The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

This sounds doubtful if subjected to logical analysis anyway - my 2p theory
is that more berries means a good summer, and good summers (lots of high
pressure and clear skies) are often followed by hard winters (lots of high
pressure and clear skies).

Lots of berries at the end of a summer means that in the previous
summer/autumn, the plant was able to lay down good reserves of energy
with which to produce masses of flowers and then fruit the following
year.

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

In the UK at least, there is no correlation between good summers and
succeeding, or preceding, hard winters. Indeed, we don't seem to get
hard winters any more!

You will always find a correlation of some sort if you look hard enough.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

This sounds doubtful if subjected to logical analysis anyway - my 2p theory
is that more berries means a good summer, and good summers (lots of high
pressure and clear skies) are often followed by hard winters (lots of high
pressure and clear skies).

Lots of berries at the end of a summer means that in the previous
summer/autumn, the plant was able to lay down good reserves of energy
with which to produce masses of flowers and then fruit the following
year.

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

In the UK at least, there is no correlation between good summers and
succeeding, or preceding, hard winters. Indeed, we don't seem to get
hard winters any more!

You will always find a correlation of some sort if you look hard enough.

Not ones that are necessarily meaningful.

--
Malcolm

The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

--
Malcolm

NNTP-Posting-Host: 217.135.4.198
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Trace: news7.svr.pol.co.uk 1081700548 7867 217.135.4.198 (11 Apr 2004 16:22:28 GMT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Apr 2004 16:22:28 GMT
X-Complaints-To:
User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.0.6
Path: kermit!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!border1.nntp.as h.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!opentransit.net!n ewsfeed.icl.net!colt.net!diablo.theplanet.net!news .theplanet.net!not-for-mail
Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:195979

Malcolm11/4/04 3:53


In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

Yes. Oak trees during the 1976 drought produced masses more acorns than
usual; our Eucryphia amazed us by blooming profusely in January. We
wondered if it was too early or too late - wrong on both counts. It was
dead a couple of months later. The abundance of flower/fruits is to ensure
survival of the species.
You will often see recommendations to keep plants in pots or situations
where roots are restricted, for example. This is because it causes them to
fruit or flower better. A lot of people recommend such treatment for fig
trees, for example.
--

Sacha
(remove the weeds to email me)

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 17:19:38 +0100, Sacha
wrote:

A lot of people recommend such treatment for fig
trees, for example.

Also amaryllis and agapanthus.

Glenys

Trying to lurk, honest.

--
"A Newsweek poll said if the election were held today, John Kerry
would beat Bush 49 percent to 46 percent. And today, President Bush
called Newsweek magazine a threat to world peace." Jay Leno

In article , Malcolm
writes

In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

Radishes going to seed?

--
Kay Easton

Edward's earthworm page:
http://www.scarboro.demon.co.uk/edward/index.htm

"Jaques d'Alltrades" wrote in
message ...
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot
of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been
able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of
energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Why then do we water and feed our plants so assiduously?
Why don't we just garden exclusively with plants which give their best
only when they are neglected to the point of dying?

Franz

Reply-To:
NNTP-Posting-Host: 217.135.251.213
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Trace: news6.svr.pol.co.uk 1081718252 21814 217.135.251.213 (11 Apr 2004 21:17:32 GMT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: 11 Apr 2004 21:17:32 GMT
X-Complaints-To:
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.91/32.564
Path: kermit!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!border1.nntp.as h.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!newshosting.com!n x01.iad01.newshosting.com!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfee d.fjserv.net!diablo.theplanet.net!news.theplanet.n et!not-for-mail
Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:196006

On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 21:11:50 +0000 (UTC), "Franz Heymann"
wrote:

Why then do we water and feed our plants so assiduously?
Why don't we just garden exclusively with plants which give their best
only when they are neglected to the point of dying?

Not all plants work like this. We often maintain those plants which
can be maintained in a condition of stress, without killing or
seriously weakening them, in that condition of stress as normal.
Amaryllis, for example, flower much better in very small pots, under
conditions in which other plants would be described as horribly root
bound. Other plants may flower better under conditions of stress, but
those stresses kill them, and if they flower reasonably well without
stress, then they might as well not be stressed.

Glenys

--
"A Newsweek poll said if the election were held today, John Kerry
would beat Bush 49 percent to 46 percent. And today, President Bush
called Newsweek magazine a threat to world peace." Jay Leno

Lines: 25
X-Trace: 1081843443 master.news.zetnet.net 8570 194.247.47.30
Path: kermit!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!newshosting.com !nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newsfeed.icl.net!newsf eed.fjserv.net!colt.net!news-lond.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!easynet-monga!easynet.net!peer.news.zetnet.net!master.news .zetnet.net!n
ot-for-mail
Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:196146

The message
from Malcolm contains these words:
In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

Well known phenomenon.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from MissJuggs contains these words:
On Sun, 11 Apr 2004 17:19:38 +0100, Sacha
wrote:

A lot of people recommend such treatment for fig
trees, for example.

Also amaryllis and agapanthus.

Glenys

Trying to lurk, honest.

Come into the potting shed and park yourself on that old sack of
hardened cement I borrowed from Another Place.

Cup of tea?

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from MissJuggs contains these words:

(sig)

"A Newsweek poll said if the election were held today, John Kerry
would beat Bush 49 percent to 46 percent. And today, President Bush
called Newsweek magazine a threat to world peace." Jay Leno

Which as we all know is being sown this spring like there is no tomorrow......

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

Lines: 33
X-Trace: 1081843444 master.news.zetnet.net 8570 194.247.47.30
Path: kermit!newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com!nntpserver.com!border1.nntp.as h.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!zen.net.uk!dedeki nd.zen.co.uk!peernews.manap.net!194.247.47.118.MIS MATCH!master.news.zetnet.net!not-for-mail
Xref: kermit uk.rec.gardening:196149

The message
from "Franz Heymann" contains these words:
"Jaques d'Alltrades" wrote in
message ...
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot
of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been
able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of
energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Why then do we water and feed our plants so assiduously?
Why don't we just garden exclusively with plants which give their best
only when they are neglected to the point of dying?

You might, I couldn't possibly comment on why.

But just think - if you stressed everything in your garden beyond its
limits, you'd have a new garden each year and an empty bank balance.

--
Rusty
Open the creaking gate to make a horrid.squeak, then lower the foobar.
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:
In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:

Much more likely that late frosts in the spring didn't kill a lot of the
blooms or retard activity of pollinating insects.

But they are just secondary factors. The plant has to have been able to
produce the blooms in the first place, i.e. from its reserves of energy,
before there is anything for frosts or insects to affect.

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

Well known phenomenon.

Which is hardly an answer to my questions :-(

--
Malcolm

Malcolm13/4/04 10:28


In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
The message
from Malcolm contains these words:
In article , Jaques d'Alltrades
writes
snip

Not so. When a plant/tree/shrub is badly stressed and 'thinks' it's
dying, it often produces an abundance of bloom.

Interesting. How does it achieve this and have you seen examples?

Well known phenomenon.

Which is hardly an answer to my questions :-(

I posted an answer upthread, drawn from personal experience.
--

Sacha
(remove the weeds to email me)