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#16
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching - eggs
Koi-Lo wrote: My largest koi is apparently female because there are thousands of eggs suddenly covering the sides and plants of my pond!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How do I get rid of them? They'll eat most of them. Are you sure they're koi eggs and not newt, frog or toad eggs? :-) I'm pretty sure. I scoured the internet for pictures of koi eggs and mine look identical. Aren't frog/toad eggs blackish in a gel like substance? These eggs in my pond are EVERYWHERE. And my largest koi (8 inches) did suddenly look less round. I tried scraping them off but this just makes a mess, and I don't want to ruin the water any more. The eggs are REALLY stuck on the sides and are hard to come off. Should I just leave them? Koi eggs should come off rather easily. I'm surprised they didn't eat all those you can see. They may not be koi eggs. Your koi are awfully small to be breeding. Maybe someone else can suggest how you can handle these eggs. They are probably not very hungry because of the nitrite levels. After my 50% water change yesterday, the levels were again sky high at over 1.0 mg/L today. I did another 50% water change tonight. The ones on the plants came off easily, but not the ones on the sides of the pre-form. I don't know if my other fish are old enough to fertilize. They are only 4 inches long. I doubt the eggs were fertilized. They'll turn white and disintegrate (if koi eggs). Did you see breeding activity? Not really. Since yesterday they have been pre-occupied scratching themselves against the pump (swimming above it real fast and then turning on their side). I did notice tonight that some of the eggs are turning white. I think I'll go tomorrow and get something for parasites. I'm in Canada so I can't find the dyacide.... but I will look for something comparable. Any suggestions? Kelly |
#17
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching - eggs
*Note: There are two "Koi-Lo's" on the pond and aquaria groups.
"Kelly" wrote in message oups.com... Koi-Lo wrote: They'll eat most of them. Are you sure they're koi eggs and not newt, frog or toad eggs? :-) I'm pretty sure. I scoured the internet for pictures of koi eggs and mine look identical. Aren't frog/toad eggs blackish in a gel like substance? These eggs in my pond are EVERYWHERE. And my largest koi (8 inches) did suddenly look less round. Yes, frog, toad and newt eggs are laid in a jell, are dark and don't "stick" to the sides. These must be koi eggs. Koi eggs should come off rather easily. I'm surprised they didn't eat all those you can see. They may not be koi eggs. Your koi are awfully small to be breeding. Maybe someone else can suggest how you can handle these eggs. They are probably not very hungry because of the nitrite levels. After my 50% water change yesterday, the levels were again sky high at over 1.0 mg/L today. I did another 50% water change tonight. The ones on the plants came off easily, but not the ones on the sides of the pre-form. Well, no one can say for sure, but they probably wont hatch since the others are so small - but you never know. If they do hatch you can always net them out to another container. I don't know if my other fish are old enough to fertilize. They are only 4 inches long. I doubt the eggs were fertilized. They'll turn white and disintegrate (if koi eggs). Did you see breeding activity? Not really. Since yesterday they have been pre-occupied scratching themselves against the pump (swimming above it real fast and then turning on their side). I did notice tonight that some of the eggs are turning white. I wouldn't worry about the eggs at this point. The scratching would have me very concerned. Others may disagree but I would get a broad spectrum parasite killer and treat them to be on the safe side. Many are made for pond fish. The problem is, you don't know what parasite to treat for without scrapings. With koi, ulcer disease is always a threat where parasites are concerned. I think I'll go tomorrow and get something for parasites. I'm in Canada so I can't find the dyacide.... but I will look for something comparable. Any suggestions? I use Potassium Permanganate (called PP) but you must be very careful with this one. I also use Quick-Cure and/or Aquara-Sol which are safer, but don't get all the parasites out there. If you can't get PP, then go for the Quick-Cure. Unfortunately both may effect your biological filter to some degree. Salt is less likely to do that but you'd have to remove all the plants. Salt gets most parasites. -- Koi-Lo.... Frugal ponding since 1995. My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://tinyurl.com/9do58 ~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({* |
#18
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching - eggs
