I mailed the group last year about Norfolk Island Pines and the general conclusion is that they will not grow out of doors in the UK.
My pine is a beautiful specimen but at 2.4 metres is now brushing the conservatory roof.
What happens if you cut the growing tip off?
Regards
David T

oops sent the reply via e/mail here it is again for the group.

g'day david,

not the sort of plant to recommend for hot house or pot culture they
grow very large indeed, as with most pines if you lop the top off they
will grow more shoots that will in turn need lopping, and as with most
pines once they have been lopped they just seem to lose their appeal.

might be time to relegate this one to the compost heap and buy another
smaller one and start all over again, or grow something more suited to
your clime so you can plant it out in the garden.


snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.users.bigpond.com/gardenlen1

I feared that might be the answer. I have two promising young lads one about
3ft and one 1ft tall.
The 2.4M specimen has served time as a backup Christmas tree and I shall try
to find a good home for it-a car showroom has been suggested. Failing that
I'll give it a go outside (we live in Devon) protect it with fleece in
winter and see what happens.
I tried the middle one out of doors last June and it was immediately
scorched by bright sunshine. It has greened up around the scorched area.
Thanks for your advice.
David T.
wrote in message
...
oops sent the reply via e/mail here it is again for the group.

g'day david,

not the sort of plant to recommend for hot house or pot culture they
grow very large indeed, as with most pines if you lop the top off they
will grow more shoots that will in turn need lopping, and as with most
pines once they have been lopped they just seem to lose their appeal.

might be time to relegate this one to the compost heap and buy another
smaller one and start all over again, or grow something more suited to
your clime so you can plant it out in the garden.


snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.users.bigpond.com/gardenlen1

snip

not the sort of plant to recommend for hot house or pot culture they
grow very large indeed, as with most pines if you lop the top off they
will grow more shoots that will in turn need lopping, and as with most
pines once they have been lopped they just seem to lose their appeal.

might be time to relegate this one to the compost heap and buy another
smaller one and start all over again,

I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off
again?

or grow something more suited to
your clime so you can plant it out in the garden.


Now *that* does make sense.

--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon

Thank you for your concern Sacha, but it is not a serious problem.We were
very taken with the huge Norfolk Island pines when we visited New Zealand in
2002, and bought our tree for about £5 on impulse when we returned home-we
just happened to see it in a garden centre.
In New Zealand the Norfolk island Pine doubles indoors as a Christmas tree.
We've just grown sentimentally attached to this tree which had added about
2M in four years.
Apart from the two other small trees, we could try growing the lead shoot as
a cutting, and also plant the tree out of doors. £5 for an attractive
houseplant that earns its keep at Christmas and keeps for four years is not
too bad.
The tree is listed as a houseplant and apparently there are a number of
varieties-perhaps the others are less vigorous.
Regards
David T
"Sacha" wrote in message
ups.com...
snip

not the sort of plant to recommend for hot house or pot culture they
grow very large indeed, as with most pines if you lop the top off they
will grow more shoots that will in turn need lopping, and as with most
pines once they have been lopped they just seem to lose their appeal.

might be time to relegate this one to the compost heap and buy another
smaller one and start all over again,

I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off
again?

or grow something more suited to
your clime so you can plant it out in the garden.


Now *that* does make sense.

--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon

On 25 Apr 2006 15:02:52 -0700, "Sacha"
wrote:

snip

snipped

I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off
again?

sacha mine is not to wonder why but to do or die well something like
that, it all comes back to common sense and i'm not here to judge
others just to help as best i can and make broad suggestions. for me
as i live in suburbia trees like that aren't on my shopping list, as
they grow too large for my domain and don't serve too well as potted
specimens. and what i said is just about what a lot of people do it is
up to the recipient of the advice to decide that.

for me i would never put in a hot house just to grow things that don't
naturally grow where i live just doesn't seem sustainable to me but if
others want to do that then that is there business ok, hope i answered
your concerns "i am not her to judge others actions"

or grow something more suited to
your clime so you can plant it out in the garden.



Now *that* does make sense.

there you go then hey so your previuos paragraph may not ahve been
needed hey?????



