I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not overrun
with weeds?

Steve

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not
overrun with weeds?

Steve


I'd mow it as close as possible and cover it with landscape cloth and mulch.
Steve

"Steve Peek" wrote in message
...

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not
overrun with weeds?

Steve


I'd mow it as close as possible and cover it with landscape cloth and
mulch.
Steve
Mulch can harbor pests and disease, better to use a gravel over the cloth
or just a couple of layers of cloth.

"SteveB" wrote:

I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not
overrun with weeds?


If you're "hopefully" going to erect a greenhouse there why would you want
to till or do anything to disturb the ground... you want the ground as
hard/firm as possible, in fact you want a 6" thick layer of inert porous
material as would be used to construct a paver patio, to raise the area
above grade and then redwood/cedar slatted decking pallets for flooring
inside the greenhouse... greenhouses get wet inside, you don't want to be
walking in muck so you will need good drainage. Your project is really no
different from preping an area to erect a storage shed, only you want even
better drainage because unlike with a storage shed you will be watering
inside, and a more stable base to prevent racking or any glass/acrylic
panels are apt to shatter. And be sure to install a system for lashing that
greenhouse firmly to the ground or first strong wind and you'll have no
greenhouse, and if it blows a distance (which it probably will) you may find
yourself buying your neighbor(s) new vehicles, or have to repair their house
when your greenhouse crashes through their living room picture window... I'd
definitely add that greenhouse to your homeowners liability insurance.
Looks like you wussed out with your vegetable garden... I'm sure when next
year rolls around you'll wuss out again, by then you won't even remember any
stinkin' greenhouse... seems the only gardening you do is with your keyboard
and with whatever fertilizer spews out your head. LOL

In article ,
"gunner" wrote:

"Steve Peek" wrote in message
...

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not
overrun with weeds?

Steve


I'd mow it as close as possible and cover it with landscape cloth and
mulch.
Steve
Mulch can harbor pests and disease, better to use a gravel over the cloth
or just a couple of layers of cloth.

But gravel can't feed the soil ecosystem, and in any event, there isn't
anything planted there yet. Even if there were, mulch is an intrinsic
part of organic gardening and conserving water.
--
Racial injustice, war, urban blight, and environmental rape have a common denominator in our exploitative economic system.*
~Channing E. Phillips

http://tinyurl.com/o63ruj
http://countercurrents.org/roberts020709.htm

"Billy" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"gunner" wrote:

"Steve Peek" wrote in message
...

"SteveB" wrote in message
...
I hopefully am going to put a greenhouse where my current garden ..
errrrrrr......... patch of weeds is now.

What would be the best procedure to till this up, kill and pull all
the
things growing there, and get it in shape so that next year I am not
overrun with weeds?

Steve


I'd mow it as close as possible and cover it with landscape cloth and
mulch.
Steve
Mulch can harbor pests and disease, better to use a gravel over the
cloth
or just a couple of layers of cloth.

But gravel can't feed the soil ecosystem, and in any event, there isn't
anything planted there yet. Even if there were, mulch is an intrinsic
part of organic gardening and conserving water.


You are talking apples and oranges billy. It is called controlled
environment agriculture (CEA) for a reason, hopefully you are not growing in
the ground in a green house. That is a waste of money, use a hoop tunnel for
that. Imagine cleaning up blight or wilt with your soil ecosystem in a green
house.

"gunner" wrote


You are talking apples and oranges billy. It is called controlled
environment agriculture (CEA) for a reason, hopefully you are not growing
in the ground in a green house. That is a waste of money, use a hoop
tunnel for that. Imagine cleaning up blight or wilt with your soil
ecosystem in a green house.


Gunner, I'd like to hear your thoughts on a greenhouse versus a hoop tunnel,
as I don't want to make this a big deal and then find out it's all wasted.

Steve

"SteveB" wrote in message
...

"gunner" wrote

Gunner, I'd like to hear your thoughts on a greenhouse versus a hoop
tunnel, as I don't want to make this a big deal and then find out it's all
wasted.

Steve

Until you can tell us what your goal is Steve, any Internet advice it is a
crap shoot of best intended, oft misguided information. billy and Sheldon
have actually given some good advice, past and present (don't ever tell
them I said that) if you can get through their BS and put into your
situation. Yet, as you may have noticed you get a lot of distractive loony
tough talk from the little boys in the back of the fight crowd. Ignore it as
the old "don't wrestle with a pig" story.

Are you sold on using dirt?

S. Utah wasn't it? Four Cornors or Western side? High coutry or desert
floor?

Ever do a soil analysis? Water tests? If you can't get soil done locally or
it is costly try UofMass:
http://www.umass.edu/plsoils/soiltest/services1.htm

It is important if you are running a green house to know a bit of these
factors, any growing actually, but you can wing it a bit better with dirt.
At the very least ask your local Ag Ext guy/gal what the ave.. composition
and ave. pH is. Other things you might want to know are a bit of climatic
data; monthly highs and lows, ave. rainfall, humidity, Sunlight ( PAR,
length of day, etc.). http://tinyurl.com/y2bho9 many other resources,
search them out!

I remember the melons, but what about tomatoes/peppers? lettuces? herbs?...
Give a quick who, what, why.... It can be broad; I want to feed my family
of x with x.... I can devote x time to my garden, I want to grow x... I
have x $s budgeted.

