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#1
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monsteria--no seeds
It's the season for monsteria deliciosa. I don't have any growing
myself, but do come across the odd windfall on suburban footpaths. :-) I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. Any ideas? -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#2
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monsteria--no seeds
On Jul 5, 2:34 pm, John Savage wrote:
It's the season for monsteria deliciosa. I don't have any growing myself, but do come across the odd windfall on suburban footpaths. :-) I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. Any ideas? -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) It would seem that a flowering plant that doesn't produce seeds would be likely to be a failure in the long run but odd things happen in nature. Apparently this has happened reasonably often through mutation and humans have often bred such lines as they are easier to eat without seeds. Does this mean that seedless fruits would have died out without human intervention? I don't know. Some like bananas do quite well propagating vegetatively. Could they do that indefinitely in the wild? Some rarely have viable seeds or their seeds are rarely seen as we propagate them from cuttings, roots etc (potatos, strawberries) but in the right circumstances the seeds will grow. If you wanted to follow it up search for "parthenocarpy" which is the technical term. David |
#3
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monsteria--no seeds
"John Savage" wrote in message om... It's the season for monsteria deliciosa. I don't have any growing myself, but do come across the odd windfall on suburban footpaths. :-) I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. Any ideas? -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) I seem to remember years ago that the Monstera is helped in pollination by a beetle. As the beetle is is not native to Australia it will not set seed as it isn't here. But good news all is not lost. I can vividly see Don Burke massaging the warm flower with his hands. Was rather saucy television for its time slot. They said this method was very successful. Cheers Richard |
#4
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monsteria--no seeds
"Loosecanon" wrote in message ... "John Savage" wrote in message om... It's the season for monsteria deliciosa. I don't have any growing myself, but do come across the odd windfall on suburban footpaths. :-) I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. Any ideas? -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) I seem to remember years ago that the Monstera is helped in pollination by a beetle. As the beetle is is not native to Australia it will not set seed as it isn't here. But good news all is not lost. I can vividly see Don Burke massaging the warm flower with his hands. Was rather saucy television for its time slot. They said this method was very successful. Cheers Richard I found seeds in one of my monstera fruit earlier this year and potted them in some seed mix from curiousity. Two of them sprouted and are growing quite well. I am in Brisbane and we eat the fruit, but this was the first time that I found seeds. Previously I have just taken cuttings off the main stem, which have always grown successfully. |
#5
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monsteria--no seeds
"Loosecanon" writes:
I seem to remember years ago that the Monstera is helped in pollination by a beetle. As the beetle is is not native to Australia it will not set seed as it isn't here. But good news all is not lost. I can vividly see Don Burke massaging the warm flower with his hands. Was rather saucy television for its time slot. They said this method was very successful. I remember that episode, too, and I think you may be misremembering it. I don't think it was a monsteria, but a similar though much larger garden flower. Monsterias around here seem to have no problems being pollinated. Being as they are in mostly shade, you may well be spot on about a beetle being the pollen transport; bees probably would overlook a flower hidden in deep shade. -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#6
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monsteria--no seeds
" writes:
Some like bananas do quite well propagating vegetatively. Could they do that indefinitely in the wild? What you wrote sounds fair enough, but I'm not so sure about bananas. I seem to recall that wild bananas are almost all seeds and little flesh, the seeds being about the size of custard apple seeds. I can't say I've ever heard of monkeys eating wild bananas as part of their natural diet. Anyone? Monsterias are in a different category, because I think that these are still the wild cultivar, I don't think they have been through selective breeding for cultivation. It does seem a waste of energy to produce a large juicy fruit which does nothing to propagate the species when it contains no seeds. Is it a native plant here? I don't see any evidence of any creatures valuing its fruit. (How to explain why Indian Mynahs leave it alone?) -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#7
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monsteria--no seeds
"John Savage" wrote in message
