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Old 01-05-2009, 02:27 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the type
of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they all
claim to be the best.




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Old 01-05-2009, 02:43 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

In article ,
"Andy Petro" wrote:

I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the type
of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they all
claim to be the best.



http://www.ext.vt.edu/departments/en...ertilizer/jan8
9pr6.html

Last paragraph critical.

Bill

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

Not all who wander are lost.
- J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973)







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Old 01-05-2009, 03:54 AM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

In article ,
"Andy Petro" wrote:

I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the type
of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they all
claim to be the best.


A soil test (about $15 give or take from your county extension) is the
best way to know "What to use" and "How much". Otherwise one can only
guess and hope for the best. Tomatoes like a pH 6.4 give or take 0.4.

One could go with shovels of compost around the plant two or three times
for the season. Compost also varies from place to place.

Too much nitrogen may give you all nice looking vines and no fruits.
So follow the instructions on the bags. N-P-K = Up-Down-and All Around.

Enjoy Life ... Dan

--
Garden in Zone 5 South East Michigan.
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Old 01-05-2009, 01:00 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

Andy Petro said:


I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the
type of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they
all claim to be the best.


I would recommend first that you get a soil test. That will tell you which
plant nutrients your soil has plenty of, and which might be in critically
short supply. And I would encourage the use of organic fertilizers and
compost, especially if your soil is poorly textured and low in humus.

For instance, my soil has a lot of phosphorus and is critically short of
potassium. It's very sandy, and potassium is a nutrient that is prone to
leaching, while phophorous is not. My main requirement each season
is to supply nitrogen, potassium, and additional organic material.
(I made a heavy application of greensand a number of years ago; it is a
*very* slow release source of potassium and micronutrients.)

My typical fertilization scheme is to sift alfalfa pellets and compost
into the top of the soil (a week or so before planting), and to use
kelp spray occasionally during the growing season. Alfalfa supplies
nitrogen and some potassium, and the kelp spray potassium and
micronutrients.

This suffices for everything I plant, with a couple of exceptions:
--Tomatoes, eggplants and peppers get a handful of Tomato Tone when I
plant.
--Corn will get a side dressing of blood meal or some other source of
nitrogen before it begins to tassle.


You can build up your soil bank of phosphorus (if that's a problem
nutrient for you) with rock phoshate or bone meal.

Calcium is another important nutrient. The soil testing service should
give recommendations for calcium ammendment based on soil pH and
other micronutrients. They might recommend gypsum or calcitic
limestone, depending on your soil pH. (Dolomitic limestone might
be recommended if your soil is also low in magnesium.)

You've already got one good link from another responder.

Here's another link (it is a commercial site, but the info appears to be
good, and well organized):

http://www.extremelygreen.com/fertilizerguide.cfm

--
Pat in Plymouth MI

"So, it was all a dream."
"No dear, this is the dream, you're still in the cell."

email valid but not regularly monitored


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Old 01-05-2009, 08:57 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

In article ,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

Andy Petro said:


I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the
type of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they
all claim to be the best.


I would recommend first that you get a soil test. That will tell you which
plant nutrients your soil has plenty of, and which might be in critically
short supply. And I would encourage the use of organic fertilizers and
compost, especially if your soil is poorly textured and low in humus.

For instance, my soil has a lot of phosphorus and is critically short of
potassium. It's very sandy, and potassium is a nutrient that is prone to
leaching, while phophorous is not. My main requirement each season
is to supply nitrogen, potassium, and additional organic material.
(I made a heavy application of greensand a number of years ago; it is a
*very* slow release source of potassium and micronutrients.)

My typical fertilization scheme is to sift alfalfa pellets and compost
into the top of the soil (a week or so before planting), and to use
kelp spray occasionally during the growing season. Alfalfa supplies
nitrogen and some potassium, and the kelp spray potassium and
micronutrients.

This suffices for everything I plant, with a couple of exceptions:
--Tomatoes, eggplants and peppers get a handful of Tomato Tone when I
plant.
--Corn will get a side dressing of blood meal or some other source of
nitrogen before it begins to tassle.


You can build up your soil bank of phosphorus (if that's a problem
nutrient for you) with rock phoshate or bone meal.