Meanwhile, here is a short link on the basics of high/low
http://plasticulture.cas.psu.edu/H-tunnels.html
go through the left hand side to read more general info.
another:
http://www.noble.org/Ag/Horticulture...use/index.html

if you like that one, adapt this longer version here to your situation:
http://www.noble.org/Ag/Horticulture...roduction.html
again, the left side.

There are plenty of free plans/material lists for tunnels, GHs, cold frames
etc.available. depends on the size you want or can manage

My initial recommendation for you is to try hoop on raised beds first to
see if this is for you and then move up. You can easily extend the season
and fix those cold desert nights but I feel the biggest problem you will
face is ventilation ( GH or Hoop). Like a car, the temps inside a CEA
structure can jump up real quick with a bit of sun. You will be rolling
those windows up and down alot. When the hot summer sun
hits you will want to switch to shade cloth and maybe misters to cool it
down, then back to plastic when the Indian summer wanes.

Now lets go to "Hooked on 'ponics" Light is what you need most, you don't
need much water and you don't need dirt.

Do understand the protective structure and the growing method are separate
entities. Build a structure to extend your seasons and consider moving
towards one of the Hydroponics methods, especially in your arid
environment. Hydroponics can be simple or highly complex. Hell, I bet I can
even teach Charlie to do it. A 2004 Sandia NL project has showed that
Hydroponic GHs in NM could reduce 800,000 acre-feet of water to 1,000 to
produce the equivalent livestock crop production and do it on 1,000 acres
instead of 260, 000. 80% of water use in NM is for agriculture and over
half of NM is Federal land so there is not much to grow and build on.

Being Organic is a good back to the basics concept but you can go a step
further and really help the world's future with 'ponics. Let me know if you
want to consider this area because you should design it first rather than
retrofit it in.

Gunner

"gunner" wrote

Until you can tell us what your goal is Steve, any Internet advice it is a
crap shoot of best intended, oft misguided information. billy and Sheldon
have actually given some good advice, past and present (don't ever tell
them I said that) if you can get through their BS and put into your
situation. Yet, as you may have noticed you get a lot of distractive loony
tough talk from the little boys in the back of the fight crowd. Ignore it
as
the old "don't wrestle with a pig" story.

Are you sold on using dirt?

S. Utah wasn't it? Four Cornors or Western side? High coutry or desert
floor?

Ever do a soil analysis? Water tests? If you can't get soil done locally
or
it is costly try UofMass:
http://www.umass.edu/plsoils/soiltest/services1.htm

I have two acres in SW Utah, about twenty five miles in. It is at 3700'
elevation. Soil is sand and lava. Hot for a couple of months in summer,
not too cold in winter, and would be a decent growing season with some
structure. My neighbor built a greenhouse, and really extended his season
and output.

I'm more into storable fruits and vegetables. A couple of tomato plants are
enough. I like them, but don't like when so many come that you can't eat
them all. Same for cukes. I do like melons, and want to have enough of
them so I can have continuous melons through the season. Squash does good.
Haven't had luck with beans. Grapes are good and I have some good
established vines. May try wine and beer making, as Utah has dark ages
liquor laws. Really just would like to have a protected environment to grow
things, and then outside, I can do melons, fruit trees, squash, and things
that take up a lot of room.

I like the dirt idea. My nursery lady says just to add enough amendments
until you get it right, and not many problems. My garden should be there
this coming spring with a few more bales and bags of this and that.

I want maximum yield with minimum digging. I know that's not possible, but
I cannot go out there and do this in the heat of summer, and I'm not
interested in all the tree hugger mentality of recycling everything down to
tampons.

Temperature is a problem here in summer, as it gets hot. Just for a couple
of months, but whoo. In the winter, it gets frosty, down in the twenties,
but is nice during the days. Not a long lengthy snow or cold season.

Don't want to go totally self sustaining, or take on another full time hard
job. Just want to utilize and maximize. Yes, have checked local sources,
co-op, nurseries, etc. Will take soil and have it tested this next spring.

Just making a plan now.

Steve

"SteveB" wrote:

I have two acres in SW Utah.

Nothing, absolutely nothing will grow there, forget gardening, expend your
energies locating multiple wives.

"SteveB" wrote in message
...

"gunner" wrote
I like the dirt idea. My nursery lady says just to add enough amendments
until you get it right, and not many problems.

My nursery told me to add lime and bonemeal, but I got the soil analysis in
first and boy, was she wrong.
Lesson learned, trust science not the lady selling you stuff. get the test
done soonest.

My garden should be there
this coming spring with a few more bales and bags of this and that.

I want maximum yield with minimum digging. I know that's not possible

Yes it is......#5 pro pots, 5 squat pots, 5 gal. buckets, gro-bags... no
digging
hook up drip irrigation and a timer, even better

Temperature is a problem here in summer, as it gets hot.

a couple of 20" box fans and a Patio mister work well, I have panels that I
can take out and put up screen.

Just for a couple of months, but whoo. In the winter, it gets frosty,
down in the twenties, but is nice during the days. Not a long lengthy snow
or cold season.

work out passive solar... Concentrate on the roots,.. heating mats & Old
christmas lights work, Need I say the new LED lights don't? try bubble wrap
for xtra insulation on the inside of the house. A small weber grill and
charcoal will heat up a shed size GH in a pinch.

Don't want to go totally self sustaining, or take on another full time
hard job. Just want to utilize and maximize. Yes, have checked local
sources, co-op, nurseries, etc. Will take soil and have it tested this
next spring.

Just making a plan now.

Steve

every year I work on a new one.

good luck Steve
Gunner