Happy Friday

I have a 20,000 gallon in-ground concrete pool. I am considering converting
it
into a koi pond. If I decide to do it, it will probably be next spring (if I
can wait that long..), so I have plenty of time to plan. Today, these are
the issues that concern me:

(1) The pool is situated under a number of deciduous trees. As a swimming
pool, it gets covered in the fall, so keeping leaves out of the pool is not
an issue. How serious of a problem will the leaves cause, if they are
allowed to fall into the pond? I assume that I can't simply let them
decompose in the pond, as this would upset the ecosystem. So I would need to
remove them.. how hard will it be to remove (seems like about a million)
leaves a day for a couple months? Anyone else have a large pond under oak
trees? How do you deal with it?

(2) The pool is surrounded by a concrete patio, which I am not fond of.
Can I break up the patio and toss the rubble into the pond, or will this
make things unhealthy for the fish? The concrete is over 10 years old.

(3) Does anyone have a sense of how a pond (especially one that takes up a
significant portion of the sqaure footage of the lot) impacts resale value?
When we bought the house, the appraiser figured the value of the pool at
$7500. So if I removed the pool and let weeds grow there instead, I might
lose that much when I go to sell the house. What will a large koi pond do to
my resale value?

Regards,

Chris Herring
20,000 gallon frog killer

Hello Chris,
Welcome to rec.ponds!
There have been some really wonderful pool to pond conversions. Somebody has
links to some websites and will probably post them for you to look at.

How serious of a problem will the leaves cause, if they are
allowed to fall into the pond?

Big problem. Decomposing leaves can feed a pea soup algae problem. Lead to all
sorts of fish problems. But not to despair.
You can make a physical barrier with netting, probably in a tent fashion or put
in a nice large skimmer.

Can I break up the patio and toss the rubble into the pond, or will this
make things unhealthy for the fish?

Don't toss the broken patio in the pool. You'll have a heck of mess gather
under the rubble. Bad for fish.

What will a large koi pond do to
my resale value?

A well designed one with ease of maintanence will attract many buyers. But not
all. Unfortunately not all folks are pondamaniacs.

Lots of research ahead of time will pay off big time in the end.
We'd love to meddle in your pond planning ;-)







k30a
yearly brother website posting
http://www.30acreimaging.com/

Here is one of the neatest conversions I have ever seen.

http://www.kilk.com/pond/index3.html Belongs to Eric
Kilk. I think he still hangs around in lurk mode...

Good Luck!

Nedra
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836
http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118

"K30a" wrote in message
...
Hello Chris,
Welcome to rec.ponds!
There have been some really wonderful pool to pond conversions. Somebody
has
links to some websites and will probably post them for you to look at.

How serious of a problem will the leaves cause, if they are
allowed to fall into the pond?

Big problem. Decomposing leaves can feed a pea soup algae problem. Lead to
all
sorts of fish problems. But not to despair.
You can make a physical barrier with netting, probably in a tent fashion
or put
in a nice large skimmer.

Can I break up the patio and toss the rubble into the pond, or will
this
make things unhealthy for the fish?

Don't toss the broken patio in the pool. You'll have a heck of mess gather
under the rubble. Bad for fish.

What will a large koi pond do to
my resale value?

A well designed one with ease of maintanence will attract many buyers. But
not
all. Unfortunately not all folks are pondamaniacs.

Lots of research ahead of time will pay off big time in the end.
We'd love to meddle in your pond planning ;-)







k30a
yearly brother website posting
http://www.30acreimaging.com/

"K30a" wrote in message
...
Hello Chris,
Welcome to rec.ponds!

Thanks!

Big problem. Decomposing leaves can feed a pea soup algae problem. Lead to
all
sorts of fish problems. But not to despair.
You can make a physical barrier with netting, probably in a tent fashion
or put
in a nice large skimmer.

