"Jaques d'Altrades" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Franz Heymann" contains these
words:

The quince used in Western cuisine is like a big yellow Williams pear,
quite hard, and sour until it is really ripe.

And then it is still sour.


Oh no. Really quite sweet.

Both sour and sweet.

We *ARE* talking about the same sort of
quince, I trust?

I am beginning to doubt it, considering the marked differences in opinion
between Nick and me and between you and me.

About the size of the average orange?

Perhaps somewhat bigger than an orange.

Lovely smell.

Yes, and a lovely flavour

Well, we agree on something!

Three cheers!

Franz

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Jaques d'Altrades wrote:
The message
from "Franz Heymann" contains these
words:

The quince used in Western cuisine is like a big yellow Williams
pear,
quite hard, and sour until it is really ripe.

And then it is still sour.

Oh no. Really quite sweet. We *ARE* talking about the same sort of
quince, I trust? About the size of the average orange?

Yes. And delicious raw - well, at one school only 5 pupils ate them,
and 3 of those were called Maclaren :-)

It was quite a popular fruit in South Africa.
Everybody (?) ate them with pleasure.

But we also chew on sloes ....

Franz

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Franz Heymann wrote:
Boggle. None of the quince trees I have ever seen would grow well
as a hedge, or be suitable for canes. Japonica would.

Nick, I received many a hiding with a quince "cane". In fact, in
Afrikaans
the common word for a "cane" is a "kweperlat", which, retranslated into
English simply becomes "quince stick". Part of the punishment routine
was
that the culprit had to go and cut the damn thing. And in case you ask,
the plants really were quinces and bore quinces as fruit. They looked
and
tasted precisely like the fruit called "quince" in England. And they
made
quince jelly which looks and tastes exactly like the quince jelly I have
eaten in England.

I did not say that I did not believe you. I was boggling. Most quince
trees in this country produce relatively brittle, short shoots. They
wouldn't be of much use for canes until they reach 2" thick - and I
doubt that you were beaten with 2" rods!

Either we are talking about two different plants, or the ones in SA had
adopted a different mode of growth (or vice versa)
The hedge of which I speak was not tended with any particular regularity and
was consequently quite unkempt. It produced many shoots circa 1 cm in
diameter and 1 metre long. Absolutely ideal for meting out chastisement.

In the town where my school was, we were fully familiar with "japonicas".
Incidentally, the quinces of which I speak had yet another use: They
made
excellent catapults.

Not a unique characteristic :-)

Anyway, true quinces are NOT high-acid when ripe, which can be seen
by the fact that jelly made from them needs lemon juice to set well
(or japonica).

The setting is not to do with the acidity, but with the presence of
sufficient pectins.
I do assure you most heartily that ripe quinces are sour.

Having eaten a lot, I don't regard them as sour. Anyway, the setting
of jelly needs pectin, acid and sugar. I can assure you that I tested
for pectin (and there was plenty), and there was enough sugar, but no
set. 50/50 quince and japonica gives a very good set.

It seems almost certain that your quinces were a different variety
to the common ones in the UK, but could they have been Pseudocydonia
sinensis (which I have never seen) rather than Cydonia oblonga?

I am also beginning to think we are talking about two different plants.
Some folk on this thread have talked about quinces as being
(1) Hard as a rock
(2) Pear shaped

The quinces of my youth could be (and were) slaughtered easily with a Boy
Scout's knife. They were only somewhat harder than a firm apple.
They were also not pear shaped at all. More like lumpy spheres of about 8
cm diameter. The lumpiness corresponded to a typical variation in radius
from a true sphere of around +- 5 mm. The surface was woolly, but the wool
rubbed off very easily.

The fruit had a delicious astringent-sweet-acid flavour. The jelly was a
must with lamb.

Franz

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Franz Heymann wrote:
Boggle. None of the quince trees I have ever seen would grow well
as a hedge, or be suitable for canes. Japonica would.

Nick, I received many a hiding with a quince "cane". In fact, in
Afrikaans
the common word for a "cane" is a "kweperlat", which, retranslated into
English simply becomes "quince stick". Part of the punishment routine
was
that the culprit had to go and cut the damn thing. And in case you ask,
the plants really were quinces and bore quinces as fruit. They looked
and
tasted precisely like the fruit called "quince" in England. And they
made
quince jelly which looks and tastes exactly like the quince jelly I have
eaten in England.

