Susan H. Simko wrote:

The Lowes rose was also
twice the size of the bare root when I put the Lowes in the ground.
However, the bare root now makes the Lowes look like a shrimp. Near
identical conditions for the two roses so it's just "interesting"
right now.

Daniel Hanna wrote:

Interesting. Susan, what kind of soil did you plant the bare root in?

Both of the beds were prepared at the same time - a good rich potting
soil with some fertilizer(s) mixed in. I'm of the "dig a big hole in
the clay, throw away the clay, and fill the hole with good soil" camp.
I can't remember exactly what soil I used at the time as I have switched
off brands when putting in different beds but the interesting part is
that both beds were prepared at the same time and the soil mix came out
of the same wheelbarrow.

Only difference that I can think of is that the J&P bare root got a
several week soak in a bucket with nutrients before it was planted where
as I don't know what was done to the Lowes potted J&P to prepare it.

Susan
shsimko at duke dot edu

In Susan H. Simko wrote:
I'm of the "dig a big hole in
the clay, throw away the clay, and fill the hole with good soil" camp.

I'm in the tent right next to yours :-)

When I shovel pruned a couple of roses last season, I dug up one where I
used the native soil and one that had the soil replaced with a high
quality rose mix. The difference in root systems was remarkable - over
50%. The rose with replaced soil had grown and bloomed far better too.
It was hard for me to believe that I'd planted both as bare roots, at
the same time.

In Susan H. Simko wrote:
I'm of the "dig a big hole in
the clay, throw away the clay, and fill the hole with good soil" camp.

I'm in the tent right next to yours :-)

When I shovel pruned a couple of roses last season, I dug up one where I
used the native soil and one that had the soil replaced with a high
quality rose mix. The difference in root systems was remarkable - over
50%. The rose with replaced soil had grown and bloomed far better too.
It was hard for me to believe that I'd planted both as bare roots, at
the same time.

Why did it get shovel pruned????

Theo

When I shovel pruned a couple of roses last season, I dug up one where I
used the native soil and one that had the soil replaced with a high
quality rose mix. The difference in root systems was remarkable - over
50%. The rose with replaced soil had grown and bloomed far better too.
It was hard for me to believe that I'd planted both as bare roots, at
the same time.

In m Theo Asir wrote:
Why did it get shovel pruned????

Theo, my garden has limited size but I want to keep exploring. So...
each year I remove 3 roses, and get 3 new ones. I often pot the rejects
or give them away. Killing a rose just seems like bad karma.

The ones I remove are my least favourite, but even they are getting
pretty good now. This winter I removed White Lightnin', Black Velvet
and Hot Chocolate. Hot Chocolate is the only one of those I won't miss.
Ironically it was also the one I used soil replacement on...and the root
system was so strong I nearly did my back in removing it!

Ahh! That explains it.

I have a rejects bed where I
crowd the roses shamelessly.
Toughest ones will survive.

Theo

"Daniel Hanna" wrote in message
home.com.au...
In m Theo Asir wrote:
Why did it get shovel pruned????

Theo, my garden has limited size but I want to keep exploring. So...
each year I remove 3 roses, and get 3 new ones. I often pot the rejects
or give them away. Killing a rose just seems like bad karma.

The ones I remove are my least favourite, but even they are getting
pretty good now. This winter I removed White Lightnin', Black Velvet
and Hot Chocolate. Hot Chocolate is the only one of those I won't miss.
Ironically it was also the one I used soil replacement on...and the root
system was so strong I nearly did my back in removing it!

What I've been doing with the bare-root roses I got on the cheap
from Wayside Gardens (they have a sale in late Spring on the
bare-root bushes they've kept in cold storage, up to 75% off --
though they all seem to be grafted, except maybe for the Meilland
landscape roses) is plant them immediately on arrival in pots
(3 gallon grower pots usually are big enough) in soilless potting
mix -- I usually use the Lambert stuff from Quebec, mostly sphagnum
with some perlite, charcoal, and wetting agents, $9 for the 3 cu.-ft.
bag. I keep them in the shade until the shoots grow, then fertilize
(diluted complete fertilizer like 20-20-20 at first, then time-release
stuff). This way they become what the nurserymen call "containerized
plants" that can be planted pretty much any time I like. I've lost one
or two roses out of about twenty this way.

I've had very bad luck planting bare-roots, even those shipped early
in the season and not bought on sale, directly in the soil, even with a
lot of sphagnum or potting mix or other soil amendments. A couple
years ago I tried that and lost four out of six. Your mileage may
vary, etc.

Of course, planting out even "containerized" roses into spots that
end up with six inches of water for a day at a time is a good way
to kill them. And leaf-stripping deer don't help either.

Mark., zone 8b