That would be a big tent in my case (over 400 square feet). Hmm.. perhaps I
could build a pergola/deck at one end of the pond, and use that to anchor
one end of a screen. I could anchor the far end at ground level. It (the
tent) would probably be ugly, but I would only have to look at it for a
couple of months every year. I will have to think about that..
By large skimmer, you are obviously not talking in swimming pool terms.. the
pool skimmer is about 1 square foot, and holds a couple of handfuls of
leaves. So I guess I would need something that was 5-10 square feet (?)

Don't toss the broken patio in the pool. You'll have a heck of mess gather
under the rubble. Bad for fish.

I thought I read somewhere that it was a good idea to have a layer of rocks
or gravel in the bottom of the pond, for beneficial algae to live on? Are
you saying that in a koi pond I should leave the pond "clean"?

Chris

"Nedra" wrote in message
arthlink.net...
Here is one of the neatest conversions I have ever seen.

http://www.kilk.com/pond/index3.html Belongs to Eric
Kilk. I think he still hangs around in lurk mode...

I agree.. very nice pond. As a matter of fact, that's the one that started
me thinking about converting mine.

Chris

Chris,

Some people like stones on the bottom of the pond, in fact, one pond
installer champions small rocks and stones in the ponds, but the general
consensus for the people left with the pond after the contractor leaves is
that they are a pain in the fanny. You get enough crap in your pond from
dirt in the air, junk falling in from the wind, your trees leaves, etc. And
people are correct that the stones are places for the beneficial bacteria to
live but the stones cause problems when you are trying to clean the pond and
this needs to be done at least once a year. My ponds are makeshift because
I am a renter, but I can tell you that the containers I use get plenty of
stuff in them without adding stones to the mix. It is great to siphon the
muck out of the bottom of the pond and this is assisted by the fact that
there are not stone or rocks getting caught in the end of the tubes. Around
here in Northcentral Oklahoma, most of the people have nothing in their
ponds but plants and their containers and in the late fall or early spring
there is still a lot of crap that ends up in the ponds and rocks and/or
stones are no help when it comes to cleaning. There have been people who
have went with the Aquascape technique of stones in the bottom of the ponds,
but after a while they are pulling them out and keeping them out of their
ponds. It does make for a natural looking and appealing appearance to the
pond until the stuff builds up on it.

Tom L.L.
"Chris Herring" wrote in message
...

"K30a" wrote in message
...
Hello Chris,
Welcome to rec.ponds!

Thanks!

Big problem. Decomposing leaves can feed a pea soup algae problem. Lead
to
all
sorts of fish problems. But not to despair.
You can make a physical barrier with netting, probably in a tent fashion
or put
in a nice large skimmer.

That would be a big tent in my case (over 400 square feet). Hmm.. perhaps
I
could build a pergola/deck at one end of the pond, and use that to anchor
one end of a screen. I could anchor the far end at ground level. It (the
tent) would probably be ugly, but I would only have to look at it for a
couple of months every year. I will have to think about that..
By large skimmer, you are obviously not talking in swimming pool terms..
the
pool skimmer is about 1 square foot, and holds a couple of handfuls of
leaves. So I guess I would need something that was 5-10 square feet (?)

Don't toss the broken patio in the pool. You'll have a heck of mess
gather
under the rubble. Bad for fish.

I thought I read somewhere that it was a good idea to have a layer of
rocks
or gravel in the bottom of the pond, for beneficial algae to live on? Are
you saying that in a koi pond I should leave the pond "clean"?

Chris

"Chris Herring" wrote in message
...
Happy Friday

I have a 20,000 gallon in-ground concrete pool. I am considering
converting
it
into a koi pond. If I decide to do it, it will probably be next spring (if
I
can wait that long..), so I have plenty of time to plan. Today, these are
the issues that concern me:

(1) The pool is situated under a number of deciduous trees.

As most water lillies need at least 5 hours of sun to bloom properly, you
might assess whether the tree allows this. If you are not into flowers, but
strictly fish, then the shade might be appreciated by them.

When we bought the house, the appraiser figured the value of the pool at
$7500. So if I removed the pool and let weeds grow there instead, I might
lose that much when I go to sell the house. What will a large koi pond do
to
my resale value?