Yet anopther dumb assed Canuck ****ing up their fish.Y'all need to screwing polar bears and making maple syrup.... On 31 May 2006 17:33:12 -0700, "Kelly" wrote: Koi-Lo wrote: My largest koi is apparently female because there are thousands of eggs suddenly covering the sides and plants of my pond!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How do I get rid of them? They'll eat most of them. Are you sure they're koi eggs and not newt, frog or toad eggs? :-) I'm pretty sure. I scoured the internet for pictures of koi eggs and mine look identical. Aren't frog/toad eggs blackish in a gel like substance? These eggs in my pond are EVERYWHERE. And my largest koi (8 inches) did suddenly look less round. I tried scraping them off but this just makes a mess, and I don't want to ruin the water any more. The eggs are REALLY stuck on the sides and are hard to come off. Should I just leave them? Koi eggs should come off rather easily. I'm surprised they didn't eat all those you can see. They may not be koi eggs. Your koi are awfully small to be breeding. Maybe someone else can suggest how you can handle these eggs. They are probably not very hungry because of the nitrite levels. After my 50% water change yesterday, the levels were again sky high at over 1.0 mg/L today. I did another 50% water change tonight. The ones on the plants came off easily, but not the ones on the sides of the pre-form. I don't know if my other fish are old enough to fertilize. They are only 4 inches long. I doubt the eggs were fertilized. They'll turn white and disintegrate (if koi eggs). Did you see breeding activity? Not really. Since yesterday they have been pre-occupied scratching themselves against the pump (swimming above it real fast and then turning on their side). I did notice tonight that some of the eggs are turning white. I think I'll go tomorrow and get something for parasites. I'm in Canada so I can't find the dyacide.... but I will look for something comparable. Any suggestions? Kelly |
#19
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching - eggs
In article , Koi-Lo wrote:
*Note: There are two "Koi-Lo's" on the pond and aquaria groups. "Kelly" wrote in message oups.com... Koi-Lo wrote: They'll eat most of them. Are you sure they're koi eggs and not newt, frog or toad eggs? :-) I'm pretty sure. I scoured the internet for pictures of koi eggs and mine look identical. Aren't frog/toad eggs blackish in a gel like substance? These eggs in my pond are EVERYWHERE. And my largest koi (8 inches) did suddenly look less round. Yes, frog, toad and newt eggs are laid in a jell, are dark and don't "stick" to the sides. These must be koi eggs. Koi eggs should come off rather easily. I'm surprised they didn't eat all those you can see. They may not be koi eggs. Your koi are awfully small to be breeding. Maybe someone else can suggest how you can handle these eggs. They are probably not very hungry because of the nitrite levels. After my 50% water change yesterday, the levels were again sky high at over 1.0 mg/L today. I did another 50% water change tonight. The ones on the plants came off easily, but not the ones on the sides of the pre-form. Well, no one can say for sure, but they probably wont hatch since the others are so small - but you never know. If they do hatch you can always net them out to another container. I don't know if my other fish are old enough to fertilize. They are only 4 inches long. I doubt the eggs were fertilized. They'll turn white and disintegrate (if koi eggs). Did you see breeding activity? Not really. Since yesterday they have been pre-occupied scratching themselves against the pump (swimming above it real fast and then turning on their side). I did notice tonight that some of the eggs are turning white. I wouldn't worry about the eggs at this point. The scratching would have me very concerned. Others may disagree but I would get a broad spectrum parasite killer and treat them to be on the safe side. Many are made for pond fish. The problem is, you don't know what parasite to treat for without scrapings. With koi, ulcer disease is always a threat where parasites are concerned. I think I'll go tomorrow and get something for parasites. I'm in Canada so I can't find the dyacide.... but I will look for something comparable. Dylox Any suggestions? The most important factor is early intervention. I use Potassium Permanganate (called PP) but you must be very careful with this one. Very. I just don't think I would ever dose a pond directly but this is the fastest acting treatment. I'd consider setting up a PP bath in a trash can or kiddy pool... VERY well oxygenated! I also use Quick-Cure and/or Aquara-Sol which are safer, but don't get all the parasites out there. If you can't get PP, then go for the Quick-Cure. Unfortunately both may effect your biological filter to some degree. Salt is less likely to do that but you'd have to remove all the plants. Salt gets most parasites. But at the 3+ppm dose needed her plants will suffer... and I don't like going from 0-3ppm in one step. I think your suggested Quick-Cure remedy is the best choice at this point. The reality here is the fish are victims of 'instant gratification'... and the seller, if a single provider, should be ashamed. They potentially have soured a lifelong customer to a customer of the nursery, after the pond is filled in. Unfortunately, more and more 'nurseries' are the local pond experts though... go fig. A biological filter is paramount in this overstocked pond. That doesn't happen overnight, but that is why I suggested the 'bacter vital' to seed the biological filter immediately... whatever 'biological filter' means in this case. I'd 5x the amount of W.H. also and a good dose of Amequel. Good Luck! jay Wed May 31, 2006 |
#20
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching - treatment
*Note: There are two "Koi-Lo's" on the pond and aquaria groups.
"Go Fig" wrote in message ... In article , Koi-Lo wrote: I wouldn't worry about the eggs at this point. The scratching would have me very concerned. Others may disagree but I would get a broad spectrum parasite killer and treat them to be on the safe side. Many are made for pond fish. The problem is, you don't know what parasite to treat for without scrapings. With koi, ulcer disease is always a threat where parasites are concerned. I think I'll go tomorrow and get something for parasites. I'm in Canada so I can't find the dyacide.... but I will look for something comparable. Dylox Any suggestions? The most important factor is early intervention. I use Potassium Permanganate (called PP) but you must be very careful with this one. Very. I just don't think I would ever dose a pond directly but this is the fastest acting treatment. I'd consider setting up a PP bath in a trash can or kiddy pool... VERY well oxygenated! Unfortunately that leaves any parasites in the pond or filter unharmed and ready to reattach to the fish when they're returned. I also use Quick-Cure and/or Aquara-Sol which are safer, but don't get all the parasites out there. If you can't get PP, then go for the Quick-Cure. Unfortunately both may effect your biological filter to some degree. Salt is less likely to do that but you'd have to remove all the plants. Salt gets most parasites. But at the 3+ppm dose needed her plants will suffer... and I don't like going from 0-3ppm in one step. That's why I recommend removing them before adding the first dose of salt. I wouldn't chance it with any pond plants. I think your suggested Quick-Cure remedy is the best choice at this point. The reality here is the fish are victims of 'instant gratification'... and the seller, if a single provider, should be ashamed. They potentially have soured a lifelong customer to a customer of the nursery, after the pond is filled in. Unfortunately, more and more 'nurseries' are the local pond experts though... go fig. It's that BOTTOM LINE. :-( A biological filter is paramount in this overstocked pond. That doesn't happen overnight, but that is why I suggested the 'bacter vital' to seed the biological filter immediately... whatever 'biological filter' means in this case. I'd 5x the amount of W.H. also and a good dose of Amequel. On the Aquaria groups they recommended BioSpira. Since I never used any of these products I can't say if it works better than the other products out there. -- Koi-Lo.... Frugal ponding since 1995. My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://tinyurl.com/9do58 rec.pond's FAQ are at: http://www.geocities.com/justinm090/faq.html ~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(š ~~~~ }((((({* |
#21
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - Att: Kelly
On Wed, 31 May 2006 08:12:45 -0700, Go Fig wrote:
I did catch my 8 inch koi to take a look at her, and there were no obvious lesions or visible parasites on her body. Here's hoping.... Its doubtful that you can see'm. Treat w/ Dyacide, used for years and years and with a 'half-life' of about 3 days its a ideal med. I respectfully disagree. If the fish aren't doing anything more than flashing when water quality is knowingly off, only water quality should be addressed. Unless she has someone who can scrape and scope. Adding meds now will only stress the koi more, and be wasteful if it isn't even needed or the right ones. JMO, ~ jan ----------------- (Do you know where your water quality is?) |
#22
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching
On 31 May 2006 14:01:39 -0700, "Kelly" wrote:
I have the top of the biological filter/waterfall planted full of plants. I also have two baskets of plants in the pond. I also have oxygenators in the bottom of the pond. These include: Pennywort Water hyacinth Water Parsley Water mint Ogon Sweetflag None of these plants will be bothered by 0.1% salt solution.... that's a little more than 1 lb for your 125 gallons. My largest koi is apparently female because there are thousands of eggs suddenly covering the sides and plants of my pond!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This could also have been the reason for flashing. I would not medicated at this time. Water quality is the best thing you can do for these fish at this time. IMO. Medicating will set the filter back to square one, and you'll STILL have water quality issues. ~ jan KISS -------------- See my ponds and filter design: www.jjspond.us ~Keep 'em Wet!~ Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a To e-mail see website |
#23
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - Att: Kelly
In article , ~ janj
