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#91
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Eradicating BBA
This has been quite a lively discussion. I had no idea when I posted my
question that I was opening pandora's box. Reading some of the other last posts above is fascinating. I can't help but think about the political and social persuasions behind some of these posts. I really never gave it any thought before that asking a question about aquariums had social aspects to it, but I see now that the response of a particular person to such a question is entirely prejudiced by their own envrionmental point of view. I am certainly in the camp that believes technology is a good thing and to be used to the fullest extent. Others are obviously more in the eco-nature group that don't like chemicals. I wonder if they go to doctors or refuse all medicine. In any event, I like living in the modern technology based society and have no desire to follow the teachings of the Kaczynski manifesto, or to return to those fun filled times of the middle ages where they probably had little time for aquariums. But I digress... I assume if you measured GH that you measured KH also? I lost my KH test kit sometime ago. The results of GH/FH were never very interesting. My water is always mild here. Nothing special hard or soft wise. Tap water is always 7.0 ph here. I don't use the test kits much anymore. I have a bunch of them, but I can tell what they will say just by looking at the tank. Chris. |
#92
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Eradicating BBA
"Chris_S" wrote in message ... This has been quite a lively discussion. I had no idea when I posted my question that I was opening pandora's box. Reading some of the other last posts above is fascinating. I can't help but think about the political and social persuasions behind some of these posts. I really never gave it any thought before that asking a question about aquariums had social aspects to it, but I see now that the response of a particular person to such a question is entirely prejudiced by their own envrionmental point of view. I am certainly in the camp that believes technology is a good thing and to be used to the fullest extent. Others are obviously more in the eco-nature group that don't like chemicals. I wonder if they go to doctors or refuse all medicine. In any event, I like living in the modern technology based society and have no desire to follow the teachings of the Kaczynski manifesto, or to return to those fun filled times of the middle ages where they probably had little time for aquariums. But I digress... I assume if you measured GH that you measured KH also? I lost my KH test kit sometime ago. The results of GH/FH were never very interesting. My water is always mild here. Nothing special hard or soft wise. Tap water is always 7.0 ph here. I don't use the test kits much anymore. I have a bunch of them, but I can tell what they will say just by looking at the tank. Hey , "looking at the tank" its not very cientific or technological!!! I guess also you use your "intuition" or inner you....JMHO Chris. |
#93
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Eradicating BBA
"Chris_S" wrote in message ... This has been quite a lively discussion. I had no idea when I posted my question that I was opening pandora's box. Reading some of the other last posts above is fascinating. I can't help but think about the political and social persuasions behind some of these posts. I really never gave it any thought before that asking a question about aquariums had social aspects to it, but I see now that the response of a particular person to such a question is entirely prejudiced by their own envrionmental point of view. I am certainly in the camp that believes technology is a good thing and to be used to the fullest extent. Others are obviously more in the eco-nature group that don't like chemicals. I wonder if they go to doctors or refuse all medicine. In any event, I like living in the modern technology based society and have no desire to follow the teachings of the Kaczynski manifesto, or to return to those fun filled times of the middle ages where they probably had little time for aquariums. But I digress... I assume if you measured GH that you measured KH also? I lost my KH test kit sometime ago. The results of GH/FH were never very interesting. My water is always mild here. Nothing special hard or soft wise. Tap water is always 7.0 ph here. I don't use the test kits much anymore. I have a bunch of them, but I can tell what they will say just by looking at the tank. Hey , "looking at the tank" its not very cientific or technological!!! I guess also you use your "intuition" or inner you....JMHO Chris. |
#94
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Eradicating BBA
"Chris_S" wrote in message ... This has been quite a lively discussion. I had no idea when I posted my question that I was opening pandora's box. Reading some of the other last posts above is fascinating. I can't help but think about the political and social persuasions behind some of these posts. I really never gave it any thought before that asking a question about aquariums had social aspects to it, but I see now that the response of a particular person to such a question is entirely prejudiced by their own envrionmental point of view. I am certainly in the camp that believes technology is a good thing and to be used to the fullest extent. Others are obviously more in the eco-nature group that don't like chemicals. I wonder if they go to doctors or refuse all medicine. In any event, I like living in the modern technology based society and have no desire to follow the teachings of the Kaczynski manifesto, or to return to those fun filled times of the middle ages where they probably had little time for aquariums. But I digress... I assume if you measured GH that you measured KH also? I lost my KH test kit sometime ago. The results of GH/FH were never very interesting. My water is always mild here. Nothing special hard or soft wise. Tap water is always 7.0 ph here. I don't use the test kits much anymore. I have a bunch of them, but I can tell what they will say just by looking at the tank. Chris. so how did you determine that your CO2 level is 25 PPM? Are you going by your PH levels and what your KH used to be. I think you posted that your GH was 6 degrees. With a PH of 6.8 and at about 25 ppm CO2 you would or should have a KH around 5.6 d or 100 PPM. Your KH should be about 70% (if I remember correctly) of your GH. I'm not sure if having your GH and KH about the same would have any effect or not. Rick Rick |
#95
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Eradicating BBA
This has been quite a lively discussion. I had no
idea when I posted my question that I was Yours was definitely post of the month! I can't help but think about the political and social persuasions behind some of these posts. This is a hobby and many like to practice it in different ways. I wouldn't say somebody else's method is better or worse if it achieves the same result. I however, like you Chris, prefer the quicker and less painful way to my goal. (If I were a female going to give a child birth I wouldn't be a hero but I would ask for strong pain killers). Just one question. I know you did try SAE's at one point and they didn't help. Do you still have them in that affected tank? When I was in a similar situation I noticed SAE's only being interested in the new algae growth. The old, long stuff, they would not touch. Some leaves that had a lot of it were cut. Some plants were bleached. It's been well over a year and no BBA (and no other algae) problem. I would not worry about every little spore of algae. If you are willing to have some SAE's you should be okay. -- Regards, Marvin Hlavac Toronto, Canada |
#96
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Eradicating BBA
Is there a website that elaborates on the Tom Barr method of dosing?