With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.users.bigpond.com/gardenlen1

g'day david,

the lisitng as a house plant is way off the mark for me but that is
what the nursery industry is like, they say anything to create sales
hey? these trees are very much outdoors specimens in full sun in the
right climate zone. not suggested as a garden plant in suburbia
either.

would suggest you do your research on other varities before buying so
you at least have some knowledge of the plants growing capacity and
conditions you may find they are all pretty much the same, but in your
case it probably served as a good cheap crissy tree hey?



snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.users.bigpond.com/gardenlen1

g'day again david,

here is a link that may give you and others some insight about the
norfolk island pine, can't find any reference to there being different
plants as far as i know it is a single species plant they do say it is
not a true pine (i learnt something hey) and like lots of big trees if
they get damaged and grow new growths these growths are less stable
and tend to break off easily and could do lots of damage, anyhow you
can read that.

i did find one sight that dressed up the information to make it look
like the plant would be a good long term pot culture but you all know
now that, that isn't the case hey?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norfolk_Island_pine

len

snipped
With peace and brightest of blessings,

len

--
"Be Content With What You Have And
May You Find Serenity and Tranquillity In
A World That You May Not Understand."

http://www.users.bigpond.com/gardenlen1

Sacha writes
I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off again?

Isn't that what we do whenever we grow *anything* which is perennial but
can't survive a UK winter? ;-)
--
Kay

K wrote:
Sacha writes
I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off again?

Isn't that what we do whenever we grow *anything* which is perennial but
can't survive a UK winter? ;-)
--
Kay

When it's a tree which grows to X feet and has outgrown a conservatory?
Hardly. That would be what WE do with e.g. Dahlis Imperialis not with
Dahlia Engelhard'ts Matador.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon

Gardenlen wrote:
here is a link that may give you and others some insight about the
norfolk island pine, can't find any reference to there being different
plants as far as i know it is a single species plant they do say it is
not a true pine (i learnt something hey)

'Norfolk Island Pine' is one of about about 15 valid species of
Araucaria - a genus of large growing, southern hemisphere, pine-like
conifers. Several are relatively well known - Araucaria araucana is
the 'Chilean Pine' or 'Monkey Puzzle' (large growing and very hardy),
Araucaria bidwillii is the 'Bunya Pine' from Australia growing even
larger at around 40+ metres and our old friend Araucaria heterophylla
(excelsa) - the more slender and elegant 'Norfolk Island Pine'. None
are true 'pines' in the strictest sense, but then many so-called
'pines' don't belong to the genus Pinus.

and like lots of big trees if
they get damaged and grow new growths these growths are less stable
and tend to break off easily and could do lots of damage, anyhow you
can read that.

Not necessarily. Pruning the tops out of trees that have strong apical
dominance and which naturally develop symetrical outlines does destroy
the overall effect. However, I've seen a Norfolk Pine that was cut
back to about 3 feet when it had threatened to touch the ceiling.
After several years' subsequent growth of 3 'leaders' with their
accompanying tiers of branches, it didn't look too bad at all. The
owner rooted the original top and had a nice new young plant as well.

i did find one sight that dressed up the information to make it look
like the plant would be a good long term pot culture but you all know
now that, that isn't the case hey?

Well, Araucaria heterophylla (or A. excelsa as it was known in Victoria
times) was a very popular 'pot plant' and widely grown in homes and
conservatories throughout the country. Until it becomes too large, it
makes a very good indoor subject if given sufficient light. It barely
needs frost protection and so can be grown in an unheated greenhouse or
even in a very sheltered spot out of doors in the South West (of
England, Wales or Ireland). It is as good for long term pot culture as
Monstera or many of the Ficus and is far less demanding in terms of
heat.

Sacha writes

K wrote:
Sacha writes
I'm sorry but I don't understand why you would advise someone to
consider buying and growing another of the same plant that is clearly
unsuitable to their circumstances? So that it can be killed off again?

Isn't that what we do whenever we grow *anything* which is perennial but
can't survive a UK winter? ;-)

When it's a tree which grows to X feet and has outgrown a conservatory?
Hardly. That would be what WE do with e.g. Dahlis Imperialis not with
Dahlia Engelhard'ts Matador.

