Am new to vegetables so sorry for this probably stupid question
I've bought some peas (Kelvader Wonder) and Broad Beans (Sutton). The
packets each seem to contain enough for a small field. What sort of yield do
you usually get off one plant? How many do people with small veg patches (4
raised beds of about 4' by 12' each and lots of fruit round the edges)
plant? So far I've planted about 10 of each (2 rows). Is this reasonable or
will I be struggling to get enough for a meal? TIA

--
Hayley
(gardening on well drained, alkaline clay in Somerset)

"H Ryder" wrote in message
...
: Am new to vegetables so sorry for this probably stupid question
: I've bought some peas (Kelvader Wonder) and Broad Beans (Sutton). The
: packets each seem to contain enough for a small field. What sort of yield
do
: you usually get off one plant? How many do people with small veg patches
(4
: raised beds of about 4' by 12' each and lots of fruit round the edges)
: plant? So far I've planted about 10 of each (2 rows). Is this reasonable
or
: will I be struggling to get enough for a meal? TIA
:
: --
: Hayley
: (gardening on well drained, alkaline clay in Somerset)
You will definitely struggle with that amount. Best way for peas, as you
haven't much room, is to take out a narrow trench say 12 feet long , 2 or 3
inches deep and sprinkle the whole packet or more in. You have to allow 1
for slugs, one for rot, one for birds and one for yourself! For broad beans
I would plant another 12 foot row of fives (as I call it), i.e. 3 rows each
about 6 inches apart, the middle row alternating between the other two if
you get my drift.. Obviously you can extend or shorten depending on what
else you want to plant but those would give you something worthwhile. With
peas you want to put nets or sticks up for them to cling to and this will
also help to keep off the pigeons which are a problem in my area. The beans
may need some horizontal rope supports later although I believe the Sutton
is a smaller growing variety so there may be no need.

PS I see you're on clay, will it be warm enough for peas yet...you'll soon
find out

Robert wrote:
"H Ryder" wrote in message
...
Am new to vegetables so sorry for this probably stupid question
I've bought some peas (Kelvader Wonder) and Broad Beans (Sutton). The
packets each seem to contain enough for a small field. What sort of
yield do you usually get off one plant? How many do people with
small veg patches (4 raised beds of about 4' by 12' each and lots of
fruit round the edges) plant? So far I've planted about 10 of each
(2 rows). Is this reasonable or will I be struggling to get enough
for a meal? TIA

--
Hayley
(gardening on well drained, alkaline clay in Somerset)
You will definitely struggle with that amount. Best way for peas, as
you haven't much room, is to take out a narrow trench say 12 feet
long , 2 or 3 inches deep and sprinkle the whole packet or more in.
You have to allow 1 for slugs, one for rot, one for birds and one for
yourself! For broad beans I would plant another 12 foot row of fives
(as I call it), i.e. 3 rows each about 6 inches apart, the middle row
alternating between the other two if you get my drift.. Obviously you
can extend or shorten depending on what else you want to plant but
those would give you something worthwhile. With peas you want to put
nets or sticks up for them to cling to and this will also help to
keep off the pigeons which are a problem in my area. The beans may
need some horizontal rope supports later although I believe the
Sutton is a smaller growing variety so there may be no need.

PS I see you're on clay, will it be warm enough for peas yet...you'll
soon find out

I reckon it's not too soon for early varieties even on cold clay; but a
month's time for the main crop, would you say?

Robert's right about dense sowing, Hayley: you don't actually get all
that many from each vine, and they're happy close together. I go even
closer than he does: about two to three inches (no need to measure!)
between seeds, but in a double not a triple row.

--
Mike.

In article , Robert
writes

PS I see you're on clay, will it be warm enough for peas yet...you'll soon
find out




I'm on clay and flint and would recommend starting the beans and peas in
either pots, or those fibrous pots that you can put into the ground .I
think it's too cold at the moment (South Bucks) weeds aren't yet
germinating in my deep beds, though bittercress has appeared in my plant
pots!
--
Janet Tweedy
Amersham Gardening Association
http://www.amersham-gardening.net

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from Janet Tweedy contains these words:

bittercress has appeared in my plant
pots!

Doom alert! Quick, pull out every last one before they flower.
They go
to seed far faster than you think possible, all year round, and
each
plant makes thousands of seeds. :-(


I've never understood why it hasn't taken over the planet!

--
ned

http://www.bugsandweeds.co.uk
latest update 07.03.2006

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes
The message
from Janet Tweedy contains these words:

bittercress has appeared in my plant
pots!

Doom alert! Quick, pull out every last one before they flower. They go
to seed far faster than you think possible, all year round, and each
plant makes thousands of seeds. :-(

Janet


Yes I know................. I failed to notice one or two last year and
now they've sprung up in a sort of general area in my post of cuttings
etc. I am pulling them up as fast as I can!
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

On 11/3/06 23:39, in article , "Janet Tweedy"
wrote:

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes
The message
from Janet Tweedy contains these words:

bittercress has appeared in my plant
pots!

Doom alert! Quick, pull out every last one before they flower. They go
to seed far faster than you think possible, all year round, and each
plant makes thousands of seeds. :-(

Janet


Yes I know................. I failed to notice one or two last year and
now they've sprung up in a sort of general area in my post of cuttings
etc. I am pulling them up as fast as I can!

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned stuff. I
spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house pulling it out because
it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and cuttings just as much as they
do!
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
)

In article , Sacha
writes

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned stuff. I
spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house pulling it out because
it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and cuttings just as much as they
do!