I did not say that I did not believe you. I was boggling. Most quince
trees in this country produce relatively brittle, short shoots. They
wouldn't be of much use for canes until they reach 2" thick - and I
doubt that you were beaten with 2" rods!

Either we are talking about two different plants, or the ones in SA had
adopted a different mode of growth (or vice versa)
The hedge of which I speak was not tended with any particular regularity and
was consequently quite unkempt. It produced many shoots circa 1 cm in
diameter and 1 metre long. Absolutely ideal for meting out chastisement.

In the town where my school was, we were fully familiar with "japonicas".
Incidentally, the quinces of which I speak had yet another use: They
made
excellent catapults.

Not a unique characteristic :-)

Anyway, true quinces are NOT high-acid when ripe, which can be seen
by the fact that jelly made from them needs lemon juice to set well
(or japonica).

The setting is not to do with the acidity, but with the presence of
sufficient pectins.
I do assure you most heartily that ripe quinces are sour.

Having eaten a lot, I don't regard them as sour. Anyway, the setting
of jelly needs pectin, acid and sugar. I can assure you that I tested
for pectin (and there was plenty), and there was enough sugar, but no
set. 50/50 quince and japonica gives a very good set.

It seems almost certain that your quinces were a different variety
to the common ones in the UK, but could they have been Pseudocydonia
sinensis (which I have never seen) rather than Cydonia oblonga?

I am also beginning to think we are talking about two different plants.
Some folk on this thread have talked about quinces as being
(1) Hard as a rock
(2) Pear shaped

The quinces of my youth could be (and were) slaughtered easily with a Boy
Scout's knife. They were only somewhat harder than a firm apple.
They were also not pear shaped at all. More like lumpy spheres of about 8
cm diameter. The lumpiness corresponded to a typical variation in radius
from a true sphere of around +- 5 mm. The surface was woolly, but the wool
rubbed off very easily.

The fruit had a delicious astringent-sweet-acid flavour. The jelly was a
must with lamb.

Franz

Yes. And delicious raw - well, at one school only 5 pupils ate them,
and 3 of those were called Maclaren :-)

But we also chew on sloes ....

mouth puckered so much that am speechless

Mary


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

The message
from "Mary Fisher" contains these words:

You can't bite into it - or even hack it with a cleaver - until it's
ripe.
And even then you need muscles like Desperate Dan. Or Popeye.

Ah, but we are the macho sex innit.

Oh.

I didn't know that.

Your place or mine?

I think I'd be more macho in mine. Handbags I understand, but I don't
like the way you drop in casual mentions of cleavers and the like.

Shall I send directions in a plain vanilla cover?

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

The message
from "Franz Heymann" contains these words:

I am also beginning to think we are talking about two different plants.
Some folk on this thread have talked about quinces as being
(1) Hard as a rock
(2) Pear shaped

I dispute the hard as a rock allegation. When ripe the flesh could be
dug out with a spoon, though it was a bit granular.

The quinces of my youth could be (and were) slaughtered easily with a Boy
Scout's knife.

We weren't allowed those at boarding school, but they cut and peeled
well with a penknife.

They were only somewhat harder than a firm apple.

Agreed.

They were also not pear shaped at all.

Ah. Incompatibility sets in. Ours were decidedly pear-shaped - in a
literal sense.

More like lumpy spheres of about 8
cm diameter. The lumpiness corresponded to a typical variation in radius
from a true sphere of around +- 5 mm. The surface was woolly, but the wool
rubbed off very easily.

No. Closer in shape to japonica then.

The fruit had a delicious astringent-sweet-acid flavour. The jelly was a
must with lamb.

Hmmmm.

One of my old fiends (alas, passed away many years ago) used to
scandalise waiters at functions like The Lord Mayor's banuets (He was a
Common Councillor and Freeman of the City of London) by asking for mint
sauce *AND* redcurrant jelly with lamb.

greed

I shall from henceforth demand quince jelly TAAAW.

/greed

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

The message
from "Mary Fisher" contains these words:

Yes. And delicious raw - well, at one school only 5 pupils ate them,
and 3 of those were called Maclaren :-)

But we also chew on sloes ....

mouth puckered so much that am speechless

Out brushing late in the year I sometimes eat the odd really ripe sloe.

