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#16
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
g'day john,
in the past the female trap solutions have worked but not here in this area, hwy i got no idea. we have some recipes on our remedies page, ans as yet i have not heard back from anyone who has had success with trapping females. many gardeners up her share our issues. didn't trap a single female out of 3 or 4 different recipe traps last season. there is a natural lure substance than needs to be sprayed around it does warn not to get it on the fuit and it is a bee killer. so many won'tuse it, it doesn't work as a female trap so far as others have told me. and it is too expensive o buy and try also, but the bee bit is enough for me. trappng males has ben effective in the past, i don't know whether males or even females are one hit wonders, would be interestig to know, but may not help with management, i feel they all just merrily keep mating on all season by the looks of our current issue here. we run 6 male traps all year here about every 2 to 3 months through summer we replace one on a rotatinal basis, they continue to work for nearly a year. teh male bottles don't need to be trap botles and keep the fly in once he is inside as it is the aroma of the wick that attracts him and once he lands on the wick he gets a dose of insecticide or he maybe even gets a wiff of the insecticide, so though a male may exit teh bottle there is nothing to say he still will not succumb. our trap vey similar to what i have seen on fruit farms. you could just hand a wick out in the open it would still work only then you can't monitor fly levels. with the male traps they are away from the garden so there is no conflict of arom's and if there was an effective female trap then i can see it would be not so good to hang it near the fruiting plant as the aroma of ripening fruit may over ride the aroma of he bottle and then he effectiveness is diminited. if you research their mating habits let us know, if anyone finds an effective female trap ingredient there are many gardeners out there who would like to hear about nothing more tedious than netting tom's and capsicums whatever. the best wick is the one tha looks like a cotton wool roll tight wadded the one in the plastic holder not so good. On Thu, 26 Aug 2010 13:37:53 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#17
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
gardenlen writes:
more thinking of teh ingrediants which i will try this season, but will still use my trap bottles so once in they can't get out and usually drown anyway, just that the femal tropical fruit fly is very hard to lure we run male fruit fly wicks in trap bottles not made to hold the fly in in but to protect the wick from weather once in the bottle they succumb to the pheramone small and land on the wick or breathe the fumes and die. Ah! I misunderstood you. I associate you with homemade lures and traps, so when you said you were trapping mostly males, I pictured your vegemite + sugar, etc., lure to be attracting a few females but lots of males. I see now that you are using separate traps. (Though I wonder whether you couldn't combine them, with the wick placed in the neck of the jar well above the liquid lure? Especially if you could arrange for the females to not drown or die, this would allow their natural pheromones to continue beckoning in hordes of males.) Anyway, by coincidence, on Don Burke's radio gardening program today an expert was discussing fruit-fly traps. He said that as soon as females emerge they head for a source of protein as this is required to get their eggs developing. Once they have fed, their mission then becomes to find a male and after that a suitable fruit to deposit their eggs. He said that you have to catch them as soon as they hatch and before they get that first protein feed otherwise they are not interested in your lure. From this I would conclude that you'd need to have your female lures set right from the word go, so they stand a good chance of intercepting those early hungry virgin females. The expert on the radio didn't explain exactly what sources of protein the females would typically seek out, but I know yeast is a source of protein, whereas sugar is not. The trap he was talking about was Eeco Natura Lure. I recall reporting here some years ago on an article I'd read, where the finding was that fruit-flies are strongly attracted to certain colours. This varied with the species, but I recall bright purple being a strong attraction for one species. (I'd guess they were talking about female flies, with the idea being to have hanging around your garden lots of sticky objects of the fly's preferred colour. That sticky fly paper that you can hang from the ceiling could be a source of sticky stuff to put near a bright purple plastic bottle. Or you could put your vegemite lure inside a purple plastic bottle to give it an even stronger allure. If, despite high levels of fly infestation, you are managing to trap few females, perhaps they are hatching earlier than you allow for, or perhaps the protein source or the Winter refuge for the flies is in a new location where they are now hatching nearer to a source of protein than to your traps? Thus they never pass by your lure, at least, not until they have mated and are scoping out your back garden for some fruit in which to deposit their eggs. It does seem counter-intuitive, but instead of hanging female traps all around your own garden, maybe you need to search for that person in the neighbourhood who is allowing fallen fruit to rot on the ground and ask may you hang a few hundred female traps throughout their backyard instead of yours during Spring and Summer?! Good luck with your Spring trapping! Maybe there's a market for the pelts? BTW, do you still have your eco-friendly "enviro throne" there Len? -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#18
