My first post was a little incoherent (like any of them *aren't*!).

I was trying to say that dormancy is triggered in fall by photoperiod. So once trees go dormant, nothing will wake them up- light, warmth, it doesn't matter- for a while. Of course, tree roots do not undergo true dormancy, and will grow and function when
ever it's warm enough, but without dormancy there will not be that "flush" of root growth that bonsai people depend on in the spring. A dormant tree that's kept in warm conditions will eventually break bud- irregularly- and the tree will wake up in an unc
oordinated fashion. That's not terrible, except for trees like apples, which depend on a coordinated budbreak in order for their flowers to be pollinated. It's really a problem if budbreak occurs too early, and the new growth gets killed by cold. As I m
entioned before, this happens every few years, and trees generally can take a few years of this before getting stressed. After that, you will see an increase in disease and insect damage, and trees may die.

The point is that in an ordinary year, a shed is a perfectly fine place to store bonsai, even if it gets warm in the shed from time to time. This year, we're experiencing a strange warm period JUST as trees have probably gotten enough cold to allow them t
o break dormancy. So it's only now that being in the shed is an issue. My trees, outside, are experiencing highs in the 50's, while your trees, Mark, are probably experiencing temperatures in the 60's. If they are breaking dormancy, there isn't much you
can do about it. Keeping them cool will slow the growth of the young leaves, but won't stop them. And they don't have the same cold hardiness as buds, so future cold spells may kill them.

People who use cold frames have the same dilemma; the structure that has protected plants in the earlier half of the winter becomes a problem on sunny days when the cold frame heats up and the plants break dormancy prematurely. That's why many cold frames
have automatic window-openers that crack open the cold frame in warm weather. And that's why a blanket of snow is such a useful thing when you are trying to overwinter plants.

So anyway, I didn't mean to give the impression that you were wrong to put them in the shed. The problem here is the weather!

Nina.

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Nina Shishkoff wrote:

snip

The point is that in an ordinary year, a shed is a perfectly fine place to store bonsai, even if it gets warm in the shed from time to time. This year, we're experiencing a strange warm period JUST as trees have probably gotten enough cold to allow them
to break dormancy. So it's only now that being in the shed is an issue. My trees, outside, are experiencing highs in the 50's, while your trees, Mark, are probably experiencing temperatures in the 60's.

snip

People who use cold frames have the same dilemma; the structure that has protected plants in the earlier half of the winter becomes a problem on sunny days when the cold frame heats up and the plants break dormancy prematurely. That's why many cold fram
es have automatic window-openers that crack open the cold frame in warm weather. And that's why a blanket of snow is such a useful thing when you are trying to overwinter plants.
snip

I found snow to be an excellent insulator in Maine. It also protected trees from wind.


Nina.

This is exactly why I keep mine outdoors. That way nothing artificially raises the temperature in their environment.

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

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I found snow to be an excellent insulator in Maine. It also protected trees from wind.

Yeah, I'll bet it is.... in Maine! But in the 10+ years I lived on Long Island, we never had a snowcover... we barely had snow! And now in Maryland, I have only a passing acquaintance with snow (particularly this week!). It makes it very difficult to ke
ep trees from suffering spring die-back. In fact, on Long Island, most of the nursery problems we saw in the lab in early spring were related to early warm periods or late freezes. When nursery owners protected their plants in plastic houses, the problem
s were, if anything, worse.

This is exactly why I keep mine outdoors. That way nothing artificially raises the temperature in their environment.

I used to keep tender plants in the cold frame, but just plain gave up. Now I mulch tender plants and protect them from wind, and otherwise tell them "see ya in spring, pal."

Nina Shishkoff


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Craig;

Unfortunately, the only snow around here is being artificially produced by
Ski Roundtop!
Even they're having trouble keeping snow on the slopes because the temps
haven't fallen below freezing in weeks.
Last night it dropped all the way to 41 !!

Mark


Craig wrote:

I found snow to be an excellent insulator in Maine. It also protected trees
from wind.

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Mark Hill wrote:

Craig;

Unfortunately, the only snow around here is being artificially produced by
Ski Roundtop!
Even they're having trouble keeping snow on the slopes because the temps
haven't fallen below freezing in weeks.
Last night it dropped all the way to 41 !!

Mark

Craig wrote:

I found snow to be an excellent insulator in Maine. It also protected trees
from wind.


Same problem here. Not even any ski areas. I have the trees mulched with leaves
though, but by this point everything is thawed out. For those who have consistent
snow, they're lucky.

Temp here today os 40F. It gets below freezing at night generally.

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

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(Nina Shishkoff) wrote:

but without dormancy there will not be that "flush" of root growth that bonsai people depend on in the spring.

Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?


Eric

The flush of root growth allows us to lift garden plants, trees from the
wild or our bonsai, root prune them and expect their survival.

Cheers

Kev Bailey
Vale Of Clwyd, North Wales




Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?


Eric



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The flush of root growth allows us to lift garden plants, trees from the
wild or our bonsai, root prune them and expect their survival.

Cheers

Kev Bailey
Vale Of Clwyd, North Wales




Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?


Eric



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-----Original Message-----

(Nina Shishkoff) wrote:

but without dormancy there will not be that "flush" of root growth that bonsai people depend on in the spring.

Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?

Eric

Because all of us repot in spring just before budbreak. Why do we do that? Because we know the plants will recover quickly. Why do they recover quickly? Because of the flush of root growth.

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-----Original Message-----

(Nina Shishkoff) wrote:

but without dormancy there will not be that "flush" of root growth that bonsai people depend on in the spring.

Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?

Eric

Because all of us repot in spring just before budbreak. Why do we do that? Because we know the plants will recover quickly. Why do they recover quickly? Because of the flush of root growth.

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++++Sponsored, in part, by Jarbas Godoy ++++
************************************************** ******************************
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

The flush of root growth allows us to lift garden plants, trees from the
wild or our bonsai, root prune them and expect their survival.

Cheers

Kev Bailey
Vale Of Clwyd, North Wales




Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?


Eric



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-----Original Message-----

(Nina Shishkoff) wrote:

but without dormancy there will not be that "flush" of root growth that bonsai people depend on in the spring.

Why is that flush of root growth beneficial in bonsai?

Eric

Because all of us repot in spring just before budbreak. Why do we do that? Because we know the plants will recover quickly. Why do they recover quickly? Because of the flush of root growth.

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Kevin:

The flush of root growth allows us to lift garden plants, trees from the
wild or our bonsai, root prune them and expect their survival.

Thanks! That makes sense.


Eric