It seems like every time I turn around there is another person
bemoaning the fact that they didn't put in a bottom drain when they
built their pond. Being as how I am digging a (small) pond right now,
I would like to avoid such a mistake, and the time for a bottom drain
is now when the pond is being constructed, but I can't see the
advantage in having one. What am I missing?
--
Galen Hekhuis
I have no idea what happened, but I assure you it was all proper.

"Galen Hekhuis" wrote in message
...
It seems like every time I turn around there is another person
bemoaning the fact that they didn't put in a bottom drain when they
built their pond. Being as how I am digging a (small) pond right now,
I would like to avoid such a mistake, and the time for a bottom drain
is now when the pond is being constructed, but I can't see the
advantage in having one. What am I missing?
======================
If it works right and don't constantly clog with leaves and frogs, it should
remove the sludge and mulm that tends to collect on all pond bottoms. No
more drain downs like we have to do. But then if there are fry... you still
have to do draindowns to remove them.
--

RM....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
Zone 6. Middle TN USA
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:14:08 CST, "Reel McKoi"
wrote:

======================
If it works right and don't constantly clog with leaves and frogs, it should
remove the sludge and mulm that tends to collect on all pond bottoms. No
more drain downs like we have to do. But then if there are fry... you still
have to do draindowns to remove them.

I've never had mine clog with any of the above. Have you? ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

"~ jan" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:14:08 CST, "Reel McKoi"
wrote:

======================
If it works right and don't constantly clog with leaves and frogs, it
should
remove the sludge and mulm that tends to collect on all pond bottoms. No
more drain downs like we have to do. But then if there are fry... you
still
have to do draindowns to remove them.

I've never had mine clog with any of the above. Have you? ~ jan
================================
No but Margaret's did. How did you keep leaves and frogs away from the
drains intake?
--

RM....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
Zone 6. Middle TN USA
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö

On Tue, 1 Jan 2008 01:18:23 CST, "Reel McKoi"
wrote:

How did you keep leaves and frogs away from the
drains intake?

I don't try, they get sucked into the prefilter, If a frog were to get
sucked in, it could crawl out of the prefilter, I net out any goldfish with
no damage. In the koi ponds not a problem, fish too big, and a bullfrog
would be too big to fit between lid and liner. What kind of bottom drain
does Margaret have, how big is the line feeding it? Sound like a design
problem if things are clogging it. ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

"~ jan" wrote in message
...
I don't try, they get sucked into the prefilter, If a frog were to get
sucked in, it could crawl out of the prefilter, I net out any goldfish
with
no damage. In the koi ponds not a problem, fish too big, and a bullfrog
would be too big to fit between lid and liner. What kind of bottom drain
does Margaret have, how big is the line feeding it? Sound like a design
problem if things are clogging it. ~ jan
============================
Jan I don't know what kind she had. It sucked the water from the pond
bottom and sprayed it across a large filter filled with plants (pickerel
weed). Or it could be diverted onto her lawn. Large bullfrogs and leaves in
the fall where her problem more so than fish. Her husband (died of a heart
attack about 4 years ago) would have to go into the pond and unclog it. I
have no idea how he did that if a frog of clump of leaves were in the hose
feeding the filter. Unfortunately Margaret was killed in a head on collision
in Nashville about 2 years ago. Maybe they didn't have the same type you
have since her pond was at least 10 years old.
--

RM....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
Zone 6. Middle TN USA
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 22:54:26 CST, ~ jan wrote:

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:14:08 CST, "Reel McKoi"
wrote:

======================
If it works right and don't constantly clog with leaves and frogs, it should
remove the sludge and mulm that tends to collect on all pond bottoms. No
more drain downs like we have to do. But then if there are fry... you still
have to do draindowns to remove them.

I've never had mine clog with any of the above. Have you? ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

My brother-in-law has a nice bottom drain with 2" pipe that outflows
to his skimmer. A few weeks ago he was checking the skimmer and found
a fish that had disappeared 4-5 months before.

It had apparently been living in the 2" pipe all that time and had
finally ended up in the skimmer.

Mike Patterson
Please remove the spamtrap to email me.
"I always wanted to be somebody...I should have been more specific..." - Lily Tomlin

On Wed, 2 Jan 2008 11:34:05 CST, Mike Patterson
wrote:

My brother-in-law has a nice bottom drain with 2" pipe that outflows
to his skimmer. A few weeks ago he was checking the skimmer and found
a fish that had disappeared 4-5 months before.

It had apparently been living in the 2" pipe all that time and had
finally ended up in the skimmer.