http://www.dlink.org/aqua/e_index.html |
#97
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Eradicating BBA
"Aqua" wrote in message om... Is there a website that elaborates on the Tom Barr method of dosing? http://www.dlink.org/aqua/e_index.html Tom is a regular contributor to the Aquatic Plants list which you can join at http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listin...quatic-plants. This is an excellent site for just about everything to do with plants and even fish. Members of the group are very helpful and include several noted plant experts. Join the list and post a message giving complete details of your tank, water, plant load, etc and ask for advice on Tom Barr dosing. I'm sure you will find that Tom will come back with a dosing schedule for you. Basically Tom's method or at least the one he provided me was dry dosing ferts a couple of times a week and doing weekly 50% water changes which resets the tank and does not allow the ferts to build up to dangerous levels. I did it since November and it did improve the overall condition of my plants. I have just recently gone back to dosing PMDD and biweekly water changes to see what if any difference it will make. Rick |
#98
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Eradicating BBA
Is there a website that elaborates on the Tom Barr method of dosing?
http://www.dlink.org/aqua/e_index.html |
#99
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Eradicating BBA
"Aqua" wrote in message om... Is there a website that elaborates on the Tom Barr method of dosing? http://www.dlink.org/aqua/e_index.html Tom is a regular contributor to the Aquatic Plants list which you can join at http://www.actwin.com/mailman/listin...quatic-plants. This is an excellent site for just about everything to do with plants and even fish. Members of the group are very helpful and include several noted plant experts. Join the list and post a message giving complete details of your tank, water, plant load, etc and ask for advice on Tom Barr dosing. I'm sure you will find that Tom will come back with a dosing schedule for you. Basically Tom's method or at least the one he provided me was dry dosing ferts a couple of times a week and doing weekly 50% water changes which resets the tank and does not allow the ferts to build up to dangerous levels. I did it since November and it did improve the overall condition of my plants. I have just recently gone back to dosing PMDD and biweekly water changes to see what if any difference it will make. Rick |
#100
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Eradicating BBA
"Chris_S" wrote in message ... I guess I no longer believe that there are any water conditions under which BBA will not survive. Sure you can make it grow faster or slower, but the point is it keeps growing once it is in your tank. That is not true with Green algae. That you can control and essentially make it disappear. I've never had any significant problem with Green algae. Once you have it in your tank, well I guess you could say it's probably like having Herpes. You just have to learn how to live with it. I am fed up living with it and I want it out. Regards, Chris. You are right in one regard, there are not really any water conditions where BBA won't grow. There are conditions where plants grow well enough that BBA essentially disappears. Spores are everywhere, no matter what you do sooner or later everything will find its way into your tank. If you have good balanced conditions you don't have problems. Sadly balanced conditions in a tiny artificial ecosystem are hard to come by. You need balanced conditions where the plants grow well and they will not be over powered by algae. You can spend bucks testing or use Tom's method of dosing ferts and water changes. A lot of Tom's ideas are based on solid experimental work and research. It is fascinating to spend part of an afternoon listening to him talk about the science and practical experience behind his ideas with experienced planted aquarium types. I have to chuckle watching guys with kids (and tanks) older than Tom listen and agree with his methods. It isn't the only way, but it works. I personally have had really bad experience with chemicals. Actually I had my best luck using pristine water out of the big springs along the Snake River. Never had any kind of problems, but it is a bit of a long drive these days from the Bay Area. Bob |
#101
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Eradicating BBA