Does it germinate as a large plant . I swear I look at every pot then
suddenly spy one large clump just about ready to flower that COULDN'T
have been there the day before!

Janet
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

On 12/3/06 11:38, in article , "Janet Tweedy"
wrote:

In article , Sacha
writes

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned stuff. I
spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house pulling it out because
it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and cuttings just as much as they
do!


Does it germinate as a large plant . I swear I look at every pot then
suddenly spy one large clump just about ready to flower that COULDN'T
have been there the day before!

As far as I can see, it germinates at every possible size. I've seen huge
rosettes of it just about to burst into flower, teensy little seedlings
'springing' their seeds all over the place and if I'm lucky, the very
earliest leaves just poking through a pot! I think it must like the south
west most particularly because I certainly don't recall seeing so much of it
in Jersey!
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
)

Janet Tweedy wrote:
In article , Sacha
writes

[Re Bittercress]

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned
stuff. I spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house
pulling it out because it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and
cuttings just as much as they do!


Does it germinate as a large plant . I swear I look at every pot then
suddenly spy one large clump just about ready to flower that COULDN'T
have been there the day before!

But I swear it wasn't as prevalent thirtyish years ago. What actually
happened to kick it off? I rather suspect the rise of the chain-store
garden centre must be implicated: these institutions don't take Sacha's
interest in getting rid of it from the plants they sell. But that can't
be the only factor.

Hand up anybody who doesn't recognise the patter of tiny seeds in the
face on getting to a specimen a day too late!

--
Mike.

On 12/3/06 13:45, in article , "Mike Lyle"
wrote:

Janet Tweedy wrote:
In article , Sacha
writes

[Re Bittercress]

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned
stuff. I spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house
pulling it out because it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and
cuttings just as much as they do!


Does it germinate as a large plant . I swear I look at every pot then
suddenly spy one large clump just about ready to flower that COULDN'T
have been there the day before!

But I swear it wasn't as prevalent thirtyish years ago. What actually
happened to kick it off? I rather suspect the rise of the chain-store
garden centre must be implicated: these institutions don't take Sacha's
interest in getting rid of it from the plants they sell. But that can't
be the only factor.

Could the seeds come in on veggies etc? With the spread of super market
shopping and the wide range of veg they offer, I suppose that could be one
reason for its spread?

Hand up anybody who doesn't recognise the patter of tiny seeds in the
face on getting to a specimen a day too late!
;-)
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
)

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Mike Lyle" contains these
words:

Janet Tweedy wrote:
In article , Sacha
writes

[Re Bittercress]

I sometimes think we have the national collection of the damned
stuff. I spent hours, if not days, going round the prop. house
pulling it out because it likes the perfect conditions for seeds and
cuttings just as much as they do!


Does it germinate as a large plant . I swear I look at every pot then
suddenly spy one large clump just about ready to flower that COULDN'T
have been there the day before!

But I swear it wasn't as prevalent thirtyish years ago. What actually
happened to kick it off? I rather suspect the rise of the chain-store
garden centre must be implicated

Hm, I certainly agree about the increased prevalence, but hadn't
considered GC's and had put it down to milder winters/ climate change
:-)

Bittercress seems to me to have increased even in the last 5 years. I
have another pernicious "new" weed which has tiny round light green
leaves down at soil-surface level. I've never even seen it on GC pot
surfaces (unlike bittercress). It's shallow rooted and spreads
vegetatively, like wildfire, from the tiniest dropped leaf into a flat
expanding mat, on beds and in lawns. Anybody know what I mean and what
the name is?

Janet

Your description fits Mind-your-own-business (Soleirolia soleirolii) but I
am certain you are already familiar with that?

The message
from Janet Baraclough contains these words:

Bittercress seems to me to have increased even in the last 5 years. I
have another pernicious "new" weed which has tiny round light green
leaves down at soil-surface level. I've never even seen it on GC pot
surfaces (unlike bittercress). It's shallow rooted and spreads
vegetatively, like wildfire, from the tiniest dropped leaf into a flat
expanding mat, on beds and in lawns. Anybody know what I mean and what
the name is?


Is it a lichen? I've got some like that, and it has umbrella or
palm-shaped fruitbodies with saffron yellow sporangia under the
umbrella.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

In article , Janet Baraclough
writes

Bittercress seems to me to have increased even in the last 5 years. I
have another pernicious "new" weed which has tiny round light green
leaves down at soil-surface level. I've never even seen it on GC pot
surfaces (unlike bittercress). It's shallow rooted and spreads
vegetatively, like wildfire, from the tiniest dropped leaf into a flat
expanding mat, on beds and in lawns. Anybody know what I mean and what
the name is?

Janet


Photo janet? so at least we can be wary!

Janet
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

Dave Poole wrote:
Without wishing to offend those living in the Netherlands, we used to
call this 'Dutchman's Curse' 30 or so years ago. It arrived in vast
quantities when nurseries and garden centres started importing shrubs
and trees from Holland.

In the Midlands especially, many of us bought in stuff from a large
nursery called Nieuwesteeg in Boskoop. Most of the stock was good
quality and well priced, but with it came bittercress, which then
seeded into nursery and garden centre standing areas and then back
into other pots. It didn't take long before it became the most
prevalent weed in container shrubs and it remains so to this very day.

Aha! I just knew careless nurseries must be implicated. But it's still
striking that a common enough native species should have had such a
population explosion: is there a reason for that? Was the Dutch form
different in some subtle but important way? Or is there an environmental
change behind it?

--
Mike.