Standing in the local pond shop yesterday I tried to find a good source
of filter bacteria, but left with nothing feeling pretty annoyed.

The shop once sold bacteria in a sealed bad impregnated onto a foam pad.
It makes sense that the bacteria should colonise the pad in good
numbers. The pad was slightly damp and I think there was a shelf life of
a few months. What I have problems with are the 250ml bottles of filter
starter that have no manufacture or use by date.

I would be interested to know if anyone in the UK knows of a good source
for cultured pond bacteria, live on delivery. I'm not looking for the
pre-colonised filter media, perhaps a solution or pad that people know
to work well. The ponds coming to life now, so I want to be sure the
right bacteria are taking hold.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Regards David

"DavidM" wrote in message
...
Standing in the local pond shop yesterday I tried to find a good source of
filter bacteria, but left with nothing feeling pretty annoyed.

The shop once sold bacteria in a sealed bad impregnated onto a foam pad.
It makes sense that the bacteria should colonise the pad in good numbers.
The pad was slightly damp and I think there was a shelf life of a few
months. What I have problems with are the 250ml bottles of filter starter
that have no manufacture or use by date.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.

I am of the belief that the need for commercially sold starter bacteria is
just a myth propogated by those who make money doing so. Ignoring the
company involved, Aquascape's Aquaclearer Bacteria Extreme recommends 1
tablespoon per 1000 gallons every week.

So they're suggesting that the bacteria can survive sitting in a can for
however many months it takes to get packaged, shipped, distributed, and
finally sold. But it can only survive 1 week in the environment it was
designed for. Plus they're suggesting a tablespoon or two will somehow
magically contain enough surviving bacteria to break down the ammonia and
other nitrogen compounds.

Of course they don't put a manufacture or use by date. The product can
easily sit 6 months to a year in warehouses and on the shelf before you buy
it.

I think it's all a bunch of baloney. The right kind of bacteria are already
in the air, water and soil. You just need to provide sufficient surface area
for them to develop large colonies. New ponds obviously don't have large
enough bacteria colonies. Introducing one or two fish does two things.

One bit of aquarium water in the bag with the fish has the necessary starter
culture. Second 1-2 fish don't produce much waste, so that gives the
bacteria time to grow and develop before you introduce more fish.

If you're doing a spring cleaning, don't sterilize everything, just get rid
of the mulm, the bacteria floating in the water will soon reestablish
themselves on the surfaces of the filters.

My $0.02
-S

ALL living bacteria cultures have a "best before" date on them - IF you find
some on a shelf with no expirey (sp?) date , I would ask why - Old stock
that they don't want to dump and peeled stickers off ? - ANY living bacteria
has an expirey date - I know that because I sell it, and it works, but only
if it is not outdated and /or not not used properly by the buyer as per
instructions
Your pond already has the bacteria in it if it is an established pond and/
or filter - by using the bacteria additive you are "spiking" the levels of
good bacteria to get your filter up and running faster and speeding up the
decay process of the "mulm" or fish waste, dead plant material in your pond
I have been using it for ~7 yrs and like not having to scoop or
install a bottom drain to clean my pond floor - JMO
Gale :~)
Standing in the local pond shop yesterday I tried to find a good source of
filter bacteria, but left with nothing feeling pretty annoyed.

The shop once sold bacteria in a sealed bad impregnated onto a foam pad.
It makes sense that the bacteria should colonise the pad in good numbers.
The pad was slightly damp and I think there was a shelf life of a few
months. What I have problems with are the 250ml bottles of filter starter
that have no manufacture or use by date.

I would be interested to know if anyone in the UK knows of a good source
for cultured pond bacteria, live on delivery. I'm not looking for the
pre-colonised filter media, perhaps a solution or pad that people know to
work well. The ponds coming to life now, so I want to be sure the right
bacteria are taking hold.

Any suggestions would be much appreciated.
Regards David

Thank you both for the suggestions. I want to ensure that as the weather
warms, the main bacteria colonising the pond are not harmful. As you
say, one teaspoon of dormant/half dead floating bacteria are not going
to colonise a pond and process nitrogen in a hurry. I was hoping to hear
that people buy live cultured bacteria ready to go, but I guess it is
not used.

I changed the filter last year, so have no experience of it's over
winter retention of bacteria. The pond is four years old though, so
should have a good amount of nitrogen converting bacteria already, and
not need intervention.