Ask the appraiser in your area as it is a very local thing. Where we live in
the North, an in ground swimming pool in the backyard actually reduces the
resale value of a house.

Chris,

The real estate value is dictated by the demand for particular features. A
swimming pool is valuable in certain areas of the country, and therefore
adds value. A koi pond could add the same value, or even more, but the
number of people looking for a koi pond, is probably less than the number
looking for a swimming pool, therefore, it might take longer to find the
right buyer.

A swimming pool filter system is designed for chlorinated water and minimum
debris, so it is greatly undersized for a koi pond. Look at the
modifications to the filter system. Most of the plumbing will work as
currently installed, but the bottom drain would need to be modified to
handle the leaves and other debris that will get there. The skimmer baskets
are small, but they will tend to draw the leaves by surface currents to
them, and with a large skimmer net, they can be netted from the surface
fairly easily.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html


"Chris Herring" wrote in message
...
Happy Friday

I have a 20,000 gallon in-ground concrete pool. I am considering
converting
it
into a koi pond. If I decide to do it, it will probably be next spring (if
I
can wait that long..), so I have plenty of time to plan. Today, these are
the issues that concern me:

(1) The pool is situated under a number of deciduous trees. As a swimming
pool, it gets covered in the fall, so keeping leaves out of the pool is
not
an issue. How serious of a problem will the leaves cause, if they are
allowed to fall into the pond? I assume that I can't simply let them
decompose in the pond, as this would upset the ecosystem. So I would need
to
remove them.. how hard will it be to remove (seems like about a million)
leaves a day for a couple months? Anyone else have a large pond under oak
trees? How do you deal with it?

(2) The pool is surrounded by a concrete patio, which I am not fond of.
Can I break up the patio and toss the rubble into the pond, or will this
make things unhealthy for the fish? The concrete is over 10 years old.

(3) Does anyone have a sense of how a pond (especially one that takes up a
significant portion of the sqaure footage of the lot) impacts resale
value?
When we bought the house, the appraiser figured the value of the pool at
$7500. So if I removed the pool and let weeds grow there instead, I might
lose that much when I go to sell the house. What will a large koi pond do
to
my resale value?

Regards,

Chris Herring
20,000 gallon frog killer

RichToyBox wrote:

(3) Does anyone have a sense of how a pond (especially one that takes up a
significant portion of the sqaure footage of the lot) impacts resale
value?

I don't know that a pool adds any value. If I were looking for a house and
it had a pool, I would consider it a liability. On the other hand, if I had
young kids I might think it was useful to have. A pond might limit the
number of people who would consider buying your home in the future -
especially a 20,000 gallon pond. But if the right PORG came along, they
might be willing to pay extra!

Joe



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I also would not put concrete in the pond. I have recently seen broken
concrete used to make all sorts of things that look surprisingly good.
Stack the pieces as you would stone to make planters or a stone wall or a
bench. You can use them to make a water feature by stacking them and
turning them into a "waterfall" (without pond). They would quickly be
covered with moss and whatever water loving plants you want to add. Break it
up, turn it over and space them so that there is enough room between pieces
to grow ground cover plants. It looks more natural and interesting. Use
the broken up pieces (again turned upside down) for stepping stones around
the yard and garden.

We told our realtor that we did NOT want a house with a pool and I would
have loved to have one with a pond.... Your problem is finding the right
buyer. The problem is what is the probability of one over the other and
whether it is a buyer's or seller's market. Oh, and taking out the pond may
decrease your taxes... You might want to check on that. DK

"K30a" wrote in message
...
Hello Chris,
Welcome to rec.ponds!
There have been some really wonderful pool to pond conversions. Somebody
has
links to some websites and will probably post them for you to look at.

How serious of a problem will the leaves cause, if they are
allowed to fall into the pond?

Big problem. Decomposing leaves can feed a pea soup algae problem. Lead to
all
sorts of fish problems. But not to despair.
You can make a physical barrier with netting, probably in a tent fashion
or put
in a nice large skimmer.