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
g'day john,
hope you are well? a lot in your psot but that is how it is with those of us attempting to find ways of managing female fruit flies. i ave the understanding the female hatches when conditions are humid enough and warm enough, our star fruit indicaes that we are trapping male flies in low numbers of course it is not season yet but have had no female damaged fruit. naturelure is the one that contains spinosid or whatever it is called no good for bees, and as i understand it those who use it, it needs to be sprayed around the plant but not on the fruit, some fix yellow buckets to the fence and spray it in there as well, have not heard of huge success with it and it is expensive, and again as far as i know doesn't work as in a trap scenerio. i have had many chats with those using the product and they concur that it won't work in a trap dack pot situation. asfor attracting females into teh male trap and holding them mmm dunno? the attractant in the male trap is a female pheromone mock so unless the animal kingdom has become liberted then it doesn't attract females,and the male trap as i see it needs to be somewhat open to allow the aroma to float in the breeze which it does extremely well. yes colours are often used i tried some sticky boards which caught a small number of female fruit fly but trapped lots of other flying bugs which are harmless in the garden and could be beneficial, also the ones we bought online were made of cardboard so the action of the wind caused them to tear and then the rain did as well, but all in all they where of no success as we still lost nearly all our fruit. we tried with blue and yellow tape around the bottles near the entrances with no result obviously the coloured boards worked but not that well with f/f. so right! db's expert says about the protein he should know hey? that is probably the crux of my issue the flies are not hatchng in my garden, they are hatching in some other garden where the gardener has very poor husbandry. so by the time the fly gets here she has fed and is primed to mate or already mated, that make sense. what he calls protein i dunno but guess it is derived from flowers of plants, always flowers somewhere always in our garden. wdon't see hordes of females just one or 2 hear and there. maybe i'm looking in the wrong area but how often can a female mate and lay eggs is this a one up affair or does she persist all season? seems that way as the male fly population would have to be low to say teh least. in the past those recipes we have featured have worked so much so we at least got 50% or thereabouts of our crop without the effort of netting. that may be because then our next door friendly neighbour had guava's that he allowed us to pick all immature fruit from and destroy it, but unfriendly one had mango trees where all fruit eventually ended upon the ground if the fruit bats didn't eat it, so guess then on what d.b's expert said the female came right to our garden for protein and fell fould of the traps. so no aswers or help there for us and others like us as we have no idea which gardener is infesting the area with the fly? we have been here 5 years and up until 3 years ago our trap the male program was delivering acceptable resuls then it all went haywire like someone had planted a guava that came into fruit and became the population point for the fly, my understanding that could be up to 4k away as the crow flies. so the nets will be out soon now as the tom plants are growing great guns already needing tying. we got good fruit of the star fruit because miraculously it fruited over autumn/winter and is still going hope that keeps going as we then don't need to find a net for that tree. or pick and dump all fruit when green. sadly no we don't have our earth friendly throne, will set up a humanure bucket if and when i can even if only for my persoannal use modern mcmansions don't lend themselves to the versatility to allow those who live in them much leeway for being responsible for ones own waste. westill recycle much other rottable stuff into or growing areas, keeps the land fill bin low in content. still promote that responsibility though. we use nearly all water at least twice. anyhow good chat if you learn something about these dreaded females let us know i will pass i around where i hang out. On Sun, 29 Aug 2010 07:45:25 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#19
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
