Drew Lawson wrote:
songbird writes:
Drew Lawson wrote:
songbird writes:

i'm just knocking them off onto the ground
or bottom leaves. i'm not sure how effective
that will be. perhaps much better to use sticky
tape or to brush them into soapy water. we'll
see how it goes.

I just roll them between finger and thumb as I pick them.
A little caterpiller juice never hurt anyone. (At least that's my hope.)

the eggs are very tiny, i suppose i could try
to mash them with my fingers but they are pretty
small and fall off when i touch them.

If I see the eggs, I rub them a bit in hopes that they smush.
I am not sure that they do.

But at this stage of life, I don't do well spotting tiny eggs near
ground level unless I crawl. I spend enough time on my knees dealing
with the creaping thistles, I'm not doing that for cabbage worm
eggs.

yeah, it's a challenge, i only get the ones up
higher and those i can get to easily. others i
hope the wasps will get when they hatch.

in today's inspection (after being away for
several days) the eggs are not as many, a few
small worms and not much else, nor much new
damage, even with many butterflies about i
think the wasps have now caught up with the
population of worms hatching. i don't know if
the wasps or ants get the eggs or what feeds
on those, but there were many fewer than i
expected. perhaps ladybugs.


Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am
strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a
reusable material.

i hope you can find someting durable and not
too expensive.


songbird

Drew Lawson wrote:
Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am
strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a
reusable material.

Polymer mesh used for netting fruit trees is cheap and will last quite a few
seasons especially if not put under stress. You could make hoops out of
polypipe to stand it off the plants or just drape it over. You can water
and inspect through the mesh and just lift it to harvest. I find this a
very simple solution to cabbage butterflies.

David

On Saturday, August 10, 2013 9:59:16 PM UTC-6, David Hare-Scott wrote:
Drew Lawson wrote:

Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am

strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a

reusable material.



Polymer mesh used for netting fruit trees is cheap and will last quite a few

seasons especially if not put under stress. You could make hoops out of

polypipe to stand it off the plants or just drape it over. You can water

and inspect through the mesh and just lift it to harvest. I find this a

very simple solution to cabbage butterflies.



David

Been using derris dust for over 50 years...good control of
cabbage worms and the derris dust has not harmed me one iota.
Why put up with these pests when it is so easy to dust the
cabbages?

In article ,
Roy wrote:

On Saturday, August 10, 2013 9:59:16 PM UTC-6, David Hare-Scott wrote:
Drew Lawson wrote:

Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am

strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a

reusable material.



Polymer mesh used for netting fruit trees is cheap and will last quite a
few

seasons especially if not put under stress. You could make hoops out of

polypipe to stand it off the plants or just drape it over. You can water

and inspect through the mesh and just lift it to harvest. I find this a

very simple solution to cabbage butterflies.



David

Been using derris dust for over 50 years...good control of
cabbage worms and the derris dust has not harmed me one iota.
Why put up with these pests when it is so easy to dust the
cabbages?

Derris dust is a poisinous preparation of crushed roots from the Derris
plant. Other plants also contain the active ingredient ,called Rotenone,
and are sometimes used. Rotenone is a naturally occurring substance in
many plants. In the past it was considered to be relatively safe however
new research suggests that this may not be the case. Rotenone is
extremely toxic to fish so Derris dust should never be used near
waterways,etc.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotenone#Parkinson.27s_disease
In 2010, a study was published detailing the progression of
Parkinson's-like symptoms in mice following chronic intragastric
ingestion of low doses of rotenone. The concentrations in the central
nervous system were below detectable limits, yet still induced PD
pathology.

In 2011, a US National Institutes of Health study showed a link between
rotenone use and Parkinson's disease in farm workers.

Bon Appétit
--
Palestinian Child Detained
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzSzH38jYcg

Remember Rachel Corrie
http://www.rachelcorrie.org/

Welcome to the New America.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg

Roy wrote:
On Saturday, August 10, 2013 9:59:16 PM UTC-6, David Hare-Scott wrote:
Drew Lawson wrote:

Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am

strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a

reusable material.



Polymer mesh used for netting fruit trees is cheap and will last
quite a few

seasons especially if not put under stress. You could make hoops
out of

polypipe to stand it off the plants or just drape it over. You can
water

and inspect through the mesh and just lift it to harvest. I find
this a

very simple solution to cabbage butterflies.



David

Been using derris dust for over 50 years...good control of
cabbage worms and the derris dust has not harmed me one iota.
Why put up with these pests when it is so easy to dust the
cabbages?

Why kill so many invertebrates indescriminately when a bit of net will
selectively keep out the butterflies and prevent them laying? Why keep
applying dust every time it rains or you water (if watering overhead) when
the net will work the entire growing season with no effort required? Old
habits die hard but give it a try. I am not so dogmatic as to say never use
insecticides but when it saves money, effort and collateral damage it's a
very easy decision.

David

In article ,
says...


The original post was looking for alternatives to poison.

Been using derris dust for over 50 years...good control of
cabbage worms and the derris dust has not harmed me one iota.

My grandfather used it. He never thought anything of it until it made a
grandson sick.

Why put up with these pests when it is so easy to dust the
cabbages?

Why fight them when a simple method to exclude them will do?

David Hare-Scott said:


Drew Lawson wrote:
Next year I may add cabbage to the broccoli. Either way, I am
strongly considering row covers for next year, as long as it is a
reusable material.

Polymer mesh used for netting fruit trees is cheap and will last quite a few
seasons especially if not put under stress. You could make hoops out of
polypipe to stand it off the plants or just drape it over. You can water
and inspect through the mesh and just lift it to harvest. I find this a
very simple solution to cabbage butterflies.

I tried row covers for a while. The problem was, under cover the
earwigs** and slugs went wild (especially the earwigs). The covers
protected them from predators. The lack of air circulation lead to
fungus problems (especially for cucumbers).

So now I grow kholrabi in the spring (because it matters not if the leaves
get a bit tattered) and bok choi in the fall and forget about heading
types of cabbage at home. No more pretty looking heads laced through
with worms or earwigs and their excrement.

**BTW, this is a BANNER YEAR for earwigs. They may have ruined
my fence charger. It was PACKED FULL of earwigs. Good thing I had
a backup. The groundhogs have been feeding on mulberry leaves that
keep shooting up along the neighbor's fence. The shock wire is the only
thing that keeps them going over the garden fence.

--
Pat in Plymouth MI

"Yes, swooping is bad."

email valid but not regularly monitored

Roy wrote:
....
Been using derris dust for over 50 years...good control of
cabbage worms and the derris dust has not harmed me one iota.
Why put up with these pests when it is so easy to dust the
cabbages?

we've had this conversation before Roy.
it may not have harmed you. it may harm
others or it may harm other creatures i
wish not to harm.

it seems to be going ok for now just by
hand-picking and observing. as i won't be
the person chopping and turning these
cabbages into saurkraut i won't likely know
what the final results will look like. i'll
have to remember to ask.

cabbage worm excrement is likely about as
edible as saurkraut, but i'm sure most of it
washes off anyways. really, i'd not worry
about that problem any more than i worry
about a bit of dirt on a strawberry or some
cheeses.


songbird