"Chris_S" wrote in message ... I guess I no longer believe that there are any water conditions under which BBA will not survive. Sure you can make it grow faster or slower, but the point is it keeps growing once it is in your tank. That is not true with Green algae. That you can control and essentially make it disappear. I've never had any significant problem with Green algae. Once you have it in your tank, well I guess you could say it's probably like having Herpes. You just have to learn how to live with it. I am fed up living with it and I want it out. Regards, Chris. You are right in one regard, there are not really any water conditions where BBA won't grow. There are conditions where plants grow well enough that BBA essentially disappears. Spores are everywhere, no matter what you do sooner or later everything will find its way into your tank. If you have good balanced conditions you don't have problems. Sadly balanced conditions in a tiny artificial ecosystem are hard to come by. You need balanced conditions where the plants grow well and they will not be over powered by algae. You can spend bucks testing or use Tom's method of dosing ferts and water changes. A lot of Tom's ideas are based on solid experimental work and research. It is fascinating to spend part of an afternoon listening to him talk about the science and practical experience behind his ideas with experienced planted aquarium types. I have to chuckle watching guys with kids (and tanks) older than Tom listen and agree with his methods. It isn't the only way, but it works. I personally have had really bad experience with chemicals. Actually I had my best luck using pristine water out of the big springs along the Snake River. Never had any kind of problems, but it is a bit of a long drive these days from the Bay Area. Bob |
#102
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Eradicating BBA
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... I can only offer 2 words of advice... Manual Removal - if it's not there, it_Can't_ grow... right? If you have it, you must "Manually Remove" what you can... on substrate, plants, equipment... entirely submersing them in chlorine will chemically remove it... getting rid of it, totally is a hard job... slow but steady manual removal is indeed the slowest but most promising method. A little at a time, will rid your tank of it... Ok, with that said, I ask, will it grow back? If you repeat what started it, yes... If you follow a somewhat strict regimen of CO2, Ferts, and water changes, it'll probably STOP growing, go dormant and may even subside... that I cannot prove, but mine is no longer growing.... When all else seems like it'll too fail, you can always try what someone suggests... it doesn't hurt.. I was the one saying I was going to tear this tank down to the stand and clean it... instead, I removed it manually, added CO2, and ferts, and slowly but surely, it's being removed.... daily. -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! Mine hides under a tangled mess of Java fern. One of these I'll have to pull the fern for a peroxide dip, but I'm lazy and it is behaving ;-) bob |
#103
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Eradicating BBA
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... I can only offer 2 words of advice... Manual Removal - if it's not there, it_Can't_ grow... right? If you have it, you must "Manually Remove" what you can... on substrate, plants, equipment... entirely submersing them in chlorine will chemically remove it... getting rid of it, totally is a hard job... slow but steady manual removal is indeed the slowest but most promising method. A little at a time, will rid your tank of it... Ok, with that said, I ask, will it grow back? If you repeat what started it, yes... If you follow a somewhat strict regimen of CO2, Ferts, and water changes, it'll probably STOP growing, go dormant and may even subside... that I cannot prove, but mine is no longer growing.... When all else seems like it'll too fail, you can always try what someone suggests... it doesn't hurt.. I was the one saying I was going to tear this tank down to the stand and clean it... instead, I removed it manually, added CO2, and ferts, and slowly but surely, it's being removed.... daily. -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! Mine hides under a tangled mess of Java fern. One of these I'll have to pull the fern for a peroxide dip, but I'm lazy and it is behaving ;-) bob |
#104
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Eradicating BBA
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... No Red NOooooooooo....Don't do it, come back to the light side Don't let these heathens suck you down. LOL HA-HA!!! I'm not particularly looking forward to it, I'm trying the CO2, ferts idea for a while first... but after some reading... eeehh??? -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! Actually peroxide does just as well, it dies and ... turns white or pink, then often gets eaten.... I've been told a big syringe using a needle for proper placement can kill it in the tank. never tried that though. Might beat tearing up the tank. Bob |
#105
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Eradicating BBA
"RedForeman ©®" wrote in message ... No Red NOooooooooo....Don't do it, come back to the light side Don't let these heathens suck you down. LOL HA-HA!!! I'm not particularly looking forward to it, I'm trying the CO2, ferts idea for a while first... but after some reading... eeehh??? -- RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike streetfighter!!! Actually peroxide does just as well, it dies and ... turns white or pink, then often gets eaten.... I've been told a big syringe using a needle for proper placement can kill it in the tank. never tried that though. Might beat tearing up the tank. Bob |
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