Calcium is another important nutrient. The soil testing service should
give recommendations for calcium ammendment based on soil pH and
other micronutrients. They might recommend gypsum or calcitic
limestone, depending on your soil pH. (Dolomitic limestone might
be recommended if your soil is also low in magnesium.)

You've already got one good link from another responder.

Here's another link (it is a commercial site, but the info appears to be
good, and well organized):

http://www.extremelygreen.com/fertilizerguide.cfm


Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Pat, why don't you augment your soil with clay (approx.. 20%) and
add some charcoal?

I'm very pleased with my reclamation efforts on rock and clay soil but
I've added sand, organic material, manure, and try to grow cover crops
after the garden is played out.
--

- Billy
"For the first time in the history of the world, every human being
is now subjected to contact with dangerous chemicals, from the
moment of conception until death." - Rachel Carson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WI29wVQN8Go

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1072040.html


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Old 02-05-2009, 01:21 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Default Fertilizer to use

Billy said:


In article ,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

snip a lot

Here's another link (it is a commercial site, but the info appears to be
good, and well organized):

http://www.extremelygreen.com/fertilizerguide.cfm


Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Pat, why don't you augment your soil with clay (approx.. 20%) and
add some charcoal?


Everything that goes to the garden has to be hand trucked/barrowed
to the way back. I have a long, long, very narrow lot. How the would
I be able to get clay in a clean, spreadable form and move it back there?

In my old place, with a clay-based soil, I was able to have someone
with a large dump truck back right up to the garden an dump 7 yards
of mushroom compost on it. (This was 30 years ago or more and
it was cheap; basically had for the price of hauling! *sigh* Much
more competition for the good stuff now.)


--
Pat in Plymouth MI

"So, it was all a dream."
"No dear, this is the dream, you're still in the cell."

email valid but not regularly monitored


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Old 02-05-2009, 11:01 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 1,179
Default Fertilizer to use

In article
,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

Billy said:


In article ,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

snip a lot

Here's another link (it is a commercial site, but the info appears to be
good, and well organized):

http://www.extremelygreen.com/fertilizerguide.cfm


Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Pat, why don't you augment your soil with clay (approx.. 20%) and
add some charcoal?


Everything that goes to the garden has to be hand trucked/barrowed
to the way back. I have a long, long, very narrow lot. How the would
I be able to get clay in a clean, spreadable form and move it back there?

In my old place, with a clay-based soil, I was able to have someone
with a large dump truck back right up to the garden an dump 7 yards
of mushroom compost on it. (This was 30 years ago or more and
it was cheap; basically had for the price of hauling! *sigh* Much
more competition for the good stuff now.)


I know you've been doing gardening longer than I have, so I won't preach
about the benefits of 10 - 20% clay in garden soil.

No day laborers where you live? It would be expensive to have
wheelbarrowed and dug in, but it would be a onetime expenditure and your
garden would hold nutrients longer. I'm on S.S. now, but only a couple
years back I would schlep in a small truck (Datsun) load of pummace, or
sand, or manure. Shovel it over my fence from the road into a pile, and
then distribute it around the hillside with a wheelbarrow (wheezing all
the while). I would take my time and do it as I could.

Since I started with clay, now I only need to grow cover crops (rye and
clover), and mulch with alfalfa to keep the worms and the soil happy.

Now I need to address another of my faux pas (I'm sure you know the
English translation for this;O)

Ol' alligator mouth Billy said:
Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Tomatoes and peppers need a good jolt of nitrogen
and phosphate when they begin to flower. Melons are the same but they
can also benefit from side dressing when they start to "run".

UC Davis recommends 3 -4 tons of chicken manure per acre before planting
and side dressed with the same at flowering.

http://www.sfc.ucdavis.edu/Research/chili.html
Fertilization:
Chicken manure (three to four tons per acre) is custom applied a week or
more prior to listing.
--------
100 sq.ft. = 0.0022956841 acre.
8,000#/acre = 18.37#/ 100 sq.ft. Side dress with 18.37#/ 100 sq.ft.

Chicken Manure N - P - K: 1.1 - .8 - .5
100 lbs of chicken manure gives 1.1 lb of nitrogen

For side dressing, I'm planning on encircling my plants with chicken
manure and then mulching over the side dressing.

http://extension.usu.edu/files/publi...HG_2004-07.pdf
Recommends side dressing before flowering on cucumbers.
Anybody else?

