanks for your input.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

"Spider" wrote...

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other urglers'
opinions/experience.


That is very light especially in water so any movement by fish and you will
have empty pots. The main problem is that it is nutrient sterile so you
plants will not grow well especially gross feeders like lilies not matter
how rich your pond water.
For lilies use good garden soil as long as it hasn't been manured/fertilized
recently, not even that "Aquatic compost" is good enough for them without
also buying their own fertilizer. (waste of money IMO). The soil should be
covered with pebbles but they must be big enough and heavy enough that the
fish can't move them and get in and suck up the mud to feed. For Goldfish a
goldfish sized pebble is about right, for Koi no pebble is big enough, cover
the pots with a wire mesh wired down well but ensure the fish cannot get
caught in the mesh but the lily can send up shoots through it.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK

"stuart noble" wrote

Chris Hogg wrote:
Spider wrote:

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Never used it, so can't answer your question, but Hydroleca is just a
trade name for Lightweight Expanded Clay Aggregate (the Leca bit),
widely available and probably a lot cheaper than Hydroleca. See
http://tinyurl.com/owjjpe5 for general info. At one time in Cornwall
large quantities (many lorry-loads) were used as fill in 'escape
lanes' at the bottom of long steep hills where lorries whose brakes
had failed could be brought to a reasonably safe halt. And no, I never
did avail myself of the resource (but I bet some did!)

If it does turn out to be a bit light (it may even float; it has a
malteser-like structure), you could always mix it with gravel to
weight it.


Allegedly it holds 40% of its own weight in water, which isn't a lot
comapared to vermiculite, but enough to stop it floating.
I used it as a filter medium once and some of it will float but it will all
be too light to use in a pond, the fish will have it out of the pots in
short order.
--
Regards. Bob Hobden.
Posted to this Newsgroup from the W of London, UK

On 16/08/2014 22:30, Spider wrote:

Perhaps I'll just have to buy some and see if it sinks or floats. I'm
sure I could use the rest for top-dressing pots if I can't use it in the
pond.

You can sometimes find house plants in hydroleca in garden centres. If
you can find such a plant which is well past its best, you could ask the
GC if they will let you have it to try the hydroleca as a pond plant
medium. They might even have an area of plants awaiting disposal which
are in hydroleca, and you could get a potful for free.

--

Jeff

On 16/08/2014 23:36, Bob Hobden wrote:
"stuart noble" wrote

Chris Hogg wrote:
Spider wrote:

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good
reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.

Never used it, so can't answer your question, but Hydroleca is just a
trade name for Lightweight Expanded Clay Aggregate (the Leca bit),
widely available and probably a lot cheaper than Hydroleca. See
http://tinyurl.com/owjjpe5 for general info. At one time in Cornwall
large quantities (many lorry-loads) were used as fill in 'escape
lanes' at the bottom of long steep hills where lorries whose brakes
had failed could be brought to a reasonably safe halt. And no, I never
did avail myself of the resource (but I bet some did!)

If it does turn out to be a bit light (it may even float; it has a
malteser-like structure), you could always mix it with gravel to
weight it.


Allegedly it holds 40% of its own weight in water, which isn't a lot
comapared to vermiculite, but enough to stop it floating.


I used it as a filter medium once and some of it will float but it will
all be too light to use in a pond, the fish will have it out of the pots
in short order.



Thanks, Bob. That definitely rules it out for pond use, then. If half
of it sinks and half of it floats, I'll be forever netting it from the
pond. Silly idea abandoned :-}
--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 17/08/2014 08:29, Jeff Layman wrote:
On 16/08/2014 22:30, Spider wrote:

Perhaps I'll just have to buy some and see if it sinks or floats. I'm
sure I could use the rest for top-dressing pots if I can't use it in the
pond.

You can sometimes find house plants in hydroleca in garden centres. If
you can find such a plant which is well past its best, you could ask the
GC if they will let you have it to try the hydroleca as a pond plant
medium. They might even have an area of plants awaiting disposal which
are in hydroleca, and you could get a potful for free.




That would be a good idea, Jeff, if Bob hadn't just helped me scupper
the whole idea! Thanks for the thought, though. I have done successful
scrounging in gcs/nurseries before, so I know it can be worthwhile. No
harm in asking.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 16/08/2014 23:33, Bob Hobden wrote:
"Spider" wrote...

I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for
aquatic compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very
good reason why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being
used for hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in
other urglers' opinions/experience.


