Hi Folks

Having lived with a building site garden for 3 years and all the attention spent on the house, we have just spent a large amount of money and physical exertion doing our gardens with borders, decora.tive stones, decking, huge pots, and large plants and trees.....you name it

Since we have just completed this, I have noticed the whole garden is over run with 1000's of tiny bright red spiders. Barely viewable if you were standing up, but if you are close to the ground they are literally running everywhere.

I am worried that after all the effort and investment on plants, these little things will do damage? However they don't see to go near any of the plants that I can see, rather run about on the decking planks, and conrete paths etc. particularly in the dry warm weather.

Any ideas?

Cheers
Alan

I hate to suggest this, but are they red spider mites? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spider_mites

In article ,
beccabunga writes:
|
| Since we have just completed this, I have noticed the whole garden is
| over run with 1000's of tiny bright red spiders. Barely viewable if you
| were standing up, but if you are close to the ground they are literally
| running everywhere.
|
| I am worried that after all the effort and investment on plants, these
| little things will do damage? However they don't see to go near any of
| the plants that I can see, rather run about on the decking planks, and
| conrete paths etc. particularly in the dry warm weather.
|
| I hate to suggest this, but are they red spider mites?
| http://tinyurl.com/4al296

No.

Firstly, red spider mites don't run around. Secondly, they rarely
appear red, even under a magnifying glass. Thirdly, they aren't
found on decking and concrete. Fourthly, the common small, bright
red, spider-like creatures are, in fact, spiders.

All spiders are carnivores, and they will live on microscopic
insects etc. Generally, they help gardeners.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Jun 14, 8:01*am, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,beccabun ga writes:

|
| Since we have just completed this, I have noticed the whole garden is
| over run with 1000's of tiny bright red spiders. Barely viewable if you
| were standing up, but if you are close to the ground they are literally
| running everywhere.
|
| I am worried that after all the effort and investment on plants, these
| little things will do damage? However they don't see to go near any of
| the plants that I can see, rather run about on the decking planks, and
| conrete paths etc. particularly in the dry warm weather.
|
| I hate to suggest this, but are they red spider mites?
|http://tinyurl.com/4al296

No.

Firstly, red spider mites don't run around. *Secondly, they rarely
appear red, even under a magnifying glass. *Thirdly, they aren't
found on decking and concrete. *Fourthly, the common small, bright
red, spider-like creatures are, in fact, spiders.

All spiders are carnivores, and they will live on microscopic
insects etc. *Generally, they help gardeners.

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ; they
are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have no
idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites that
you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that is
based on no particular information.

In article ,
Des Higgins writes:
|
| not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ; they
| are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have no
| idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites that
| you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that is
| based on no particular information.

Actually, the common, bright red, spider-like things that run around
ARE true spiders! They are not mites, as you can see with a good
magnifying glass.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

beccabunga writes

zaria123;798082 Wrote:
Hi Folks

Having lived with a building site garden for 3 years and all the
attention spent on the house, we have just spent a large amount of
money and physical exertion doing our gardens with borders,
decora.tive
stones, decking, huge pots, and large plants and trees.....you name
it

Since we have just completed this, I have noticed the whole garden is
over run with 1000's of tiny bright red spiders. Barely viewable if
you
were standing up, but if you are close to the ground they are
literally
running everywhere.

I am worried that after all the effort and investment on plants,
these
little things will do damage? However they don't see to go near any
of
the plants that I can see, rather run about on the decking planks,
and
conrete paths etc. particularly in the dry warm weather.


I hate to suggest this, but are they red spider mites?
http://tinyurl.com/4al296

No, they are *not* red spider mites. Red spider mites don't run, are
rarely (as in virtually never) found other than on plants (the underside
of leaves or in fine webs on the end shoots if the infestation is very
heavy), are usually drab pale greenish brown (1), are tiny (you have to
be quite short-sighted to see them with the naked eye) - so someone who
was seeing them for the first time would not see enough detail to
describe them as 'tiny spiders', prefer humid to dry conditions.

The little bright red spiders that run around over decking and paving do
no harm to plants - as far as I am aware, they are predators rather than
vegetarians.

(1) despite the red picture in the link above, the text points out that
they are usually greenish brown, and turn red in the winter
--
Kay

On Jun 14, 11:19*am, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,Des Higgins writes:

|
| not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ; they
| are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have no
| idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites that
| you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that is
| based on no particular information.

Actually, the common, bright red, spider-like things that run around
ARE true spiders! *They are not mites, as you can see with a good
magnifying glass.


How do we prove this? I bet 50euro cents that they are not true
spiders (that is worth about 400quid these days). I promise to get
Roy Omond to hand deliver this (he lives in Great Chesterford) if you
are correct.

Just to check, we are talking about the bright scarlet things that
move very quickly and that are very tiny?
They are mites who do indded have 8 legs like spiders but have just
one blob for a body; they do not have a distinct abdomen and head
+thorax like spiders.