I'm probably just paranoid. This time last year I lost quite a few fish.
The filter clogged, overflowed and half emptied the pond. As a result,
the filter was not turned-over for over 12 hours and the fish got very
stressed. In the next few days a bacterial infection took a few of them.
Thanks again,
David

Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond DavidM at
was heard opining:

Thank you both for the suggestions. I want to ensure that as the
weather warms, the main bacteria colonising the pond are not harmful.
As you say, one teaspoon of dormant/half dead floating bacteria are
not going to colonise a pond and process nitrogen in a hurry. I was
hoping to hear that people buy live cultured bacteria ready to go,
but I guess it is not used.

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which is
supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of koi and GF.
I believe it works as this disease has not occurred since I've been adding
it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it every spring.

I changed the filter last year, so have no experience of it's over
winter retention of bacteria. The pond is four years old though, so
should have a good amount of nitrogen converting bacteria already, and
not need intervention.

The good bacteria would be on all pond surfaces.

I'm probably just paranoid. This time last year I lost quite a few
fish. The filter clogged, overflowed and half emptied the pond. As a
result, the filter was not turned-over for over 12 hours and the fish
got very stressed. In the next few days a bacterial infection took a
few of them. Thanks again,
David
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Killfile info.
http://www.hyphenologist.co.uk/killfile/
Reading Headers:
http://tinyurl.com/amm9s
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on rec.ponds.
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which is
supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of koi and
GF. I believe it works as this disease has not occurred since I've been
adding it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it every spring.


Have you read the faq for their product? http://www.koizyme.com/faq.html

"This is due to the fact that Koizyme only lives in your pond for 3 to 4
days (it has gone through it's complete life cycle at that point)."

Even if it was bottled only 1 month before you purchased it, the stuff has
gone through 10 life cycles. Or am I supposed to believe in the bottle it
undergoes some kind of suspended animation.

"The Koizyme bacteria's do not consume ammonia or nitrites, therefore they
do not compete with your filter."

Of course not, it died 3-4 days after it was bottled. Plus you claim to
prevent something

"KoiZyme - the pro-biotic that effectively prevents Ulcer Disease. KoiZyme
contains no chemicals, no medications and no antibiotics of any kind. It is
a proprietary, organic preparation of non-pathogenic bacteria, enzymes and
micro-nutrients, and it works on the established principle of an accepted
scientific process widely known in commercial aquaculture management called
Competitive Exclusion."

It only works if you fail to understand what competitive exclusion is. Based
on the faq, at best it's a brief competitor. No way it can achieve
competitive exclusion and die off in 4 days.

-S

Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond Snooze at
was heard opining:

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which
is supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of
koi and GF. I believe it works as this disease has not occurred
since I've been adding it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it
every spring.

Have you read the faq for their product? http://www.koizyme.com/faq.html
"This is due to the fact that Koizyme only lives in your pond for 3
to 4 days (it has gone through it's complete life cycle at that
point)."
Even if it was bottled only 1 month before you purchased it, the
stuff has gone through 10 life cycles. Or am I supposed to believe in
the bottle it undergoes some kind of suspended animation.

Believe what you choose and need to believe. I purchase it every spring,
use it until I run out and haven't had a problem with ulcer disease since.

"The Koizyme bacteria's do not consume ammonia or nitrites, therefore
they do not compete with your filter."

I didn't say they did. I said what I added to my ponds.

Of course not, it died 3-4 days after it was bottled. Plus you claim
to prevent something

So they're selling DEAD KoiZyme that works!!!!

"KoiZyme - the pro-biotic that effectively prevents Ulcer Disease. KoiZyme
contains no chemicals, no medications and no antibiotics of
any kind. It is a proprietary, organic preparation of non-pathogenic
bacteria, enzymes and micro-nutrients, and it works on the
established principle of an accepted scientific process widely known
in commercial aquaculture management called Competitive Exclusion."

Exactly!

It only works if you fail to understand what competitive exclusion
is. Based on the faq, at best it's a brief competitor. No way it can
achieve competitive exclusion and die off in 4 days.

Wow!!! So they're selling a useless DEAD product that works!!!! It's
wonder they get away with such a crime. Actually I couldn't care less if
it's dead or alive as long as it works - and it does.
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on the pond and aquaria groups*
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

Try tying a rope around your neck and tie the other end to a bridge
post, and then jump..it works also.........


On Wed, 26 Apr 2006 16:04:21 -0500, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:
Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond Snooze at
was heard opining:

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which
is supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of
koi and GF. I believe it works as this disease has not occurred
since I've been adding it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it
every spring.

Have you read the faq for their product? http://www.koizyme.com/faq.html
"This is due to the fact that Koizyme only lives in your pond for 3
to 4 days (it has gone through it's complete life cycle at that
point)."
Even if it was bottled only 1 month before you purchased it, the
stuff has gone through 10 life cycles. Or am I supposed to believe in
the bottle it undergoes some kind of suspended animation.

Believe what you choose and need to believe. I purchase it every spring,
use it until I run out and haven't had a problem with ulcer disease since.

"The Koizyme bacteria's do not consume ammonia or nitrites, therefore
they do not compete with your filter."

I didn't say they did. I said what I added to my ponds.

Of course not, it died 3-4 days after it was bottled. Plus you claim
to prevent something

So they're selling DEAD KoiZyme that works!!!!

"KoiZyme - the pro-biotic that effectively prevents Ulcer Disease. KoiZyme
contains no chemicals, no medications and no antibiotics of
any kind. It is a proprietary, organic preparation of non-pathogenic
bacteria, enzymes and micro-nutrients, and it works on the
established principle of an accepted scientific process widely known
in commercial aquaculture management called Competitive Exclusion."

Exactly!

It only works if you fail to understand what competitive exclusion
is. Based on the faq, at best it's a brief competitor. No way it can
achieve competitive exclusion and die off in 4 days.

Wow!!! So they're selling a useless DEAD product that works!!!! It's
wonder they get away with such a crime. Actually I couldn't care less if
it's dead or alive as long as it works - and it does.

Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1982.
Aquariums since 1956.
Some assholes Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on rec.ponds.
But, I am the one and only original Koi-Lo.
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

Wow!!! So they're selling a useless DEAD product that works!!!! It's
wonder they get away with such a crime. Actually I couldn't care less if
it's dead or alive as long as it works - and it does.

Incidently I emailed the owner of Koi Care Kennel about their product.

Me: "What is in koizyme? Specifically what kind of bacteria and what
micronutrients are in it?"

Them: "The information you have requested about KoiZyme is not public
knowledge. That would be the formula for the product. Im sorry we can't give
out that information.

Tom Holder, owner
Koi Care Kennel, Inc.

I never believe any company that hides behind the excuse of "proprietary
formula." Any potential competitor would just send a sample to a lab and
soon know not only which micronutrients are in there, and in what quantity.
A few bucks more, and they'd even know what bacteria are in the bottle.

On Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:50:36 GMT, "Snooze" wrote:

Incidently I emailed the owner of Koi Care Kennel about their product.

Me: "What is in koizyme? Specifically what kind of bacteria and what
micronutrients are in it?"

Them: "The information you have requested about KoiZyme is not public
knowledge. That would be the formula for the product. Im sorry we can't give
out that information.

Tom Holder, owner
Koi Care Kennel, Inc.

I never believe any company that hides behind the excuse of "proprietary
formula." Any potential competitor would just send a sample to a lab and
soon know not only which micronutrients are in there, and in what quantity.
A few bucks more, and they'd even know what bacteria are in the bottle.

Good research. I too was skeptical of Koizyme, but I called rather than
used e-mail, when it first came out. My main point of the call was what was
different about it in regards to any other bacteria for filter start up?

What I heard was believable and figured it was worth a try. Especially
since I have rock around the edges and my koi are known to get nicks every
now and then.... and when I was over stocked I ended up loosing a few to
ulcers.

Since then I've been using the koizyme for 3 years and so far so good. I do
currently have one fish that went into winter with a small mark on its
nose. So far the mark hasn't gotten worst an I'm hoping with warmer temps,
and Koizyme it will not need further treatment. ~ jan
--------------
See my ponds and filter design:
www.jjspond.us

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond ~ janj at
was heard opining:

On Thu, 27 Apr 2006 17:50:36 GMT, "Snooze" wrote:

I never believe any company that hides behind the excuse of
"proprietary formula." Any potential competitor would just send a
sample to a lab and soon know not only which micronutrients are in
there, and in what quantity. A few bucks more, and they'd even know
what bacteria are in the bottle.
===========================================
Good research. I too was skeptical of Koizyme, but I called rather
than used e-mail, when it first came out. My main point of the call
was what was different about it in regards to any other bacteria for
filter start up?

What I heard was believable and figured it was worth a try. Especially
since I have rock around the edges and my koi are known to get nicks
every now and then.... and when I was over stocked I ended up loosing
a few to ulcers.

Since then I've been using the koizyme for 3 years and so far so
good. I do currently have one fish that went into winter with a small
mark on its nose. So far the mark hasn't gotten worst an I'm hoping
with warmer temps, and Koizyme it will not need further treatment. ~
jan --------------
================================
*Note: There are TWO "Koi-Lo's" on this NG*

I haven't had one fish come up with ulcers since using Koi-Zyme. Every
spring they get a bit beat up spawning through the plants which are in
plastic pots and any rocks along the edges they come in contact with. They
lose scales etc. but never get ulcers. The wounds heal rapidly. It's worth
every penny I pay for it. It's $15 here and I add it until it's all used
up. The bottles have dates on them.
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

It has been proven through tests that NONE of these additives do anything,
good or bad, to a pond. They are worthless.

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...
Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond Snooze at
was heard opining:

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which
is supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of
koi and GF. I believe it works as this disease has not occurred
since I've been adding it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it
every spring.

Have you read the faq for their product? http://www.koizyme.com/faq.html
"This is due to the fact that Koizyme only lives in your pond for 3
to 4 days (it has gone through it's complete life cycle at that
point)."
Even if it was bottled only 1 month before you purchased it, the
stuff has gone through 10 life cycles. Or am I supposed to believe in
the bottle it undergoes some kind of suspended animation.

Believe what you choose and need to believe. I purchase it every spring,
use it until I run out and haven't had a problem with ulcer disease since.

"The Koizyme bacteria's do not consume ammonia or nitrites, therefore
they do not compete with your filter."

I didn't say they did. I said what I added to my ponds.

Of course not, it died 3-4 days after it was bottled. Plus you claim
to prevent something

So they're selling DEAD KoiZyme that works!!!!

"KoiZyme - the pro-biotic that effectively prevents Ulcer Disease.
KoiZyme
contains no chemicals, no medications and no antibiotics of
any kind. It is a proprietary, organic preparation of non-pathogenic
bacteria, enzymes and micro-nutrients, and it works on the
established principle of an accepted scientific process widely known
in commercial aquaculture management called Competitive Exclusion."

Exactly!

It only works if you fail to understand what competitive exclusion
is. Based on the faq, at best it's a brief competitor. No way it can
achieve competitive exclusion and die off in 4 days.

Wow!!! So they're selling a useless DEAD product that works!!!! It's
wonder they get away with such a crime. Actually I couldn't care less if
it's dead or alive as long as it works - and it does.
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on the pond and aquaria groups*
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

Worthless to all except those that sell or make the worthless
junk.....For all you know they use old left over bakers yeast or dogs
bath water and bottle it all up and make a small fortune from the
sales of it..... But if it makes ya feel good go for it......
On Mon, 01 May 2006 23:48:06 GMT, "utsuri99"
wrote:
It has been proven through tests that NONE of these additives do anything,
good or bad, to a pond. They are worthless.

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...
Moments before taking that leap of faith into the pond Snooze at
was heard opining:

"Koi-Lo" wrote in message
...

I've had ponds since 1995 and never added anything but KoiZyme which
is supposed to out-compete the bacteria that cause ulcer-disease of
koi and GF. I believe it works as this disease has not occurred
since I've been adding it to my ponds. I buy it fresh and add it
every spring.

Have you read the faq for their product? http://www.koizyme.com/faq.html
"This is due to the fact that Koizyme only lives in your pond for 3
to 4 days (it has gone through it's complete life cycle at that
point)."
Even if it was bottled only 1 month before you purchased it, the
stuff has gone through 10 life cycles. Or am I supposed to believe in
the bottle it undergoes some kind of suspended animation.

Believe what you choose and need to believe. I purchase it every spring,
use it until I run out and haven't had a problem with ulcer disease since.

"The Koizyme bacteria's do not consume ammonia or nitrites, therefore
they do not compete with your filter."

I didn't say they did. I said what I added to my ponds.

Of course not, it died 3-4 days after it was bottled. Plus you claim
to prevent something

So they're selling DEAD KoiZyme that works!!!!

"KoiZyme - the pro-biotic that effectively prevents Ulcer Disease.
KoiZyme
contains no chemicals, no medications and no antibiotics of
any kind. It is a proprietary, organic preparation of non-pathogenic
bacteria, enzymes and micro-nutrients, and it works on the
established principle of an accepted scientific process widely known
in commercial aquaculture management called Competitive Exclusion."

Exactly!

It only works if you fail to understand what competitive exclusion
is. Based on the faq, at best it's a brief competitor. No way it can
achieve competitive exclusion and die off in 4 days.

Wow!!! So they're selling a useless DEAD product that works!!!! It's
wonder they get away with such a crime. Actually I couldn't care less if
it's dead or alive as long as it works - and it does.
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on the pond and aquaria groups*
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o








Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1982.
Aquariums since 1956.
Some assholes Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
*Note: There are several *Koi-Lo's* on rec.ponds.
But, I am the one and only original Koi-Lo.
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

*Note: There are TWO "Koi-Lo's" on this NG*

"utsuri99" wrote in message
.. .
It has been proven through tests that NONE of these additives do anything,
good or bad, to a pond. They are worthless.
===================
I'm sure most are. However, since using KoiZyme, not one koi or GF has
developed ulcers in our ponds.
--
Koi-Lo....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
Aquariums since 1952.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o