That is very light especially in water so any movement by fish and you
will have empty pots. The main problem is that it is nutrient sterile so
you plants will not grow well especially gross feeders like lilies not
matter how rich your pond water.
For lilies use good garden soil as long as it hasn't been
manured/fertilized recently, not even that "Aquatic compost" is good
enough for them without also buying their own fertilizer. (waste of
money IMO). The soil should be covered with pebbles but they must be big
enough and heavy enough that the fish can't move them and get in and
suck up the mud to feed. For Goldfish a goldfish sized pebble is about
right, for Koi no pebble is big enough, cover the pots with a wire mesh
wired down well but ensure the fish cannot get caught in the mesh but
the lily can send up shoots through it.



Thanks, Bob, you'd already made up my mind over the weight issue, so
I've abandoned Hydroleca for pond use.
Very interesting what you say about aquatic compost and lilies. I do
have a small lily in the pond. It's in its second summer with me and
has produced a flower bed, so I imagine there's enough food for now.
Maybe next year I'll have to pot it into better compost and, presumably,
a bigger pot? I have some reasonably good garden soil in the veg patch
which would suit, but I used chicken manure pellets on it this Spring.
Do you think it will be safe enough to use in the pond by next April, say?

As to my fish, they were rescued and given to me so, although I'm fairly
sure they're not goldfish, I don't know what they are. Definitely not
Orfe since I had those previously. It is possible, I suppose, that they
are small Koi. It's not easy to photograph them as they're not at the
surface for very long. I suppose I'll know they're Koi when they grow
too big for my little pond and start moving the plants about!

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 16/08/2014 22:39, Spider wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:39, stuart noble wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.


I imagine it has similar properties to vermiculite and perlite. Yes,
very light when dry, BUT extremely heavy when wet. They recommend it for
roof gardens, which doesn't make much sense.



Yes, I can see that it might be like vermiculite/perlite, except they'd
be really hopeless in a pond. I think I will experiment with gravel
first and see if that will suffice.

I had some idea that Hydroleca would be less muddy in a pond than the
proper compost, and be more widely available. I don't often see aquatic
compost for sale, so was looking for a substitute.

Thanks for your input.



I seem to remember in my "Youth" we cut old turf about 2 inches thick
and wrapped that around a house brick, grass innermost. and planted
water lilies into that.
If you are going to use garden soil then think of mixing it with some
stones and putting it all into an old sprout or cabbage net.
The net will stop the fish ploughing up the soil, and wont rot.
As for your worry about poultry manure, remember there are many water
birds such as ducks, morehens etc that don't get out of the water to
relieve themselves.
David @ a now sunny side of Swansea Bay

On 17/08/2014 14:53, David Hill wrote:
On 16/08/2014 22:39, Spider wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:39, stuart noble wrote:
On 16/08/2014 12:18, Spider wrote:
I have been wondering about using Hydroleca as a substitute for aquatic
compost when potting up pond plants. There's probably a very good
reason
why I've never heard of it being done, despite its being used for
hydroponics. Perhaps it's too light? I'd be interested in other
urglers' opinions/experience.


I imagine it has similar properties to vermiculite and perlite. Yes,
very light when dry, BUT extremely heavy when wet. They recommend it for
roof gardens, which doesn't make much sense.



Yes, I can see that it might be like vermiculite/perlite, except they'd
be really hopeless in a pond. I think I will experiment with gravel
first and see if that will suffice.

I had some idea that Hydroleca would be less muddy in a pond than the
proper compost, and be more widely available. I don't often see aquatic
compost for sale, so was looking for a substitute.

Thanks for your input.



I seem to remember in my "Youth" we cut old turf about 2 inches thick
and wrapped that around a house brick, grass innermost. and planted
water lilies into that.
If you are going to use garden soil then think of mixing it with some
stones and putting it all into an old sprout or cabbage net.
The net will stop the fish ploughing up the soil, and wont rot.
As for your worry about poultry manure, remember there are many water
birds such as ducks, morehens etc that don't get out of the water to
relieve themselves.
David @ a now sunny side of Swansea Bay




Thanks, David, that's a good tip. I've usually lined my aquatic pots
with torn up old tee shirts (there's a limit to how many dusters one can
use!), which keeps the soil in place, but I'll investigate cabbage nets.
I'm not sure I'd want to eat and paddle in water I'd just soiled! At
least chick poo pellets are sterilised. I'll not be too worried, then.
Thanks.
--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay