Unfortunatly the law concerning chainsaws does not cover domestic use. To use comercialy you need certificates, for domestic use you just need to have the money.
The only exception to that is top handled saws, these may only be purchased by someone who holds the relevant rope and harness cert.

On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 08:01:59 +0100, "Tumbleweed" wrote:
I'm sorry but you appear to have confused me with a competent DIY person,
that would have a round file, and would know where it is, would known what
an angle is, and would have a workshop. And that would be able to do
something useful with all those.

:-))

On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 07:36:15 +0000, penance wrote:

The only exception to that is top handled saws, these may only be
purchased by someone who holds the relevant rope and harness cert.

Yes.
And a great pity it was that this was introduced.
It meant that I could not replace my excellent little top handled
Danarm (that did everything that I needed) when the original got
beyond repair.
I had to replace it with a much larger much more dangerous two-handed
Sthil:-(

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 21:46:54 +0100, "Charlie Brown" wrote:

Hi

I have just started my 2 weeks holiday and I need to clear my garden of 10
years worth of neglect (we have just moved in). To make matters worse, I
just cut through the cable of the hedge trimmer. I went to buy a petrol
driven type but they didn't have one - the guy said he had plenty of chain
saws. Question! what is the difference (apart from the obvious) between
using a chain saw and a trimmer for doing the same type of work i.e.
cropping back bushes and scrub etc? - will a chain saw TRIM a hedge?
I would appreciate a quick reply so that I can buy one tomorrow and save me
a few days of my holiday!!

thanks in advance

Charlie


I have just bought one of these..
http://www.gonegardening.com/xq/ASP/...op/product.htm

It's great for all sorts of things, including, cutting long grass, and tall hedges

Rick...

The message
from (WaltA) contains these words:

Leaving aside, for the moment, the possibilities of nails, barbed
wire, remnants of other fencing wires etc. destroying chains
( yes, I agree a spare is handy)
but the business bits do blunt under normal operations anyway, and one
always has a round file to hand to do the sharpening oneself, as part
of normal operations. Tedious work, but not a loss of "the rest of the
day" ! It is work that can be done 'by eye' with the usual cuppa'
whilst contemplating the next bit of the job !

The serious 'getting the angles just-so' part of maintaining the chain
can be left till the next evening in the workshop.

Thoroughly agree, but the OP wanted to do the job 'now, if not sooner',
so to speak. I've been using the things since the mid to late 'fifties,
and without problems, but I've heard of plenty of people who haven't
been so lucky/careful.

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

WaltA wrote:
On 19 Oct 2005 20:54:23 GMT,Nick Maclaren wrote:
Be sure to buy a few spare legs, the odd spare arm and a spare
neck
or two.

Rubbish, pandering to legislators, do-gooders and cotton wool
manufacts.. !

Well, not having a machismo problem, I prefer do-gooders to
do-badders, any day. There are far too many of these do-badders going
round interfering with my peaceful way of life.

Plus the odd gallon of blood.

Sell it to H. F-W to make TV programmes about blackpuddings.

It is AMAZING what you can
cut through with a chainsaw.

It is AMAZING what the incompetent can do with allsorsafings,
including zippers on trousers

Precisely. And till one's had the ATB or comparable training, one is
incompetent: that's not an insult, it's just a neutral fact. You and
I were an incompetent drivers till we'd had lessons, too: I hope you
don't think driving licences are an evil government intrusion on the
liberty of the citizen. People don't all know intuitively which side
to start a cut, or when the saw's dangerously blunt, or when the
chain's worked loose, or how to strip the machine down and do a
service.

I was self-taught when it came to zippers. Fortunately, the first
and -- so far -- last error didn't leave a scar!

Alternatively, you could go to an agricultural merchant or GOOD
garden centre, and buy some hand tools (shears, a billhook and/or
machete, a sickle (not a grass hook), a hand axe

Mon dieu, u canna be serious ! u can remove a finger, or hand ,
with
one of they ! (Or, if ingenious some other part of one's anatomy)
[...]

Yes; but they stop cutting after the first bite, and stop moving when
they hit the ground.

--
Mike.

In article ,
Jaques d'Alltrades writes:
| The message
| from (WaltA) contains these words:
|
| The serious 'getting the angles just-so' part of maintaining the chain
| can be left till the next evening in the workshop.
|
| Thoroughly agree, but the OP wanted to do the job 'now, if not sooner',
| so to speak. I've been using the things since the mid to late 'fifties,
| and without problems, but I've heard of plenty of people who haven't
| been so lucky/careful.

He was also talking about clearing scrub, which is extremely
likely to have something unexpected in it, and trimming hedges,
which usually means holding the implement fairly high. It is
also fairly common to find unexpected metal posts in hedges.
Using a chainsaw on logs on a sawhorse is one thing; such abuses
are very much another.

If someone of normal strength (i.e. weakness) is trimming a
hedge with a chainsaw at head height and hits an unexpected
metal post, it may well kick out of his hands. If that happens,
then taking his face off is indeed quite likely. Or indeed
taking his head off. Even at a low height, a chainsaw in the
inner thigh is quite likely to cut the femoral artery, whereupon
there isn't much point in calling an ambulance.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Not at all, the larger the saw the safer, as it is less likely to kick back if the wrong part of the bar is used, also 2 handed use helps to reduce the chances.
Top handled saws are for a specific use and should stay that way.

Then you are not competant (by industry standards).

The message
from "Mike Lyle" contains these words:

I was self-taught when it came to zippers. Fortunately, the first
and -- so far -- last error didn't leave a scar!

The Ole' Man went to his younger daughter's wedding with decorum secured
by safety pins.