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Des Higgins writes:
|
| | not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ; they
| | are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have no
| | idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites that
| | you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that is
| | based on no particular information.
|
| Actually, the common, bright red, spider-like things that run around
| ARE true spiders! =A0They are not mites, as you can see with a good
| magnifying glass.
|
| How do we prove this? I bet 50euro cents that they are not true
| spiders (that is worth about 400quid these days). I promise to get
| Roy Omond to hand deliver this (he lives in Great Chesterford) if you
| are correct.
|
| Just to check, we are talking about the bright scarlet things that
| move very quickly and that are very tiny?

Yes.

| They are mites who do indded have 8 legs like spiders but have just
| one blob for a body; they do not have a distinct abdomen and head
| +thorax like spiders.

Don't bet on it. As far as I know, there are no mites that are fast
moving - indeed, I think that almost all mites are parasitic. Such
creatures almost always have very short legs and move slowly; red
spider mites certainly do.

Also, not all spiders show a clear thorax/abdomen distinction and
spider relatives like harvestmen don't show any. If they look like
mites, but with VERY long legs, harvestmen are a likely guess, and
they are more spiders than mites. Some harvestment have spider-
length legs.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

It appears they have been identified, by a friend of mine as 'Red Velvet Mites'

This is the info I found on them:

The small red creatures (appox 1mm in length) are commonly known as red velvet mites, Allothrombium fuliginosum. This animal overwinters as adult mites in the soil and it is most frequently found at this time of year when it is seen crawling over the soil surface, patio and pavement areas. It is not a harmful mite as the early stages feed as external parasites on certain insects, particularly aphids. The older mite nymphs and the adults feed as predators on aphids. Velvet mites are widely distributed in Britain and may have some effect in reducing aphid infestations, although their impact is likely to be much less than that of other aphid predators, such as ladybirds and hoverfly larvae. Harmless to vegetation and animals / humans.

Also.....
Can this really be said of one of nature's hairy eight-legged arthropods? Absolutely, if it's a red velvet mite. Long a favorite of biologists and children, these ruby gems of the family Trombidiidae are most often sighted on the woodland floors of the world, with millions inhabiting the woods of the Chicago Wilderness region.

"Under the microscope they are beautiful!" says Liam Heneghan, an ecosystem ecologist at DePaul University. "They look like a thumbprint." Most red velvet mites are egg-shaped and less than a millimeter in length. Fine decorative hairs, some of which may serve as feelers, give the creatures their lush red velvet appearance.

Though lovely to the eye, red velvet mites are disliked by the palate: their color may warn predators to the mites' unpleasant taste. "There are stories about biologists popping them into their mouths," says George Hammond, a University of Michigan graduate student who studies velvet mites. Other than ill-advised scientists, however, he knows of no natural enemies of these arachnids: "I've put them on an anthill and no ant would touch them."

Heneghan describes red velvet mites as chelicerates. This means that they have tiny lobster-like claws that serve as mouthparts, a feature that relates them closely to spiders, scorpions, and harvestmen.

Sensitive to humidity and apt to dry out easily, red velvet mites make their home in the litter layer of woodlands and forests. They live from one to several years, Hammond says, depending on the species. As larvae, they attach themselves to a variety of arthropods and feed parasitically. They will suck blood from a gnat or grasshopper, for instance, sometimes hitching a ride with several other mites. When red velvet mites become nymphs and then adults, they take to the soil to devour much smaller prey, including other mites and their eggs, the eggs of insects and snails, and primitive wingless insects. Unlike their brethren the chigger and the tick, the velvets keep their mouthparts off of humans.

The presence of red velvet mites is extremely important to the environment. "These mites are part of a community of soil arthropods that is critical in terms of rates of decomposition in woodlands and in maintaining the structure of the entire ecosystem," says Heneghan. "By feeding on insects that eat fungi and bacteria, they stimulate the decomposition process. And when they are removed from the area, many critical processes in the soil go much slower."

Hammond and Heneghan say they've studied the red velvet mite mating dance, and it's not to be missed. The males release their sperm on small twigs or stalks, in areas that Heneghan likes to refer to as "love gardens." Hammond likens them to an array of tiny golf balls on tees.

That ritual is followed by the male laying down an intricate silken trail to the sperm. Females spot these "artistic" trails, then seek out the individual artist. If he's to her liking, she sits in the sperm. But, warns Heneghan, it's a brutal world out there. If another male spots one of these love gardens, he'll promptly trounce it and lay his own.

The planet is home to millions upon millions of mites. Biologists believe there may be thousands of species of red velvet mite alone. Mites remain an under-researched enigma, says Heneghan. "I think we have no real idea what their role is," he continues. "We've only come to realize the importance of the food web in the soil in the last 15 to 20 years. It is the great undiscovered frontier."

Amazing whats in your back garden!

http://www.ent.orst.edu/bugbook/taxo...thrombium.html

Red Velvet Mites?