so right! db's expert says about the protein he should know hey? that is probably the crux of my issue the flies are not hatchng in my garden, they are hatching in some other garden where the gardener has very poor husbandry. so by the time the fly gets here she has fed and is primed to mate or already mated, that make sense. what he calls protein i dunno but guess it is derived from flowers of plants, always flowers somewhere always in our garden. wdon't see hordes of females just one or 2 hear and there. My understanding of protien is anything that is high in nitrogen. Is why i suggested using some fresh manure. Put it in a clear plastic bottle drill plenty of holes about half way up add some water and hang it in the trees or around your perimeter. The ponk will have mainly females attracted to it. You can make the holes small enough to keep most blowies out. But it doesn't really matter as flies will drown in the liquid and cause there own ponk attracting more victims. You do have to top up the water as it will evaporate. You may have to empty the bottles or renew as they can fill up quick. I notice in summer that dog poo not only attracts blowflys but also fruitflies in large numbers. So if you have horses, cattle, sheep, goats, chickens etc etc close by guaranteed the female fruitfly is having a good feed. I was catching mediterranian fruitfly as it is our pest here in WA. But the numbers were so high that the traps didn't stop damage to the fruit on my mandarine which i pulled out. Perhaps you would have better luck as you are tackling the male fruitfly as well. maybe i'm looking in the wrong area but how often can a female mate and lay eggs is this a one up affair or does she persist all season? seems that way as the male fly population would have to be low to say teh least. in the past those recipes we have featured have worked so much so we at least got 50% or thereabouts of our crop without the effort of netting. that may be because then our next door friendly neighbour had guava's that he allowed us to pick all immature fruit from and destroy it, but unfriendly one had mango trees where all fruit eventually ended upon the ground if the fruit bats didn't eat it, so guess then on what d.b's expert said the female came right to our garden for protein and fell fould of the traps. so no aswers or help there for us and others like us as we have no idea which gardener is infesting the area with the fly? we have been here 5 years and up until 3 years ago our trap the male program was delivering acceptable resuls then it all went haywire like someone had planted a guava that came into fruit and became the population point for the fly, my understanding that could be up to 4k away as the crow flies. so the nets will be out soon now as the tom plants are growing great guns already needing tying. we got good fruit of the star fruit because miraculously it fruited over autumn/winter and is still going hope that keeps going as we then don't need to find a net for that tree. or pick and dump all fruit when green. sadly no we don't have our earth friendly throne, will set up a humanure bucket if and when i can even if only for my persoannal use modern mcmansions don't lend themselves to the versatility to allow those who live in them much leeway for being responsible for ones own waste. westill recycle much other rottable stuff into or growing areas, keeps the land fill bin low in content. still promote that responsibility though. we use nearly all water at least twice. anyhow good chat if you learn something about these dreaded females let us know i will pass i around where i hang out. On Sun, 29 Aug 2010 07:45:25 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#20
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
gardenlen writes:
g'day john, hope you are well? Very well, Len, thanks for asking. a lot in your psot but that is how it is with those of us attempting to find ways of managing female fruit flies. i ave the understanding the female hatches when conditions are humid enough and warm enough, our star fruit indicaes that we are trapping male flies in low numbers of course it is not season yet but have had no female damaged fruit. Females emerged early beginning mid-Aug in 2009, researcher reports it was a bad year for fruitfly, so can't rely on the calendar. There is a lively fruitfly forum, with posts going back to 2007, on the Daley's Fruit site, http://www.daleysfruit.com.au/forum/fruit-fly-control/ You may already be following it, judging by some of the details you wrote in an earlier post. Though you haven't mentioned the lure based on women's urine. Not yet. :-) I did a bit of reading. Yes, the female mates only once in her life. She lays her first brood of eggs about 5 days after the protein meal. The protein she feeds on comes from common plant sources. (I guess pollen is a protein, isn't it?) She usually meets her mate in the same host she will lay her eggs and feeds on that plant's sap or secretions. It's not clear whether "same host" means the same species, or some specific individual tree. Neither seems quite logical to me, considering her lifetime extends over many weeks. The flies don't like open spaces, so set traps in shade against foliage. The females are reluctant to go into traps with small entrance holes, so you can't provide your trap with small holes in the hope of excluding bigger harmless insects; you won't get any female fruit flies either. If you manage to trap most of the males in an area, the female when she finds none around will fly off to another area in search of males. (But it didn't say she won't then return to her original bithplace to lay her eggs. I think she can lay 700 in her lifetime.) Anyone who has used nets seems to have had spectacular success, and it probably excludes many of the smaller birds, too. Maybe other pests, also? Nets would give you more peace of mind, too. Adults can sit around all winter, biding their time until the first sign of