Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it. (It does, however, attract Ruby-throated
Hummingbirds.) This is a beautiful plant, very PM resistant, with huge deep
red flowers and a long bloom season. I'm really curious about the lack of
insect pollinators (except some moth, it seems, that lays eggs so its larvae
can mutilate the blooms....), since bee balm is normally a major attractant.
And yes, I've got lots of bees of many species.

Best,
Tyra
nNJ usa z7

Xref: kermit rec.gardens:241711

In article ,
oway (Tyra Trevellyn) wrote:

Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it. (It does, however, attract Ruby-throated
Hummingbirds.) This is a beautiful plant, very PM resistant, with huge deep
red flowers and a long bloom season. I'm really curious about the lack of
insect pollinators (except some moth, it seems, that lays eggs so its larvae
can mutilate the blooms....), since bee balm is normally a major attractant.
And yes, I've got lots of bees of many species.

Best,
Tyra
nNJ usa z7

How odd. I have a patch of Jacob Kline and there are usually bees on the
big red flowers, but the same general strip of sun-garden also has a
purple beebalm, plus penstemons, globe thistles, campanulas, climbing
honeysuckles, &c., so it's not like Jacob Kline has to do it all alone, so
I don't know what would happen otherwise.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

From: (paghat)
Date: Tue, Jul 29, 2003 3:08 PM
Message-id:

In article ,
(Tyra Trevellyn) wrote:

Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety
I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never
in
the three years I've grown it. (It does, however, attract Ruby-throated
Hummingbirds.) This is a beautiful plant, very PM resistant, with huge
deep
red flowers and a long bloom season. I'm really curious about the lack
of
insect pollinators (except some moth, it seems, that lays eggs so its
larvae
can mutilate the blooms....), since bee balm is normally a major attractant.

And yes, I've got lots of bees of many species.

Best,
Tyra
nNJ usa z7

How odd. I have a patch of Jacob Kline and there are usually bees on the
big red flowers, but the same general strip of sun-garden also has a
purple beebalm, plus penstemons, globe thistles, campanulas, climbing
honeysuckles, &c., so it's not like Jacob Kline has to do it all alone,
so
I don't know what would happen otherwise.

-paghat the ratgirl

Thanks for the info, 'cause I thought perhaps it was the variety itself
(although I've been reading everything I can about it and nothing indicates a
reason for bee-lessness). Nope, the plants are surrounded by bee-heavy
Veronica, Shasta daisies, Rudbeckias, etc. Since this huge clump began for me
as one four-inch pot, perhaps there was something about the original plant, if
something like that is possible.

Best,
Tyra
nNJ usa z7

oway (Tyra Trevellyn) wrote in message ...
Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it. (It does, however, attract Ruby-throated
Hummingbirds.) This is a beautiful plant, very PM resistant, with huge deep
red flowers and a long bloom season. I'm really curious about the lack of
insect pollinators (except some moth, it seems, that lays eggs so its larvae
can mutilate the blooms....), since bee balm is normally a major attractant.
And yes, I've got lots of bees of many species.

Best,
Tyra
nNJ usa z7

In some long tubular flowers of which Monarda is certainly one, bees
do not have long enough tongues to reach the nectar and must either
wait until another insect has cut into the flower from the side or
make the cut themselves.

From: tyratree

Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it.

Interesting. I used to grow a red-flowered monarda right alongside one of the
purple ones. The purple one was overrun with bumblebees, the red one, just as
you describe, untouched. I don't recall the flower size to be different on the
two plants. I assume it was a color issue; bumblebees always seemed more
attracted to the purples in my garden.

bianca
zone 6-7 Long Island

(flicker) wrote in message ...
From: tyratree

Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it.

Interesting. I used to grow a red-flowered monarda right alongside one of the
purple ones. The purple one was overrun with bumblebees, the red one, just as
you describe, untouched. I don't recall the flower size to be different on the
two plants. I assume it was a color issue; bumblebees always seemed more
attracted to the purples in my garden.

bianca
zone 6-7 Long Island

Bees vision extends up into the ultraviolet spectrum but on the low
end it stops short and they percieve no difference between red and
black.
Many flowers reflect interesting patterns that we cannot percieve in
the UV spectrum and bees see these well.
On a cloudy day bees fix the angle of the sun by the polarization of
UV light filtering through the clouds.
Of course they have had many more millions of years to evolve than us
and can do more with less

In article ,
(Beecrofter) wrote:

(flicker) wrote in message
...
From: tyratree

Does anyone here grow Monarda 'Jacob Cline'? This is the only
variety I've
ever experienced that attracts absolutely NO bees or
butterflies....never in
the three years I've grown it.

