phorbin expounded:


We are as you say, "supposed to be adults here." Adults are polite.

Not nice, just polite. That way he can call you anything he likes, as
long as he couches it in 'polite' terms.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

What then does organic bee keeping mean, if the product isn't organic?
Is 8,000 acres a legal definition or hyperbole?

No, it's not hyperbole, Billy. That's the radius a honeybee will
forage within.

Organic beekeeping means putting nothing in the hive but the honeybee
and comb and managing all of the pests/problems organically.

OK. I'll google my questions.

Hoping to find something to disprove me? Knock yourself out.

I wonder if your googling will lead you here?
http://www.beesource.com/pov/organic/nosb.htm

Then again, I suppose that's totally discredited because I posted it.

I understand that there is a whole "freak" of paranoids out lookin' for
you. Good luck with that.

Meantime I came up with:

http://www.dutchgoldhoney.com/store/info.asp

What Makes Honey Organic?

At the Bee Yard:

Organic honey must come from organic bees. Hives that have existing
honey in them are forbidden to become organic. Organic honey must be
produced from naturally foraging bee colonies that are located at least
2 miles (straight-line flight) from any source that could cause the
honey to contain pesticides or herbicides. Within this 2 mile radius no
pesticides or herbicides may be used, and must not have had any chemical
application in the previous 3 years. Feeding of bees is prohibited. If
feeding is necessary to prevent starvation, the honey produced is not
organic.

(Note: A circle with an area of 8,000 acres [square or not] has a
radius, to two places, of 3.2 km or 10,534.75 feet. Yeah, yeah, I know,
the last four digits are noise and the 5 in the third place should have
be rounded up. I'm off the clock, OK?)

Hives need to have all of their parts (supers, queen excluders, etc.)
numbered to prevent accidental use in non organic hives. All hive parts
must be made of wood. Comb foundations must be made from organic beeswax.

The extraction facility must be certified organic.

All organic honey must be certified by an approved organic certifying
agency. The USDA's NOP program (National Organic Program) certifies the
agencies. Dutch Gold and McLure's are certified by PCO (Pennsylvania
Certified Organic) who inspects our facilities on behalf of the USDA.
Dutch Gold only accepts honey from areas that are certified organic by
an NOP approved certifier; furthermore the certifier must have
physically visited the organic producing area.

http://www.theorganicreport.com/page...anic_honey.cfm

According to USDA regulations, honey cannot be labeled certified organic
if its production uses even traces of prohibited chemicals, drugs or
antibiotics. Non-organic beekeepers routinely use sulfa compounds and
antibiotics to control bee diseases, carbolic acid to remove honey from
the hive and calcium cyanide to kill colonies before extracting the
honey?, and of course conventional honeybees gather nectar from plants
that have been sprayed with pesticides. The Lancet, a prestigious
international medical journal, reported in 1993 that conventionally
produced honey may contain residues of these chemicals and should be
used with caution?, which is one of the reasons many of us jump for joy
when we find a reliable source of certified organic honey.

http://www.ysorganic.com/organic.html


Organic bee colonies are not maintained with the use of any chemicals!

Terramycin for treating foulbrood disease,

Apistan for Verroa mites,

GardStar for treating small hive beetles, nor

Bee Go to chase bees instead of using a smoker.

We meet all the standards of Organic Certification including: GMO Free,
Land Certification, Beehives Certification, Producer Certification,
Processor Certification.
--------

I gave a cursory look at the site you posted Ann (still with us?)
http://www.beesource.com/pov/organic/nosb.htm and it looks like the site
I was looking for. Thanks. (Now try and figure out what I meant by that.)

Another case solved Kato, my little friend. To all of our readers, I
want to wish you 'appiness;-)
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

In article wildbilly-677194.07523424022008@c-61-68-245-
199.per.connect.net.au, says...
In article ,
phorbin wrote:

In article wildbilly-B9A4F7.22235423022008@c-61-68-245-
199.per.connect.net.au, says...
In article ,
phorbin wrote:

In article wildbilly-DF7F20.17515223022008@c-61-68-245-
199.per.connect.net.au, says...
In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

I am curious, though, in producing organic honey, how do you get a
bee
to go just to organic flowers?

You can manage your bees organically, but you really can't claim to
provide organic honey. Unless you're in the middle of 8,000 square
acres.