When I had a mix of goldfish and koi, it was not unusual for me to
find a small goldfish that had gone down the bottom drain to the
filter barrels and was growing faster than the ones living in the
pond. I started netting them out, but could swear some of the same
fish were back the next time I cleaned the filters. From what I've
seen they don't like pipes they can't turn around in and I suspect if
the fish was too large to turn around in the 2" pipe it was really
glad to be rescued.
--
Hal Middle Georgia, Zone 8
http://tinyurl.com/2fxzcb

"Hal" wrote in message
...
When I had a mix of goldfish and koi, it was not unusual for me to
find a small goldfish that had gone down the bottom drain to the
filter barrels and was growing faster than the ones living in the
pond. I started netting them out, but could swear some of the same
fish were back the next time I cleaned the filters. From what I've
seen they don't like pipes they can't turn around in and I suspect if
the fish was too large to turn around in the 2" pipe it was really
glad to be rescued.
=============================
Margaret's setup didn't have an area for fish to survive. The filter was a
mass of solid roots from the Pickerel Weed. Anything that went through the
pipe landed in the roots. I never did understand how that filter worked
without clogging.
--

RM....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
rec.ponder since late 1996.
Zone 6. Middle TN USA
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 17:41:14 CST, Galen Hekhuis
wrote:

It seems like every time I turn around there is another person
bemoaning the fact that they didn't put in a bottom drain when they
built their pond. Being as how I am digging a (small) pond right now,
I would like to avoid such a mistake, and the time for a bottom drain
is now when the pond is being constructed, but I can't see the
advantage in having one. What am I missing?

It is one of those things you don't realize you need till you need it.

Even if not going to a filter, put one in so it will drain away into your
lake, so much better than pumping it out. With a drain you can open a valve
and rinse it ALL out. Only a hose is needed. Pumps never get it all and
take a lot of water if you have to keep stirring it up hoping to get it
all. Usually you have to get out the wet/dry vac. Just pulling the
equipment out alone is a pita once you're of "that age". ;-) Just a hose is
SO much easier. ~ jan
------------
Zone 7a, SE Washington State
Ponds: www.jjspond.us

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 17:41:14 CST, Galen Hekhuis
wrote:

Being as how I am digging a (small) pond right now,
I would like to avoid such a mistake, and the time for a bottom drain
is now when the pond is being constructed, but I can't see the
advantage in having one. What am I missing?

Bottom drains allow the leaves, trash and quite a bit of fish waste to
escape the pond into a settlement barrel (in my case) or filter system
where the undesirables can be removed or flushed more easily than
vacuuming from the bottom of the pond, or even less desirable, allowed
to decay or build up on the bottom.

If you want to get into super water quality for show fish, I'd
recommend something like this, with air.
http://tinyurl.com/2a4wjq
--
Hal Middle Georgia, Zone 8
http://tinyurl.com/2fxzcb

I've about decided against having a bottom drain. There is no
advantage that I can see. While I have the pond on high ground, that
is relatively speaking. I'm thinking *inches* of relief. Most of the
land here is 154 ft above sea level. Some is 153 ft, some is 155 ft.
Even if I drain the little pond into the big pond, I'd still have to
start a siphon or pump it out. In other words, I'd have to go through
the exact same process whether or not I utilize a bottom drain. I
live in a rural area and already possess several pumps, one
specifically designed to suck up pond water and pump it that I have
for fire fighting purposes (gas operated in case the power fails) and
another one with a 2 inch outlet that will pump the little pond dry
well inside of 10 minutes. I can see it for a larger pond, but this
one seems to be far too tiny to fuss with, besides, I don't count on
having any fish.

On another note, the acorns have pretty much stopped falling on my
(metal) roof. Now it no longer sounds like I'm under direct attack by
..50 machine guns, it's only occasional random sniper fire.
--
Galen Hekhuis
I may have mispoken

On Tue, 8 Jan 2008 19:02:15 CST, Galen Hekhuis
wrote:

I've about decided against having a bottom drain. There is no
advantage that I can see. While I have the pond on high ground, that
is relatively speaking. I'm thinking *inches* of relief. Most of the
land here is 154 ft above sea level. Some is 153 ft, some is 155 ft.
Even if I drain the little pond into the big pond, I'd still have to
start a siphon or pump it out. In other words, I'd have to go through
the exact same process whether or not I utilize a bottom drain. I
live in a rural area and already possess several pumps, one
specifically designed to suck up pond water and pump it that I have
for fire fighting purposes (gas operated in case the power fails) and
another one with a 2 inch outlet that will pump the little pond dry
well inside of 10 minutes. I can see it for a larger pond, but this
one seems to be far too tiny to fuss with, besides, I don't count on
having any fish.

Now that is what we called a puddle when I was growing up. A little
place to play in the water that had no real purpose.

There isn't enough drop in my property either, but I still put the
filter barrels in the ground so I could pump from the last barrel away
from the pond bottom drain. I like to watch fish swim around, but if
I didn't want fish I wouldn't have dug a hole big enough for three
barrels and a bottom drain.

On another note, the acorns have pretty much stopped falling on my
(metal) roof. Now it no longer sounds like I'm under direct attack by
..50 machine guns, it's only occasional random sniper fire.

But the live oak leaves are beginning to fall here, just after
cleaning up all the others from the fall.
--
Hal Middle Georgia, Zone 8
http://tinyurl.com/2fxzcb