Spring. Except in cold climates where they die off and the population has to reestablish from eggs that have overwintered. so the nets will be out soon now as the tom plants are growing great guns already needing tying. we got good fruit of the star fruit because miraculously it fruited over autumn/winter and is still going hope that keeps going as we then don't need to find a net for that tree. or pick and dump all fruit when green. Are the star fruit a cash crop, or just for your own consumption? The tough skin on the cherry tomates resists the efforts of the female Qld fruit fly, that's why they are usually free of fly. But if there are other species around, e.g., the Mediterranean fruit fly, the Qld frut fly will lay its eggs into the same puncture hole that the Med fruit fly made so you get a double dose of maggots in that fruit! I never did hear whether your big investment one year in garlic paid dividends? I think that was at your previous location if I'm not mistaken. -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#21
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
g'day john,
reat read thanks for tht. so female urine may work better. i usually cut 4 inverted 'V' cut a the base of the neck of the bottle large enough for a house flie to get in and they do, as there is nothing in the bottle to actually kill the insect they need to be contained until they fall into the fluid and drown, is how i see it. same as when a house fly trap is made. hanging in the shade is interesting not always possible and hanging within the plant to be protected not also suggested as the ripening fruit aroma would compete with the bottle aroma, has been sugested in the past. our male wicks bottles are away from plants actually hanging around the house on all 4 sides to catch all 4 breezes. in the past our female traps have worked. anyhow the star fruit one bush only very prolific not for cash just for food, that big garlic plant fizzled dunno why the previous crop whee msot of eh planting material came from was a boon, all times previous when i plant garlic i get good returns this time none develope into the segmented bulb we see. and since then any garlic i have planted even here has also failed lucky to get an onion shaped bulb mostly a shallot shaped thing from them. got no idea. planted around maybe 600 corms. so as best as we can do it we collect all any unusable fruits and destroy them so can safely say the fly is not hatching in our garden as their is no opportunity for the maggot to get down into the soil and cacoon over winter. with my observations on when they hatch that is based on when fruit shows signs of infestation but then i suppose eggs dn't need to hatch right away hey? don't think we have the med' fly as our cherry tom's never get infested. will visit daley's i have a topic there about our lemon tree leeking sap, but have never read any other topics. anyhow take care for now, if you learn more pass it on please. On Mon, 30 Aug 2010 16:14:59 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#22
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
g'day john,
it's amazing the applications they heve devised to apply to out fresh f&v alone, they even use a spray to cause he pineaple to fruit earlier it is a man made concoction and probably the elast harmless of applications, but the fruit isn't emerging quiet naturally is it, all designed to increase harvests. yeh never ever knew that pineapples got sunburn??? lived out moggill way when i was a kid that was pineapple and dairy territory, knew lots of pineapple farmer kids knew that crows do a lot of damage, but never ever heard anything about sunburn?? and a few weeds in the plantation didn't seem to purturb the grower or the pineapple. my view is like their brom' cousins they realy don't take that much from the soil so competition not such a worry. of course picking fruit among some healthy scotch thistle plants not the best i suppose but that is the making man comfortable part not the helping the pine grow. i used to think that the old pineaple didn't need things done but ag' science sees it differently hey? did see a doco' once where apples and pears cop up to 600 spray applications before they are picked, might not be 600 different chemiclas, most are systemic applications so peeling and washing won't ge rid of the residues not like way back when! all we ahd to do was wash a bit of pyrethrum residue off the fruit. and all this time us gardeners who grow pineapples always trying to get fruit quicker than around 18 months, and the farmer is cheeting. and also of course they have the public duped into eating immature not ripe fruit, all for better storage and transporting. citrus all treated with anti mould chem's heavy metals involved. takes a pine around 6 months to matue and ripen nicely that is a lot of money siting out there on the field hey? the quicker they pick the quicker another planting takes place. don't they get all their planting material free in the return of tops from the processor? no other farmer does. got no faith in organic all corrupt realy as the oranic farmer can use the same chemiclas but with a longer with holding period. where there is money to be made and man you get corruption. and also looking at what the big s/markets call organic it all looks the same exactly as the ordinary stuff but dearer. yeh well don is another story hey? dunno about gum trees but this citrus is suffering a tad, funny thing this tree was a seedling tree and the only citrus affected, the others all grafts. we grew it for shade which it is now providing so now we need to do all the save it, everytime i see the bit of sap we spray, oops there goes my organic illusion. On Mon, 30 Aug 2010 16:14:59 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#23