om... " writes: Some like bananas do quite well propagating vegetatively. Could they do that indefinitely in the wild? What you wrote sounds fair enough, but I'm not so sure about bananas. I seem to recall that wild bananas are almost all seeds and little flesh, the seeds being about the size of custard apple seeds. I can't say I've ever heard of monkeys eating wild bananas as part of their natural diet. Anyone? sorry, don't know a thing about wild monkeys & wild bananas, BUT - i do recall that when i was a kid, bananas had seeds in them - tiny, tiny ones like specks, arranged down the middle of the banana; not many & barely visible. now, you don't see seeds in bananas ever. do they grow a different cultivar now? Monsterias are in a different category, because I think that these are still the wild cultivar, I don't think they have been through selective breeding for cultivation. It does seem a waste of energy to produce a large juicy fruit which does nothing to propagate the species when it contains no seeds. Is it a native plant here? I don't see any evidence of any creatures valuing its fruit. (How to explain why Indian Mynahs leave it alone?) i'm really talking out my arse here, so just indulge me g - but it's true that a plant might fruit to attract creatures which perhaps don't eat the fruit or don't spread seed that way, but have some other effect to enhance reproduction. i understand that in warm areas monsteras produce aerial roots (they certainly do at my sister's place in northern nsw!), so attracting animals that tread on the plant somewhat would be likely to lead to layering of the plant & thus to reproduction that way? (for example). having said that, ime most monsteras don't fruit anyway (i assume that while it will grow almost anywhere, it will only fruit in its preferred climate?) so that might have soemthing to do with it - a plant which is keen to fruit (as it were) will do so, whereas a plant for which it's far less "necessary" to fruit might be much more selective. just offering some ideas to annoy you with ;-) kylie |
#8
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monsteria--no seeds
"0tterbot" writes:
recall that when i was a kid, bananas had seeds in them - tiny, tiny ones like specks, arranged down the middle of the banana; not many & barely visible. now, you don't see seeds in bananas ever. do they grow a different cultivar now? I think I remember the same. Since then, banana growers have had to contend with much. Wasn't there a "bunchy-top" disease? Most likely there is constant pressure for a fruit with better appearance, or more-uniform shape, or better keeping quality, etc., and agric research would have to keep coming out with new varieties. I'd say that the relatively quick time to maturity of banana plants (evidenced by the quick recovery from that cyclone carnage a year or two back) would mean that newly developed varieties can be brought to the supermarket shelf in short time compared with, say, apples or mangoes. None the less, I do still find some of those tiny seeds in some bananas. (On those few occasions when I recklessly divert the rent money to purchase half a dozen bananas!) that a plant might fruit to attract creatures which perhaps don't eat the fruit or don't spread seed that way, but have some other effect to enhance reproduction. i understand that in warm areas monsteras produce aerial roots (they certainly do at my sister's place in northern nsw!), so attracting animals that tread on the plant somewhat would be likely to lead to layering of the plant & thus to reproduction that way? (for example). Good thinking 99! Just for the sake of the debate, I could contend that it might be smarter for the plant's flower to simply produce a misleading scent to attract the elephant, or buffalo, whatever, to stomp it into the dirt. :-) just offering some ideas to annoy you with ;-) No, I find it refreshing to be thrown new ideas. :-)) -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#9
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monsteria--no seeds
"Leftred" writes:
I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. I found seeds in one of my monstera fruit earlier this year and potted them in some seed mix from curiousity. Two of them sprouted and are growing quite well. I am in Brisbane and we eat the fruit, but this was the first time that I found seeds. Previously I have just taken cuttings off the main stem, which have always grown successfully. Bravo! Well done! What appearance did the seeds have? True, the plants are easy to propogate from rooted chunks, and hard to kill. -- John Savage (my news address is not valid for email) |
#10
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monsteria--no seeds
John Savage wrote:
"Leftred" writes: I'm always intrigued by the fruit's apparent absence of seeds, as this kind of defeats the propagation purpose of fruit as I understand it. I found seeds in one of my monstera fruit earlier this year and potted them in some seed mix from curiousity. Two of them sprouted and are growing quite well. I am in Brisbane and we eat the fruit, but this was the first time that I found seeds. Previously I have just taken cuttings off the main stem, which have always grown successfully. Bravo! Well done! What appearance did the seeds have? True, the plants are easy to propogate from rooted chunks, and hard to kill. They were green, smooth,slightly oval and about 1cm in diameter. I just put them in some seed raising mix and they sprouted quite readily |
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