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

If someone of normal strength (i.e. weakness) is trimming a
hedge with a chainsaw at head height and hits an unexpected
metal post, it may well kick out of his hands. If that happens,
then taking his face off is indeed quite likely. Or indeed
taking his head off.

Not with a modern saw - it wiyld have stopped by the time it hit you -
but it might leave a nasty gash.

Even at a low height, a chainsaw in the
inner thigh is quite likely to cut the femoral artery, whereupon
there isn't much point in calling an ambulance.

That *IS* a hazard, though you'd have to be pretty inept to sustain such
an injury.

Someone I knew was helping his father cut logs with a circular saw. He
only noticed he had three missing fingers when he saw the blood.

That was *HIS* carreer in the Lifeguards over.

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article ,
Jaques d'Alltrades wrote:
The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

If someone of normal strength (i.e. weakness) is trimming a
hedge with a chainsaw at head height and hits an unexpected
metal post, it may well kick out of his hands. If that happens,
then taking his face off is indeed quite likely. Or indeed
taking his head off.

Not with a modern saw - it wiyld have stopped by the time it hit you -
but it might leave a nasty gash.

My observations of people using modern chainsaws is that is not true.
When a tool like that kicks back in that position, it will hit you
in a fraction of a second (perhaps a tenth), and the saws just don't
stop that fast. Also, that is so fast that it is possible that
their "control finger" is still in place even if they are not
holding it, by the time it hits.

That experience is confirmed by using certain (non-saw) drill
attachments, where both effects also occur, but the likely damage
is VASTLY less (e.g. abrasion of clothes and skin).

What stopping time do they claim?


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

Not with a modern saw - it wiyld have stopped by the time it hit you -
but it might leave a nasty gash.

My observations of people using modern chainsaws is that is not true.
When a tool like that kicks back in that position, it will hit you
in a fraction of a second (perhaps a tenth), and the saws just don't
stop that fast. Also, that is so fast that it is possible that
their "control finger" is still in place even if they are not
holding it, by the time it hits.

Only if you still have your finger on the 'trigger' and your hand
gripping the safety-bar.

That experience is confirmed by using certain (non-saw) drill
attachments, where both effects also occur, but the likely damage
is VASTLY less (e.g. abrasion of clothes and skin).

They wouldn't have a brake like modern chainsaws. (I've never been
allowed to use one of them because I've always been in the company of my
fiend the gamekeeper, and he has to observe all the regulations - I'm
not covered, even though I was using chaisaws before he was a gleam in
his father's eye.)

What stopping time do they claim?

I don't know what they claim, but a demonstration showed almost instant
stopping - less than half a second, I'd say.

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/

In article ,
Jaques d'Alltrades wrote:
The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

Not with a modern saw - it wiyld have stopped by the time it hit you -
but it might leave a nasty gash.

My observations of people using modern chainsaws is that is not true.
When a tool like that kicks back in that position, it will hit you
in a fraction of a second (perhaps a tenth), and the saws just don't
stop that fast. Also, that is so fast that it is possible that
their "control finger" is still in place even if they are not
holding it, by the time it hits.

Only if you still have your finger on the 'trigger' and your hand
gripping the safety-bar.

That is what I am saying is implausible. Firstly, the chain will
take a finite amount of time to stop. Secondly, it is common when
a tool kicks back out of your hands for your hands to be in the
control position but not holding the tool for a fraction of a
second. Yound hands and arms may be moved with it, if you are of
normal strength, er, weakness.

That experience is confirmed by using certain (non-saw) drill
attachments, where both effects also occur, but the likely damage
is VASTLY less (e.g. abrasion of clothes and skin).

They wouldn't have a brake like modern chainsaws. (I've never been
allowed to use one of them because I've always been in the company of my
fiend the gamekeeper, and he has to observe all the regulations - I'm
not covered, even though I was using chaisaws before he was a gleam in
his father's eye.)

I was not referring to that, but to my estimates of the time taken
from hitting something solid until it hits you, and to my statement
that you hands can remain holding the switches on even after you
have lost control.

What stopping time do they claim?

I don't know what they claim, but a demonstration showed almost instant
stopping - less than half a second, I'd say.

That I would believe, but it is FAR too long. Even ignoring the 'hands
still holding it on' effect, a maximum of 1/20th second is needed for
safety. I don't believe that you could hold a chainsaw against the
torsion when stopping if it did it that fast.

Seriously.

Remember that I was referring to the case of using it as a hedge
cutter at head height, where it might hit an iron post while being
1' from your face. It is THAT that I was saying was complete
insanity.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

The message
from (Nick Maclaren) contains these words:

/snip/

I don't know what they claim, but a demonstration showed almost instant
stopping - less than half a second, I'd say.

That I would believe, but it is FAR too long.

It's not exactly travelling at the speed of light^H^H^a bullet.

Even ignoring the 'hands
still holding it on' effect, a maximum of 1/20th second is needed for
safety. I don't believe that you could hold a chainsaw against the
torsion when stopping if it did it that fast.

Nonsense! Even the torsion of a big saw (like the 36" Pioneer I learned
on) is tiddly when it stops, or when you accelerate from tick-over to
full-chat. Even the torsion from my R80 (800cc) BMW is pretty puny when
you gun it. The ratio of the weight of a chainsaw to the inertia of the
moving parts (some of which will cancel each-other anyway) is small.

Seriously.

Yes, seriously. In fifty years of using chainsaws I have never noticed
any vicious inertia effects.

Remember that I was referring to the case of using it as a hedge
cutter at head height, where it might hit an iron post while being
1' from your face. It is THAT that I was saying was complete
insanity.

Oh, I agree that for that application it would be madness to use a
chainsaw, but you created the scenario as a rather extreme example of
what not to do innit. I've no doubt you *COULD* use a chainsaw to cut
the lawn, or trim your beard...

--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/