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wamly welcome
Sure all pro gamer are most welcome... if you can reach out to them it would be great!! Thanks a lot Ya it will be great if they both get active on this forum... and share their exp. with gaming... |
#24
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
"dorramide7" wrote in message ... wamly welcome Sure all pro gamer are most welcome... if you can reach out to them it would be great!! Thanks a lot Ya it will be great if they both get active on this forum... and share their exp. with gaming... Gardening you know digging holes putting seeds/plants in the holes. We do it not play it. -- dorramide7 |
#25
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
g'day john,
had this recipe out now for about 6 weeks, can't see that there are any fruit fly in them as yet plenty of other sorts offlies and ants. will empty them soon through a strainer to be sure. On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 07:42:39 +0000 (UTC), in aus.gardens you wrote On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 07:42:39 +0000 (UTC), John Savage wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#26
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
On 21/10/2010 10:46 AM, gardenlen wrote:
g'day john, had this recipe out now for about 6 weeks, can't see that there are any fruit fly in them as yet plenty of other sorts offlies and ants. will empty them soon through a strainer to be sure. On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 07:42:39 +0000 (UTC), in aus.gardens you wrote does it have to be coke as I have used a cheaper cola and nothing seems to have happened reducing the hordes of flies surrounding the dogs ears yet after 3 days O |
#27
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
dunno atec?
not my original recipe, what sort of flies are you trying to control? On Thu, 21 Oct 2010 14:46:42 +1000, atec77 wrote: On 21/10/2010 10:46 AM, gardenlen wrote: g'day john, had this recipe out now for about 6 weeks, can't see that there are any fruit fly in them as yet plenty of other sorts offlies and ants. will empty them soon through a strainer to be sure. On Sat, 21 Aug 2010 07:42:39 +0000 (UTC), in aus.gardens you wrote does it have to be coke as I have used a cheaper cola and nothing seems to have happened reducing the hordes of flies surrounding the dogs ears yet after 3 days O -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#28
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
ok, dunno how you go about trapping those ones as they need fresh
blood, but they can appear at anytime of the year, calling them march flies might be a bit misleading, they call them horse flies also. but as for trapping them if you figure something out let the gardeners know, reckon you would have to stop them at their breeding site. they seem to hang about in pairs in a territory, i find once i have squished 2 then there is no more until the next pair move in. maybe do some research on them? On Fri, 22 Oct 2010 08:15:37 +1000, atec77 wrote: snipped -- Matthew 25:13 KJV "Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh" Mark 13:33 "Take ye heed, watch and pray: for ye know not when the time is". len With peace and brightest of blessings, "Be Content With What You Have And May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In A World That You May Not Understand." http://www.lensgarden.com.au/ |
#29
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
On 23/10/2010 4:10 AM, gardenlen wrote:
ok, dunno how you go about trapping those ones as they need fresh blood, but they can appear at anytime of the year, calling them march flies might be a bit misleading, they call them horse flies also. but as for trapping them if you figure something out let the gardeners know, reckon you would have to stop them at their breeding site. they seem to hang about in pairs in a territory, i find once i have squished 2 then there is no more until the next pair move in. maybe do some research on them? I found some of those long sticky hang strips and now they hang over the dogs beds should do the trick as I rather want to get the wounds healed |
#30
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the lure of Coca Cola .....
gardenlen writes:
had this recipe out now for about 6 weeks, can't see that there are any fruit fly in them as yet plenty of other sorts offlies and ants. will empty them soon through a strainer to be sure. I shall have a stern word with Vasili, in that case. Have you got any lures baited with your own recipe, for comparison? Week before last's ABC gardening program showed the use of cloth bags around individual fruit, to protect from fruit flies (also from birds, possums, and sunburn). It resembled that waterproof material that you can get as an inner cover for pillows, and which comes as a wrapping for some electronics goods. A finely woven cloth, nothing like plastic, and too strong to tear. He used it for his figs. (Once they reached a good size, I guess, so that they had already been pollinated.) -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
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