What then does organic bee keeping mean, if the product isn't organic?

It starts with not forcing the bees to grow unnaturally large. The rest
amounts to philosophy of maintenance and the substances used for
maintenance.
What is unnaturally large and what is the philosophy? Why do you respond
to a question that you do not answer?


Is 8,000 acres a legal definition or hyperbole?


It's not hyperbole. Bees will travel substantial distances.
What, you nitwit, is substantial? Do you mean 10,534.75 feet? I asked a
specific question. Do you have a specific answer? Next time get your
caca together before you respond, or don't respond if you don't know
what the freak you're talking about. We are supposed to be adults here.
I'm not your babysitter.

My memory was prompting 4 miles or more for long-range foraging (as the
bee flies) depending on the investment-return to the hive. It was late
in my day and I was fading quickly.
I asked for specific information, not the way you felt about it or
excuses. What was the question anyway? Do you remember or don't you read
so good?

With your attitude, you're not worth time or trouble.

Killfiled as a Troll.



Is 8,000 acres a legal definition (for the production of organic honey)
or hyperbole?

Billy expounded:

(still with us?)

Never with you, buddy.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

(still with us?)

Never with you, buddy.

That's one nasty 'tude you got on you girl.
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

In article ,
says...
phorbin expounded:


We are as you say, "supposed to be adults here." Adults are polite.

Not nice, just polite. That way he can call you anything he likes, as
long as he couches it in 'polite' terms.


That is the measure of it :-)

I've been around networks for 24 or so years. I've seen it all and said
some of it in my testier moments.

I stick to who and what interests me these days and summarily bin the
rest. The rule-set of my newsreader allows me very flexible and indepth
ways of binning the rest.

Bees and beekeeping interest me.

Billy expounded:

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

(still with us?)

Never with you, buddy.

That's one nasty 'tude you got on you girl.

You've earned every drop of it, Billy.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

(still with us?)

Never with you, buddy.

That's one nasty 'tude you got on you girl.

You've earned every drop of it, Billy.

That's the grace I've come to expect of you. Now if you could just do
something about that smell of burning martyr.
Psst: George Bush

--
Bush Behind Bars

Billy
http://angryarab.blogspot.com/

On Feb 24, 8:15 am, phorbin wrote:
In article wildbilly-B9A4F7.22235423022008@c-61-68-245-
199.per.connect.net.au, says...



In article ,
phorbin wrote:

In article wildbilly-DF7F20.17515223022008@c-61-68-245-
199.per.connect.net.au, says...
In article ,
Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

I am curious, though, in producing organic honey, how do you get a bee
to go just to organic flowers?

You can manage your bees organically, but you really can't claim to
provide organic honey. Unless you're in the middle of 8,000 square
acres.

What then does organic bee keeping mean, if the product isn't organic?

It starts with not forcing the bees to grow unnaturally large. The rest
amounts to philosophy of maintenance and the substances used for
maintenance.
What is unnaturally large and what is the philosophy? Why do you respond
to a question that you do not answer?

Is 8,000 acres a legal definition or hyperbole?

It's not hyperbole. Bees will travel substantial distances.
What, you nitwit, is substantial? Do you mean 10,534.75 feet? I asked a
specific question. Do you have a specific answer? Next time get your
caca together before you respond, or don't respond if you don't know
what the freak you're talking about. We are supposed to be adults here.
I'm not your babysitter.

My memory was prompting 4 miles or more for long-range foraging (as the
bee flies) depending on the investment-return to the hive. It was late
in my day and I was fading quickly.

Relevant numbers are published on the net within easy reach. Imperial
metric converters are all over the place.

So FWIWhttp://www.lasi.group.shef.ac.uk/pdf/brfuncecol2000.pdfhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forage_(honeybee)

... and if you don't like my answers, or you don't like my on-line
persona your killfile is a button away. And to not put too fine a point
on it, so's mine.

We are as you say, "supposed to be adults here." Adults are polite.

He doesn't have to be; he owns the site.
His self-righteousness has burned him out. He becomes a pathetic nit-
picker who, when asked "what time is it", ties you to a tree and
explains how to build a clock.
Politics he doesn't like have poisoned his soul -- assuming there was
one there to begin with.
He has an extensive and well-rounded knowledge of gardens and
gardening, but thinks that he is the only person who does -- or that
he is the only one who can express such.