Buddha, I wish it would stop raining (
--

- Billy
"For the first time in the history of the world, every human being
is now subjected to contact with dangerous chemicals, from the
moment of conception until death." - Rachel Carson

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WI29wVQN8Go

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1072040.html
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Old 02-05-2009, 11:14 PM posted to rec.gardens.edible
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Posts: 1,096
Default Fertilizer to use

In article
,
Billy wrote:

In article
,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

Billy said:


In article ,
Pat Kiewicz wrote:

snip a lot

Here's another link (it is a commercial site, but the info appears to be
good, and well organized):

http://www.extremelygreen.com/fertilizerguide.cfm

Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Pat, why don't you augment your soil with clay (approx.. 20%) and
add some charcoal?


Everything that goes to the garden has to be hand trucked/barrowed
to the way back. I have a long, long, very narrow lot. How the would
I be able to get clay in a clean, spreadable form and move it back there?

In my old place, with a clay-based soil, I was able to have someone
with a large dump truck back right up to the garden an dump 7 yards
of mushroom compost on it. (This was 30 years ago or more and
it was cheap; basically had for the price of hauling! *sigh* Much
more competition for the good stuff now.)


I know you've been doing gardening longer than I have, so I won't preach
about the benefits of 10 - 20% clay in garden soil.

No day laborers where you live? It would be expensive to have
wheelbarrowed and dug in, but it would be a onetime expenditure and your
garden would hold nutrients longer. I'm on S.S. now, but only a couple
years back I would schlep in a small truck (Datsun) load of pummace, or
sand, or manure. Shovel it over my fence from the road into a pile, and
then distribute it around the hillside with a wheelbarrow (wheezing all
the while). I would take my time and do it as I could.

Since I started with clay, now I only need to grow cover crops (rye and
clover), and mulch with alfalfa to keep the worms and the soil happy.

Now I need to address another of my faux pas (I'm sure you know the
English translation for this;O)

Ol' alligator mouth Billy said:
Good advice. I might recommend just plain ol' fish emulsion. Apparently
these plants need some nitrogen, even after they flower, although that
is when the potassium and phosphate needs go up.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. Tomatoes and peppers need a good jolt of nitrogen
and phosphate when they begin to flower. Melons are the same but they
can also benefit from side dressing when they start to "run".

UC Davis recommends 3 -4 tons of chicken manure per acre before planting
and side dressed with the same at flowering.

http://www.sfc.ucdavis.edu/Research/chili.html
Fertilization:
Chicken manure (three to four tons per acre) is custom applied a week or
more prior to listing.
--------
100 sq.ft. = 0.0022956841 acre.
8,000#/acre = 18.37#/ 100 sq.ft. Side dress with 18.37#/ 100 sq.ft.

Chicken Manure N - P - K: 1.1 - .8 - .5
100 lbs of chicken manure gives 1.1 lb of nitrogen

For side dressing, I'm planning on encircling my plants with chicken
manure and then mulching over the side dressing.

http://extension.usu.edu/files/publi...HG_2004-07.pdf
Recommends side dressing before flowering on cucumbers.
Anybody else?

Buddha, I wish it would stop raining (


Rain wet and moist
So interfering with some life
Still many run about and profligate

They also sing to celibrate
Some need not much to party

Hope the wipers work

Bill

--
Garden in shade zone 5 S Jersey USA

Not all who wander are lost.
- J.R.R. Tolkien (1892-1973)







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Old 05-05-2009, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Petro View Post
I grow tomatoes, peppers and cucumbers but I am at a loss as to the type
of fertilizer to use and how much.
Every one sold in the gardening centers has a different ratio and they all
claim to be the best.
I added manure when I transplanted the plants to the garden. I read that I shouldn't fertilize again until the plants start putting out fruit. They are starting to flower so that probably isn't too far off. What should I use as organic fertilizer? I started making a compost tea to soak into the soil and I think I can get some cow manure from my lake house this weekend. Is that all I need?
It's important that I keep plants healthy and producing b/c if problems arise I know my Dad will start using Miracle Gro.


Thanks, Steven


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