Interesting. I used to grow a red-flowered monarda right alongside
one of the
purple ones. The purple one was overrun with bumblebees, the red one,
just as
you describe, untouched. I don't recall the flower size to be
different on the
two plants. I assume it was a color issue; bumblebees always seemed more
attracted to the purples in my garden.

bianca
zone 6-7 Long Island

Bees vision extends up into the ultraviolet spectrum but on the low
end it stops short and they percieve no difference between red and
black.
Many flowers reflect interesting patterns that we cannot percieve in
the UV spectrum and bees see these well.
On a cloudy day bees fix the angle of the sun by the polarization of
UV light filtering through the clouds.
Of course they have had many more millions of years to evolve than us
and can do more with less

I've seen many UV pics of flowers & what seemed to be generally true is
that what bees & moths see may be a lot brighter & gaudier than what we
see, or may be so dark as to be practically invisible to them though very
colorful to us. The flowers that look gaudiest under UV are probably
attempting to appeal to multiple pollinators, while those which are
simple-looking in the UV range are more apt to have a specialist
pollinator & aren't as eager to be mucked with by the wrong insect. Some
few under UV even have glowy parts that look like insects, & a perfume
that attracts pollinators eager to mate rather than gather food, & perform
pollination while trying to Get It On with the flower's sex organs.

I was under the impression that bees (large ones at least, including
honeybees) aren't all that fussy & see pretty much the full range of
flower colors as equally significant. Not so? Any pattern or color at any
spectrum honeybees would either not see at all or intentionally ignore?

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/

From: paghat@netscapeSPAM-ME-NOT.

I was under the impression that bees (large ones at least, including
honeybees) aren't all that fussy & see pretty much the full range of
flower colors as equally significant. Not so? Any pattern or color at any
spectrum honeybees would either not see at all or intentionally ignore?

I'm not the bee expert, but in my experience, the bees in my garden have always
favored the violets, pinks, and light purple flowers. They are all over the
purple coneflower, violet monarda, violet butterfly bush, joe-pye weed,
catmint, etc. But they are not as enthusiastic for the yellows, like
black-eyed susans, and the reds, like the monarda.

Bianca
zone 6-7 Long Island

I'm not the bee expert, but in my experience, the bees in my garden have always
favored the violets, pinks, and light purple flowers. They are all over the
purple coneflower, violet monarda, violet butterfly bush, joe-pye weed,
catmint, etc. But they are not as enthusiastic for the yellows, like
black-eyed susans, and the reds, like the monarda.

Bianca
zone 6-7 Long Island

Right now the bees are finishing the last of the sumac, they will be
moving on to goldenrod and japanese knotweed. I haven't been in the
wet areas to see if Clethra is still blooming.
Honeybees go for the best nectar and pollen sources they can find and
tend to work those blossoms until they run out. They have an
incredibly sensitive sense of smell.

Across the sound from Lawn Guy Land
After a zone 5 winter they tell us we might be zone 7
Yeah right

This thread made me look most closely at my "Jacob Kline" patch & my
equally red "Raspberry Wine" patch, & there's no question about it, the
bees are all over them. That bees bypass bright red monardas in other
peoples' gardens still quite amazes me. I liked both the theory that the
very-slender tubes were difficult for the bees to reach into, or that
either the red or whatever color they are under UV color doesn't attract
them, except bees are fully attracted to mine. I watched a bumblebee
scurring eagerly from one tube to the next, sticking its little head
underneath the lip of the tube, I pushing straight down into the tube
apparently rewarded by the push. I did notice, however, that more bees (&
more kinds of bees) were visiting the "Ace of Spades" scabiosa growing
amidst the "Raspberry Wine" monarda.

-paghat the ratgirl

--
"Of what are you afraid, my child?" inquired the kindly teacher.
"Oh, sir! The flowers, they are wild," replied the timid creature.
-from Peter Newell's "Wild Flowers"
See the Garden of Paghat the Ratgirl: http://www.paghat.com/