Can I break up the patio and toss the rubble into the pond, or will
this
make things unhealthy for the fish?

Don't toss the broken patio in the pool. You'll have a heck of mess gather
under the rubble. Bad for fish.

What will a large koi pond do to
my resale value?

A well designed one with ease of maintanence will attract many buyers. But
not
all. Unfortunately not all folks are pondamaniacs.

Lots of research ahead of time will pay off big time in the end.
We'd love to meddle in your pond planning ;-)







k30a
yearly brother website posting
http://www.30acreimaging.com/

Chris Herring wrote:
...
(1) The pool is situated under a number of deciduous trees ...

We use three big nets made from shade fabric (available at Home Depot,
etc.) supported by pvc pipes (nets have "pockets" sewn into each edge
and pipe runs through those pockets and is joined with PVC joints at
each corner and in center of two opposing sides for support). The leaves
can be dumped or blown off the nets. We also use these nets in the
spring for shading the pond as the sun begins to encourage the pea green
algae to grow.

(2) The pool is surrounded by a concrete patio ...

Use the concrete rubble to build up a waterfall area? turn it over and
make stepping stones around pond? build up a wall area at one end of
pond to support a second pond? lots of different ways to reuse this
material.

Sounds like a great project -- can't wait to see your progress next
spring. (P.S. while are you the "frog killer"?)
--
Kathy B, zookeeper
3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
Oregon, Zone 6

"zookeeper" wrote in message
...

Use the concrete rubble to build up a waterfall area? turn it over and
make stepping stones around pond? build up a wall area at one end of
pond to support a second pond? lots of different ways to reuse this
material.

Those are good ideas.. I especially like the stepping stone idea.

(P.S. while are you the "frog killer"?)

Once or twice a week I find a dead frog at the bottom of the pool. They
wander in for a swim but quickly succumb to the chlorine. Poor guys..

Chris

"RichToyBox" wrote in message
news:AgyUa.133952$OZ2.26027@rwcrnsc54...

A swimming pool filter system is designed for chlorinated water and
minimum
debris, so it is greatly undersized for a koi pond. Look at the
modifications to the filter system.

I think I will sell the sand filter and build a more appropriate filter.

... Most of the plumbing will work as
currently installed,

I wonder if the koi would get along with my Polaris pool-vac "robot"

Chris

Chris,

I don't know. I think during the day, they might like to play with it. It
would be fun to watch. At night, I think that I would shut it off so that a
resting koi did not get caught.
--
RichToyBox
http://www.geocities.com/richtoybox/pondintro.html


"Chris Herring" wrote in message
...
I wonder if the koi would get along with my Polaris pool-vac "robot"

Chris

ACK!!!!! Koi pond/no stuff on the bottom! Rocks and plant stands etc. are
for water gardens, not "serious" koi ponds (as I duck to avoid getting
clobbered from other folks on this NG!). Converting your pool will give you
the depth that koi crave/need to get proper muscle development, which they
get from going top/bottom, not end to end. It's deep enough that even the
most determined predator can't get to them. You've got the depth to keep
them cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter. You've already got a
bottom drain (Yeh!). Now all you need is an anti-vortex cover, and jerry-rig
an air diffuser to it to draw the botttom "stuff" to the drain. You've got a
skimmer (of sorts!), probably underwater lighting, and with any luck at all,
you've got water return jets to tickle the fancy of even the most finicky
koi! A plumber should be able to by-pass the existing filter (which will now
be useless) and hook-up the proper filtration. At one end, you probably have
steps to enter the pond, and it's big enough to give a whole new meaning to
"swimmin' wit' da fishes" G.

I'm jealous!!!!!

Lee

snip
"Chris Herring" wrote in message
...

I thought I read somewhere that it was a good idea to have a layer of
rocks
or gravel in the bottom of the pond, for beneficial algae to live on? Are
you saying that in a koi pond I should leave the pond "clean"?

Chris