Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Hello all,
I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
David Larson wrote:
Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David We like to have clear water so that we can see our fish. That is for us, not the fishes ;-) -- Bonnie NJ http://home.earthlink.net/~maebe43/ |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
What am I missing here???? Nothing. Clear water is for viewing the beautiful koi from above. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Must be a Japanese thing. My koi like green water
David Larson wrote: Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Disclaimer: I know nothing about koi -- I'm still amazed that my goldfish
from PetsMart are still alive 4 years later in my teeny 3-foot water garden! However, a few things occurred to me after checking out the website mentioned in David's post below. And definitely, I think people should check out this page on the website http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/farm%20photos.htm for the beautiful photos, especially the terraced(?) ponds. First, "mud pond" may mean something entirely different to the Japanese (or it doesn't translate exactly) -- perhaps "mud pond" only refers to a pond carved out of dirt, rather than lined with some other material? Second, the water does indeed look very muddy, but might that not be caused by all the people & activity in the pond? (After all, these photos show a harvest; I did not see any pictures of "undisturbed" ponds.) Third, as my husband would remind me, "well, after all, they're a member of the carp family, aren't they? Do you think that carp get crystal clear water everywhere?" (to which I reply that I had not given that particular topic much thought, as indeed I had not). Just my $.02 worth, Anne Lurie Raleigh, NC ________________________ "David Larson" wrote in message ... Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
I read somewhere that the mud or something in the mud helps give the fish
better color. "Matt Rosing" wrote in message ... Must be a Japanese thing. My koi like green water David Larson wrote: Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
There have been several to many articles on this very subject
in pond magazines and books. Yes, the Japanese do indeed use mud ponds to grow out their Koi. The mud makes the colors much brighter. The Japanese don't keep the Koi in these ponds all their lives - just a portion of. Nedra http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836 http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118 "Anne Lurie" wrote in message om... Disclaimer: I know nothing about koi -- I'm still amazed that my goldfish from PetsMart are still alive 4 years later in my teeny 3-foot water garden! However, a few things occurred to me after checking out the website mentioned in David's post below. And definitely, I think people should check out this page on the website http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/farm%20photos.htm for the beautiful photos, especially the terraced(?) ponds. First, "mud pond" may mean something entirely different to the Japanese (or it doesn't translate exactly) -- perhaps "mud pond" only refers to a pond carved out of dirt, rather than lined with some other material? Second, the water does indeed look very muddy, but might that not be caused by all the people & activity in the pond? (After all, these photos show a harvest; I did not see any pictures of "undisturbed" ponds.) Third, as my husband would remind me, "well, after all, they're a member of the carp family, aren't they? Do you think that carp get crystal clear water everywhere?" (to which I reply that I had not given that particular topic much thought, as indeed I had not). Just my $.02 worth, Anne Lurie Raleigh, NC ________________________ "David Larson" wrote in message ... Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
David Larson wrote: Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David -- the Koi dont mind the dirty water algae some bit of mud etc as long as the chemistry is OK its us that are owned by fish that like the clesr watr so we can see our prettys John Rutz Z5 New Mexico good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad judgement see my pond at: http://www.fuerjefe.com |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
On Fri, 06 Jun 2003 13:50:06 -0800, David Larson
wrote: What am I missing here???? I'm not sure. Did you know the koi is a carp? Did you know the koi have teeth back in their throat for crushing things like snail shells and other small shellfish they dig up from the bottom? If you knew that you knew their natural habitat is mud bottom even though most koi keepers don't want their fish referred to as bottom feeders, that is what they are. Regards, Hal |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
The "mud ponds" the Japanese use are finishing ponds - where the koi go to
"finish" before a show. The "mud" is calcium bentonite clay - a very specific type of clay. It has very high mineral content and has been proven over the centuries to improve the color of the koi and the luster of their skin. This particular clay has many uses, and is even sprinkled over food here in the States as an aid to digestion. Many paste foods include a half cup or so of bentonite clay as an ingredient. The fish are placed in the finishing ponds for 6 months to a year, during which time they aren't seen at all (due to the density of the mud) until the pond is drained for harvesting. Then it's like Christmas morning! The koi don't mind "unclear" water (green algae or mud), their owners do GBG! We don't like feeding "lips" - all that we can see when the water is murky. We want to see our prized finny pets, so we want clear water. Actually, if the water was murky, it would probably save their lives, as it would be a lot harder for predators to see them. The water can be funky (to us), but as long as the ammonia, nitrItes, pH and DO are in line, the fish could care less! Lee "David Larson" wrote in message ... Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Hey Lee ... Is the calcium bentonite clay the same thing as