I wish I had known him when he was a happier person.

cheers

oz, getting damn sick and tired of ice storms

Jangchub expounded:

Unfortunately bees travel up to two miles for pollen and since clover
is starting to dissappear rapidly as we make McMansions everywhere,
the bees are in peril. The only way to insure organic honey is to
have an enclosure for the bees which are making the honey. It's so
sad what's happening to bees. Soon there will be none and goodbye
food.

Yes, it is sad, however, there are many beekeepers out there trying
really hard to figure it all out and ensure that the bees continue. It
is a complex problem with many angles - one thing that rings true
throughout all of this mess is our bees are like the canary in a coal
mine - their ailments are trying to tell us something! I'm beginning
to have just a glimmer of hope that the tide is ever so gradually
turning.....I hope it turns before it's too late.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

In article ,
Jangchub wrote:

On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 08:53:42 -0500, Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

Look, I only asked what makes organic honey, OK. Secondly, we have been
plagued with nitwits who either say that they don't know the answer to a
problem but they are too busy with school anyway, or we have newbies who
want to start a garden but don't say what kind of plants they want to
grow and don't tell us what USDA zone that they live in. Thirdly, we
have "old timers" who have a personal, political, axes to grind, or we
have people who are disjointed because they have been ridiculed for
being supporters of total disasters like Dixie Ray Lee. Enough already.

Gentelmen, gentelwomen, can we garden now?
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

Billy expounded:

In article ,
Jangchub wrote:

On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 08:53:42 -0500, Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

Look, I only asked what makes organic honey,

And you were answered.

OK. Secondly, we have been
plagued with nitwits who either say that they don't know the answer to a
problem but they are too busy with school anyway, or we have newbies who
want to start a garden but don't say what kind of plants they want to
grow and don't tell us what USDA zone that they live in.

So, that justifies your nastiness?

Thirdly, we
have "old timers" who have a personal, political, axes to grind,

You're the poster child for political axes to grind. No one brings up
their politics more than you.

or we have people who are disjointed because they have been ridiculed for
being supporters of total disasters like Dixie Ray Lee. Enough already.

That's right, enough already, Billy.

Gentelmen, gentelwomen, can we garden now?

It would be great if you'd start, instead of constantly demonstrated
what a bitter, nasty little creature you've become.
--
Ann, gardening in Zone 6a
South of Boston, Massachusetts
e-mail address is not checked
******************************

Hi All.
People have been keeping bees for years. Why the sudden craze for organic
honey. Honey has been produced for years, it has been eaten bfore the
organic craze came about, and no one has been ill. it has been found in a
tomb in Egypt and was found to be still edbile. Honey is an antiseptic any
way, so what is all the fuss about.

Richard M. Watkin


"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jangchub wrote:

On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 08:53:42 -0500, Ann wrote:

Billy expounded:

Look, I only asked what makes organic honey, OK. Secondly, we have been
plagued with nitwits who either say that they don't know the answer to a
problem but they are too busy with school anyway, or we have newbies who
want to start a garden but don't say what kind of plants they want to
grow and don't tell us what USDA zone that they live in. Thirdly, we
have "old timers" who have a personal, political, axes to grind, or we
have people who are disjointed because they have been ridiculed for
being supporters of total disasters like Dixie Ray Lee. Enough already.

Gentelmen, gentelwomen, can we garden now?
--

Billy

Bush, Cheney & Pelosi, Behind Bars
http://rachelcorriefoundation.org/site/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Movemen...George_W._Bush

Jangchub wrote in
:

Without his bees, the blueberries in Maine would not exist.
This problem is much more serious than we know. Imagine,
a business which hauls bees across the country to rent to
farmers. That's a sign and it ain't good.

bee hauling has been around since post WWII, at least. it may
also be one of the vectors for hive collapse.

one the brighter side, honey bees are not the only type of
bees, nor the only pollenators of food crops.
lee
--
Last night while sitting in my chair
I pinged a host that wasn't there
It wasn't there again today
The host resolved to NSA.

In article
,
Billy wrote:

Gentelmen, gentelwomen, can we garden now?
--

Billy

I'm game. ;-)

Gotta weed tho' and get stuff prepared.
I'm always concerned about the oft' present late March freeze tho'.
--
Peace, Om
Remove underscore to validate gmails.

"Politics is supposed to be the second oldest profession. I have
come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
-- Mark Twain