I don't see the difference between terminating a plant's life because we
are growing it in a country which has winters too cold for it, or
perpetually cutting it back to 6ft when it's normally a forest tree (eg
a beech hedge), or growing something for a few years in a conservatory
although you know you'll eventually have to get rid of it when it's too
large.
--
Kay

Thanks for the encouraging comments re outdoor or cutting back. I have not
yet decided what to do although the tree is now bending over at the ceiling.
I may plant it out of doors in a sheltered spot and be prepared to shroud it
when frost is forecast.
Protection from scorching in strong sunlight is also a necessity.
Regards
David T
"DavePoole Torquay" wrote in message
oups.com...
Gardenlen wrote:
here is a link that may give you and others some insight about the
norfolk island pine, can't find any reference to there being different
plants as far as i know it is a single species plant they do say it is
not a true pine (i learnt something hey)

'Norfolk Island Pine' is one of about about 15 valid species of
Araucaria - a genus of large growing, southern hemisphere, pine-like
conifers. Several are relatively well known - Araucaria araucana is
the 'Chilean Pine' or 'Monkey Puzzle' (large growing and very hardy),
Araucaria bidwillii is the 'Bunya Pine' from Australia growing even
larger at around 40+ metres and our old friend Araucaria heterophylla
(excelsa) - the more slender and elegant 'Norfolk Island Pine'. None
are true 'pines' in the strictest sense, but then many so-called
'pines' don't belong to the genus Pinus.

and like lots of big trees if
they get damaged and grow new growths these growths are less stable
and tend to break off easily and could do lots of damage, anyhow you
can read that.

Not necessarily. Pruning the tops out of trees that have strong apical
dominance and which naturally develop symetrical outlines does destroy
the overall effect. However, I've seen a Norfolk Pine that was cut
back to about 3 feet when it had threatened to touch the ceiling.
After several years' subsequent growth of 3 'leaders' with their
accompanying tiers of branches, it didn't look too bad at all. The
owner rooted the original top and had a nice new young plant as well.

i did find one sight that dressed up the information to make it look
like the plant would be a good long term pot culture but you all know
now that, that isn't the case hey?

Well, Araucaria heterophylla (or A. excelsa as it was known in Victoria
times) was a very popular 'pot plant' and widely grown in homes and
conservatories throughout the country. Until it becomes too large, it
makes a very good indoor subject if given sufficient light. It barely
needs frost protection and so can be grown in an unheated greenhouse or
even in a very sheltered spot out of doors in the South West (of
England, Wales or Ireland). It is as good for long term pot culture as
Monstera or many of the Ficus and is far less demanding in terms of
heat.

"david taylor" wrote in message

Thanks for the encouraging comments re outdoor or cutting back. I
have not
yet decided what to do although the tree is now bending over at the
ceiling.
I may plant it out of doors in a sheltered spot and be prepared to
shroud it
when frost is forecast.
Protection from scorching in strong sunlight is also a necessity.
Regards
David T

Once acclimatised to the outdoors it may not need frost protection
depending on whether you have the true NIP or some other sort of
Araucaria. And once it is acclimatised I'd be quite surprised if it'd
need any protection from scorching in the sunlight of the UK.

And don't plant the thing too close to the house, these things can
grow huge in cold climates (again depending on the variety you have).
I've seen a number of hundred year Araucarias cracking stone walls in
cold climates because they were planted too close to the house.
Araucarias were much favoured by the 19th century gardeners in the
colonies of Australia and many an old homestead is marked by these
lovely trees touring up out of the garden - I've ehard it said that
they were used to act as markers for travellers who travelled long
distances between any signs of settlement.

David, if you do decide to plant your Araucaria out, drape a light
shade cloth/net over it for a week. Then in week two, remove it in
late afternoon, replacing it in the morning. After that, the risk of
sun scorch will be almost nil and the worst you will see is a light
bronzing of the youngest shoots. Wind protection is important, since
the plant cannot withstand the full force of the bitter winds that have
come to characterise late winter in recent years.