Koi Clay? I do hope so ... I just bought a bunch! Have only used it one week so far. I notice the rocks that have fallen in over the years are now a deep brown. Wonder if this is from the Koi Clay? Guess I should call the owner VBG I also sprinkled about a tablespoon or two on the roses.... miracle stuff! None on my food yet. Nedra http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836 http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118 "Lee Brouillet" wrote in message ... The "mud ponds" the Japanese use are finishing ponds - where the koi go to "finish" before a show. The "mud" is calcium bentonite clay - a very specific type of clay. It has very high mineral content and has been proven over the centuries to improve the color of the koi and the luster of their skin. This particular clay has many uses, and is even sprinkled over food here in the States as an aid to digestion. Many paste foods include a half cup or so of bentonite clay as an ingredient. The fish are placed in the finishing ponds for 6 months to a year, during which time they aren't seen at all (due to the density of the mud) until the pond is drained for harvesting. Then it's like Christmas morning! The koi don't mind "unclear" water (green algae or mud), their owners do GBG! We don't like feeding "lips" - all that we can see when the water is murky. We want to see our prized finny pets, so we want clear water. Actually, if the water was murky, it would probably save their lives, as it would be a lot harder for predators to see them. The water can be funky (to us), but as long as the ammonia, nitrItes, pH and DO are in line, the fish could care less! Lee "David Larson" wrote in message ... Hello all, I've read many threads about Koi needing to have crystal clean water in order to thrive. Then I looked at a few websites for Koi breeders in Japan, and their Koi live in mud ponds and the water is far from crystal clear. Look at these pics - http://www.tategoi.com/oomokoi/koi%20harvest.htm Now... these breeders have zillions of dollars (yen) invested in their Koi, so they need them to maintain prime health. This being the case, is it really necessary to have clear water for koi? Yes, Ph, nitrates, nitrites, and such need to be correct - but it seems the water itself does not need to be clear. What am I missing here???? - David |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Nedra, where did you find calcium bentonite? Most bentonite I've seen
here has been sodium bentonite, and when I ask about calcium bentonite am told there is no difference between the two. -- zookeeper Nedra wrote: Hey Lee ... Is the calcium bentonite clay the same thing as Koi Clay? I do hope so ... I just bought a bunch! ... |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
"Nedra" wrote:
Hey Lee ... Is the calcium bentonite clay the same thing as Koi Clay? Bentonite: http://www.csminchem.co.uk/bentonite.htm Koi Clay http://www.koitonic.com/what's%20it.htm The latter site indicates it is calcium bentonite, and the former indicates that sodium bentonite has different "gelling" properties. usd $28/10 lbs from the latter site. |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
Nedra wrote: Hey Lee ... Is the calcium bentonite clay the same thing as Koi Clay? I do hope so ... I just bought a bunch! Have only used it one week so far. I notice the rocks that have fallen in over the years are now a deep brown. Wonder if this is from the Koi Clay? Guess I should call the owner VBG I also sprinkled about a tablespoon or two on the roses.... miracle stuff! None on my food yet. Nedra http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836 http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118 Nedra youll love the koi clay what it does to your pond it is the betonite John Rutz Z5 New Mexico good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad judgement see my pond at: http://www.fuerjefe.com |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
Koi living in mud ponds.
John Rutz wrote:
Nedra wrote: Hey Lee ... Is the calcium bentonite clay the same thing as Koi Clay? I do hope so ... I just bought a bunch! Have only used it one week so far. I notice the rocks that have fallen in over the years are now a deep brown. Wonder if this is from the Koi Clay? Guess I should call the owner VBG I also sprinkled about a tablespoon or two on the roses.... miracle stuff! None on my food yet. Nedra http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Pines/4836 http://community.webshots.com/user/nedra118 Nedra youll love the koi clay what it does to your pond it is the betonite John Rutz Z5 New Mexico good judgement comes from bad experience, and that comes from bad judgement see my pond at: http://www.fuerjefe.com I have started to use the koi clay this season. My pond was beautifully clear until the rains started and now they are a mess. All the readings are good, but my clarity is gone. I just dosed again with the BZT. It was so nice 2 weeks ago, hopefully they will be again soon. -- Bonnie NJ http://home.earthlink.net/~maebe43/ |
Reply |
|
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Tadpoles, Water and Mud in a Rubbermaid | Ponds | |||
Why does store bought spinach include so much mud | Edible Gardening | |||
Mud pit...what to do??? | Lawns | |||
Mud Settle-age | Ponds | |||
Should I add rock, soil(mud) in my pond? | Ponds |