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

In article ,
Franz Heymann wrote:

I am also beginning to think we are talking about two different plants.
Some folk on this thread have talked about quinces as being
(1) Hard as a rock
(2) Pear shaped

Some of the variations may indicate the climate difference, but it
sounds as if there are some very different varieties. That isn't
unlikely, as quinces are a very old domestic fruit, and have not
been industrialised as much as many. It would be interesting to
try some cuttings of that hedge in the UK and see what it does!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

Some of the variations may indicate the climate difference, but it
sounds as if there are some very different varieties. That isn't
unlikely, as quinces are a very old domestic fruit, and have not
been industrialised as much as many. It would be interesting to
try some cuttings of that hedge in the UK and see what it does!

Ouch!

Watch where you're using that cane!

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

"Jaques d'Altrades" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Mary Fisher" contains these words:

You can't bite into it - or even hack it with a cleaver - until it's
ripe.
And even then you need muscles like Desperate Dan. Or Popeye.

Ah, but we are the macho sex innit.

Oh.

I didn't know that.

Your place or mine?

I think I'd be more macho in mine. Handbags I understand,

I don't. Don't have one.

but I don't
like the way you drop in casual mentions of cleavers and the like.

I have three - two in the kitchen and one in the tent.

Shall I send directions in a plain vanilla cover?

Yum!

Mary

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Franz Heymann wrote:

I am also beginning to think we are talking about two different plants.
Some folk on this thread have talked about quinces as being
(1) Hard as a rock
(2) Pear shaped

Some of the variations may indicate the climate difference, but it
sounds as if there are some very different varieties. That isn't
unlikely, as quinces are a very old domestic fruit, and have not
been industrialised as much as many. It would be interesting to
try some cuttings of that hedge in the UK and see what it does!

Alas, I matriculated from that school in 1940 and have lost contact with
both the quince hedge and the staff.

Franz

"Jaques d'Altrades" wrote in message
...



One of my old fiends (alas, passed away many years ago)

I didn't know that fiends were mortal.

With apologies from Franz

[snip]

"GoldDustRhiannon" wrote in message
...
Ok You've convinced me ) Anyone got a recipe for quince Jam/jelly? Btw
it was
a plant I inherited not a single fruit ;o)

Lorraine


I've used both these recipes successfully:

QUINCE JELLY

If FULLY ripe fruit is used for this jelly, then 15 g of citric or tartaric
acid should be added to give a good set.

1.8 kg quinces
sugar
3.5 litres water

Wash and chop or mince the fruit, then place it in the pan with 2.25 litres
of the water. Bring to the boil, then reduce the heat and cover the pan.
Simmer the fruit for about 1 hour, until it is reduced to a pulp, then
strain it through a jelly bag for 10-15 minutes.

Replace the pulp in the pan and add the remaining water. Simmer the pulp for
a further 30 minutes before straining it again. Combine both batches of
juice and measure the yield, then test it for setting. Weigh out 350-575 g
sugar per 600 ml juice.

Pour the juice into the clean pan and bring it to the boil, then reduce it
by boiling if necessary. Add the sugar and stir until it has dissolved.
Bring to a full boil and boil hard until setting point is reached.




QUINCE JAM

1.8 kg peeled and cored quinces (prepared weight)
1.15-2.25 litres water
2.75 kg sugar
juice of 2 lemons (optional)


Roughly chop or grate the prepared quinces and place them in the pan with
the water. Pour in the smaller quantity of liquid at first, then add extra
as necessary during cooking. Bring to simmering point, then cover the pan
and cook the fruit over low heat for about 25 minutes, or until it is
tender. Remove the lid and reduce the volume by boiling the pulp in the open
pan. Add the sugar and lemon juice, if used, and stir until the sugar has
dissolved. Bring quickly to a full boil and boil hard until setting point is
reached.


Mary

The message
from "Mary Fisher" contains these words:

Ah, but we are the macho sex innit.

Oh.

I didn't know that.

Your place or mine?

I think I'd be more macho in mine. Handbags I understand,

I don't. Don't have one.

but I don't
like the way you drop in casual mentions of cleavers and the like.

I have three - two in the kitchen and one in the tent.

Good in tent, or evil in tent? Or just loitering?

Shall I send directions in a plain vanilla cover?

Yum!
______________________
|\ /|
| \__________________/ |
|Affix stamp other side|
|(where the vanilla is)|
|______________________|

--
Rusty Hinge
horrid·squeak&zetnet·co·uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/tqt.htm