Dave

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article
,
Des Higgins writes:
|
| | not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ;
they
| | are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have
no
| | idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites
that
| | you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that
is
| | based on no particular information.
|
| Actually, the common, bright red, spider-like things that run around
| ARE true spiders! =A0They are not mites, as you can see with a good
| magnifying glass.
|
| How do we prove this? I bet 50euro cents that they are not true
| spiders (that is worth about 400quid these days). I promise to get
| Roy Omond to hand deliver this (he lives in Great Chesterford) if you
| are correct.
|
| Just to check, we are talking about the bright scarlet things that
| move very quickly and that are very tiny?

Yes.

| They are mites who do indded have 8 legs like spiders but have just
| one blob for a body; they do not have a distinct abdomen and head
| +thorax like spiders.

Don't bet on it. As far as I know, there are no mites that are fast
moving - indeed, I think that almost all mites are parasitic. Such
creatures almost always have very short legs and move slowly; red
spider mites certainly do.

Also, not all spiders show a clear thorax/abdomen distinction and
spider relatives like harvestmen don't show any. If they look like
mites, but with VERY long legs, harvestmen are a likely guess, and
they are more spiders than mites. Some harvestment have spider-
length legs.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
"Paink1ller" writes:
| http://www.ent.orst.edu/bugbook/taxo...thrombium.html
|
| Red Velvet Mites?

Quite possibly, though I wouldn't call them fast moving. However,
I think that the local genera are different.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Jun 14, 12:48*pm, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,Des Higgins writes:

|
| | not true spiders as such but arachnids (which include spiders) ; they
| | are mites; not red spider mites as you point out; in fact I have no
| | idea which kind apart from being "the tiny fast bright red mites that
| | you see running around on concrete"; they look harmless but that is
| | based on no particular information.
|
| Actually, the common, bright red, spider-like things that run around
| ARE true spiders! =A0They are not mites, as you can see with a good
| magnifying glass.
|
| How do we prove this? *I bet 50euro cents that they are not true
| spiders (that is worth about 400quid these days). * I promise to get
| Roy Omond to hand deliver this (he lives in Great Chesterford) if you
| are correct.
|
| Just to check, we are talking about the bright scarlet things that
| move very quickly and that are very tiny?

Yes.

| They are mites who do indded have 8 legs like spiders but have just
| one blob for a body; they do not have a distinct abdomen and head
| +thorax like spiders.

Don't bet on it. *As far as I know, there are no mites that are fast
moving - indeed, I think that almost all mites are parasitic. *Such
creatures almost always have very short legs and move slowly; red
spider mites certainly do.

Those really, really, tiny, vivid red guys are not true spiders. I
presume they are parasitic on something but what exactly, I have no
idea. ALL true spiders have a "head" (cepahothorax; head and thorax
fused) and an abdomen and these are always distinct.


Also, not all spiders show a clear thorax/abdomen distinction and
spider relatives like harvestmen don't show any.

Harvestmen are not spiders (strictly speaking; informally they get
called harvest spiders but that is loose usage). They are certainly
arachnids, as are mites and scorpions and spiders.

*If they look like
mites, but with VERY long legs, harvestmen are a likely guess, and
they are more spiders than mites. *Some harvestment have spider-
length legs.

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Des Higgins writes:
|
| Those really, really, tiny, vivid red guys are not true spiders. I
| presume they are parasitic on something but what exactly, I have no
| idea. ALL true spiders have a "head" (cepahothorax; head and thorax
| fused) and an abdomen and these are always distinct.

Some are distinct only to an expert, or not at all to the naked eye.
In any case, I have had true spiders like that run around in my garden
(with 6 diopters of short sight and a magnifying glass, I can see quite
a lot of detail).

But it is quite possible that the OP saw velvet mites - they aren't
rare and I had forgotten about them - what I am quite sure of is that
they weren't red spite mite.

| Also, not all spiders show a clear thorax/abdomen distinction and
| spider relatives like harvestmen don't show any.
|
| Harvestmen are not spiders (strictly speaking; informally they get
| called harvest spiders but that is loose usage). They are certainly
| arachnids, as are mites and scorpions and spiders.

Actually, my memory was wrong, and I take it back. They are no more
closely related to spiders than scorpions are. Also, most of them
have VERY long legs.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Jun 14, 5:24*pm, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,Des Higgins writes:

|
| Those really, really, tiny, vivid red guys are not true spiders. *I
| presume they are parasitic on something but what exactly, I have no
| idea. *ALL true spiders have a "head" (cepahothorax; head and thorax
| fused) and an abdomen and these are always distinct.

Some are distinct only to an expert, or not at all to the naked eye.
In any case, I have had true spiders like that run around in my garden
(with 6 diopters of short sight and a magnifying glass, I can see quite
a lot of detail).

But it is quite possible that the OP saw velvet mites - they aren't
rare and I had forgotten about them - what I am quite sure of is that
they weren't red spite mite.


ok agreed;
how come no matter what innocent question get's asked, one always ends
up in a heated argument on usenet. Arachnids are a mite unimportant
for such squabbles. Sorry about the dire pun; you can tick me off.

Des

"Des Higgins" wrote in message
...

... you can tick me off.

Gone away with a flea in your ear?

Mary