wrote: On Wed, 31 May 2006 08:12:45 -0700, Go Fig wrote: I did catch my 8 inch koi to take a look at her, and there were no obvious lesions or visible parasites on her body. Here's hoping.... Its doubtful that you can see'm. Treat w/ Dyacide, used for years and years and with a 'half-life' of about 3 days its a ideal med. I respectfully disagree. If the fish aren't doing anything more than flashing when water quality is knowingly off, only water quality should be addressed. Unless she has someone who can scrape and scope. Adding meds now will only stress the koi more, and be wasteful if it isn't even needed or the right ones. JMO, ~ jan Dyacide is routinely used to treat parasites prophylactically because of its half life. It is far less stressful than PP or Formalyn (starving the water of O2) and that (and no deaths yet) was my reasoning. I further went on to suggest seeding the biological filter to address the underlying problem... poor water quality. You omitted that part of my post in your reply. jay Wed May 31, 2006 ----------------- (Do you know where your water quality is?) |
#24
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching
Kelly wrote:
============================ This is an excellent idea if they have the space. These pools are only $10 and last for a at least a year. That would give them time to dig their larger pond and get a good size bunch of plants going. The scratching would have me concerned. Since losing almost every koi I had to ulcer disease a few years back, I'm a bit paranoid about parasites now..... The problem I have is nitrite.... not nitrate as Hal said. That's odd - but serious. Nitrite is usually a very transient product of ammonia breakdown. In an established pond, it generally gets converted to nitrate as fast as it's created. Assuming this is a caused by recent spawning activity, the only thing you can really do is water changes & add salt to limit the harm done by the nitrite. -- derek |
#25
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Qs from Newbie Pond/Koi keeper - scratching
In article , Derek Broughton
wrote: Kelly wrote: ============================ This is an excellent idea if they have the space. These pools are only $10 and last for a at least a year. That would give them time to dig their larger pond and get a good size bunch of plants going. The scratching would have me concerned. Since losing almost every koi I had to ulcer disease a few years back, I'm a bit paranoid about parasites now..... The problem I have is nitrite.... not nitrate as Hal said. That's odd - but serious. Nitrite is usually a very transient product of ammonia breakdown. In an established pond, it generally gets converted to nitrate as fast as it's created. Assuming this is a caused by recent spawning activity, It is a new pond going through a trypical cycle... except koi are not a good choice to cycle a new pond with. jay Thu Jun 01, 2006 the only thing you can really do is water changes & add salt to limit the harm done by the nitrite. |
#26
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Nitrite still nuts despite water changes!!!
Go Fig wrote: The problem I have is nitrite.... not nitrate as Hal said. That's odd - but serious. Nitrite is usually a very transient product of ammonia breakdown. In an established pond, it generally gets converted to nitrate as fast as it's created. Assuming this is a caused by recent spawning activity, It is a new pond going through a trypical cycle... except koi are not a good choice to cycle a new pond with. Exactly, and a self admitted mistake I made. We will be constructing a new and much larger pond next season (big enough for 4 koi), but until then, I"m trying to make this thing work. Every night this week I have done a 50% water change. Despite my efforts, I measured the nitrite today and it was OFF THE SCALE at over 3.5 mg/L. Pardon my language but ****!!! I'm not understanding how it's getting so high so fast even though I'm doing changes. Well I know what most of you will say, the pond is SMALL!! Damn. So I was forced to remove about 80% of the water for fear that my poor koi will suffer the extreme. When I'm doing these water changes, should I be adding more of the commercial bacteria stuff each time? Or will this just make the situation worse? I haven't fed the koi in about a week. But now that there are eggs in the pond they are eating these. I don't want to remove the eggs because it really stirs up the pond and they are hard to remove. sigh So what I'm going to have to do is do TWO water changes each day. And test each day and make sure the nitrite is not rising. Kelly |
#27
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Nitrite still nuts despite water changes!!! - High Nitrites
*Note: There are two "Koi-Lo's" on the pond and aquaria groups.
"Kelly" wrote in message ups.com... Exactly, and a self admitted mistake I made. We will be constructing a new and much larger pond next season (big enough for 4 koi), but until then, I"m trying to make this thing work. And it should work for now. Every night this week I have done a 50% water change. Despite my efforts, I measured the nitrite today and it was OFF THE SCALE at over 3.5 mg/L. Pardon my language but ****!!! Allow me to suggest you either take some of the water to a nearby Aquarium or pond store and let them use their kit to check it - or buy another kit and do it yourself. It's possible your kit is defective in some way. If all kits read high then there is something causing this high nitrite. Neighbors or their children aren't tossing in bread or other snacks to the fish are they? I'm not understanding how it's getting so high so fast even though I'm doing changes. Well I know what most of you will say, the pond is SMALL!! Damn. So I was forced to remove about 80% of the water for fear that my poor koi will suffer the extreme. When I'm doing these water changes, should I be adding more of the commercial bacteria stuff each time? Or will this just make the situation worse? I read in the Aquarium groups that those products don't do jack-crap for the nitrogen cycle. They all recommended BioSpira - about $15 if you can find it. I haven't fed the koi in about a week. But now that there are eggs in the pond they are eating these. I don't want to remove the eggs because it really stirs up the pond and they are hard to remove. This would have me ripping my hair out........ :-O sigh So what I'm going to have to do is do TWO water changes each day. And test each day and make sure the nitrite is not rising. Please try another test kit and be sure nothing is being tossed into your pond by a neighbor or unthinking child. SOMETHING is driving up those nitrites if your kit is correct. Also, try and find BioSpira as that product is said to have the correct bacteria to cycle with. -- Koi-Lo.... Frugal ponding since 1995. My Pond & Aquarium Pages: http://tinyurl.com/9do58 rec.pond's FAQ are at: http://www.geocities.com/justinm090/faq.html ~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({* |
#28
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Nitrite still nuts despite water changes!!! - High Nitrites
Koi-Lo wrote: *Note: There are two "Koi-Lo's" on the pond and aquaria groups. "Kelly" wrote in message Allow me to suggest you either take some of the water to a nearby Aquarium or pond store and let them use their kit to check it - or buy another kit and do it yourself. It's possible your kit is defective in some way. If all kits read high then there is something causing this high nitrite. Neighbors or their children aren't tossing in bread or other snacks to the fish are they? When I tested the water when I FIRST set up the pond, the nitrite was reading zero. So I k now it has the potential to read zero! haha. Although the pond IS in our front yard, it currently has a screen over top of it because of tree debris (our maple tree is currently dropping those whirly gig seeds). So unless someone is coming over, taking the rocks off that are holding down the screen, and dumping stuff in there.... there's nothing getting in!!! Yes, this is frustrating! But damn I'm trying. I read in the Aquarium groups that those products don't do jack-crap for the nitrogen cycle. They all recommended BioSpira - about $15 if you can find it. Apparently this is the best stuff in Canada. It costed me enough (40 bucks). And within two days after putting it in, our ammonia levels dropped to zero. Biospira isn't sold in Canada and an internet search didn't turn up anyone obviously selling it online. Although by the time it got here, knowing my luck my pond would suddenly be fine!!! Please try another test kit and be sure nothing is being tossed into your pond by a neighbor or unthinking child. SOMETHING is driving up those nitrites if your kit is correct. Also, try and find BioSpira as that product is said to have the correct bacteria to cycle with. I would say the only other possibility is that my fiancee is feeding them when I'm not home. But I seriously doubt this. I have educated him on the gravity of our situation and that feeding them will only make the toxins worse. I will go out and get another test kit (for my peace of mind). THanks so much for your advice. Kelly |
#29
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Nitrite still nuts despite water changes!!!
In article . com,
Kelly wrote: Go Fig wrote: The problem I have is nitrite.... not nitrate as Hal said. That's odd - but serious. Nitrite is usually a very transient product of ammonia breakdown. In an established pond, it generally gets converted to nitrate as fast as it's created. Assuming this is a caused by recent spawning activity, It is a new pond going through a trypical cycle... except koi are not a good choice to cycle a new pond with. Exactly, and a self admitted mistake I made. Or the shop that sold you the stuff, that said, even a cursory look at a good pond book would have clued you in though. We will be constructing a new and much larger pond next season (big enough for 4 koi), but until then, I"m trying to make this thing work. This product works : http://www.aquariumpros.com/p-MWE53400,MWE.html I have a lot of experience with ponds and quick cycling them.. a lot!. As suggested, have some store check your water parameters... these massive water changes are a threat by itself. What does 'biological filter' mean specifically in your filter? Can you post a pic of your set-up ? Every night this week I have done a 50% water change. Despite my efforts, I measured the nitrite today and it was OFF THE SCALE at over 3.5 mg/L. Pardon my language but ****!!! Don't feed the fish! I'm not understanding how it's getting so high so fast even though I'm doing changes. Well I know what most of you will say, the pond is SMALL!! Damn. .... and wat to many fish ;-) So I was forced to remove about 80% of the water for fear that my poor koi will suffer the extreme. .... be sure to match the pH with the new water. When I'm doing these water changes, should I be adding more of the commercial bacteria stuff Product name ? Depends on what type of Bio filter you have. each time? Or will this just make the situation worse? I haven't fed the koi in about a week. But now that there are eggs in the pond they are eating these. I don't want to remove the eggs because it really stirs up the pond and they are hard to remove. sigh So what I'm going to have to do is do TWO water changes each day. And test each day and make sure the nitrite is not rising. Add a lot of Water Hyacinths. Independently check water quality. jay Thu Jun 01, 2006 Kelly |
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