I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

sally H wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

Recommendation No 1: Don't.
Recommendation No 2: Look for an ATB training course. I found it
invaluable.
Recommendation No 3: Don't.
Recommendation No 4: Stihl or Jotul plus _full_ protective gear - no
half-measures.
Recommendation No 5: Don't.
Recommendation No 6: Get a short blade, not a long one.
Recommendation No 7: Don't.

--
Mike.



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

In article , Mike Lyle
wrote:

sally H wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

Recommendation No 1: Don't.
Recommendation No 2: Look for an ATB training course. I found it
invaluable.
Recommendation No 3: Don't.
Recommendation No 4: Stihl or Jotul plus _full_ protective gear - no
half-measures.
Recommendation No 5: Don't.
Recommendation No 6: Get a short blade, not a long one.
Recommendation No 7: Don't.

Agree on all points and the shorter the blade the better/faster it will
cut. However, I recently bought a very cheap (under £100) Ryobi 33cc
14in model and it is extremely good value albeit not the same quality
as a Stihl.

Don't go for an electric chainsaw and by all accounts, avoid McCulloch.

Stan The Man wrote:
In article , Mike Lyle
wrote:

sally H wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.
Recommendation No 1: Don't.
Recommendation No 2: Look for an ATB training course. I found it
invaluable.
Recommendation No 3: Don't.
Recommendation No 4: Stihl or Jotul plus _full_ protective gear - no
half-measures.
Recommendation No 5: Don't.
Recommendation No 6: Get a short blade, not a long one.
Recommendation No 7: Don't.

Agree on all points and the shorter the blade the better/faster it will
cut. However, I recently bought a very cheap (under £100) Ryobi 33cc
14in model and it is extremely good value albeit not the same quality
as a Stihl.

Don't go for an electric chainsaw and by all accounts, avoid McCulloch.
Be wary of Stihl products, they have 2 grades, an inferior and of course
cheaper one made in China, sadly it is not obvious as to which is which.
I got caught with their cheap strimmer. Incidentally if it is only for
light work it is worth considering Tanaka. Their engine is superb
starting, by far the easiest I have come across. Then you can buy a
strimmer, hedge cutter and chain saw "attachments", this makes it very
economical. I particularly like the hedge trimmer as it is a pole type,
so I can cut my 6 ft hedges without ladders.

On 24 Mar, 09:06, Malcolm wrote:
In article , Stan The Man
writes



In article , Mike Lyle
wrote:

sally H wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

Recommendation No 1: Don't.
Recommendation No 2: Look for an ATB training course. I found it
invaluable.
Recommendation No 3: Don't.
Recommendation No 4: Stihl or Jotul plus _full_ protective gear - no
half-measures.
Recommendation No 5: Don't.
Recommendation No 6: Get a short blade, not a long one.
Recommendation No 7: Don't.

Agree on all points and the shorter the blade the better/faster it will
cut. However, I recently bought a very cheap (under £100) Ryobi 33cc
14in model and it is extremely good value albeit not the same quality
as a Stihl.

Don't go for an electric chainsaw

Why not?

and by all accounts, avoid McCulloch.

--
Malcolm

Nothing wrong with an electric chain saw if you know what you are
doing, Alkdiu and Lidl do them at times for around £40.00.
My neighbour who only burns wood uses them all the time and cuts many
tons of wood before the machine needs to be replaced.
He is over 70 and has used chain saws for many years.
Just make sure that you keep the tension on the chain and keep it well
lubricated, and what ever you do USE IT CAREFULLY. THEY ARE LETHAL IF
USED CARELESSLY.

David Hill
Abacus Nurseries

In article ,
Malcolm writes:
|
| Nothing wrong with an electric chain saw if you know what you are
| doing, Alkdiu and Lidl do them at times for around £40.00.
| My neighbour who only burns wood uses them all the time and cuts many
| tons of wood before the machine needs to be replaced.
| He is over 70 and has used chain saws for many years.
| Just make sure that you keep the tension on the chain and keep it well
| lubricated, and what ever you do USE IT CAREFULLY. THEY ARE LETHAL IF
| USED CARELESSLY.
|
| But all of that is true of petrol ones, too.

Typically more so, because they are usually more powerful and take
longer to stop.

Cutting up logs on a sawhorse is one thing; cutting up branches in
situ another; cutting down trees a third; and working up a ladder
or tree VERY much a fourth. It becomes more dangerous, and you need
to be stronger in the hands, wrists and shoulders as that series
proceeds. I gave up even an electric hedge trimmer because I was
not strong enough to hold it safely.

| I have an electric one (16", with which I've felled several redundant
| trees in the garden and turned them into firewood - while wearing the
| proper helmet and gloves, of course) and wondered whether the poster had
| some particular reason for saying don't go for one. A circuit breaker
| takes care of any risk from cutting the cable - which so far I've
| managed to avoid doing!

What on earth do you need a helmet for, in any case where you don't
need the kevlar clothing?

Also, circuit breakers DON'T eliminate all risk from cutting the cable;
they merely reduce it. Anyway, except in wet weather, the risk to the
person is low - rubber boots are good insulators, and there is little
danger unless the current goes across your head or torso.

The main danger is the saw jumping out of your hands, possibly because
there is an old nail in the tree or you catch it on a springy branch.
If it hits you while still moving, it will at best make a mess and quite
likely cut a major blood vessel or do other permanent damage.

I have felled, cut up and dug up several modest trees of 9" diameter
(e.g. 20' apples) in less than a day, using nothing more than a decent
bowsaw and other manual tools. Trees of much above that should be left
to professionals.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Malcolm writes:
|
| What on earth do you need a helmet for, in any case where you don't
| need the kevlar clothing?
|
| To provide eye and ear protection, as well as protection from objects
| falling on one's head. Perhaps you don't think these are important when
| using a chainsaw, but I do, as does every trainer and every training
| manual.

That is a wonderful picture! Protective helmets, per se, do not cover
either people's ears or their eyes - at least for people with them in
normal locations :-)

You should NEVER cut anything heavy above your head, chainsaw, bowsaw
or light saber. A helmet will not protect you from a broken neck, and
a light branch will not crack a skull when falling from a mere 1' above
your head.

| Also, circuit breakers DON'T eliminate all risk from cutting the cable;
| they merely reduce it.
|
| Yes, Nick, they reduce it to non-lethal levels and so eliminate any risk
| of death.

I suggest that you investigate further. Even the best breakers take
milliseconds to cut the current, and a bad (i.e. well-connected) shock
across the chest can kill in less time than that.

| I have felled, cut up and dug up several modest trees of 9" diameter
| (e.g. 20' apples) in less than a day, using nothing more than a decent
| bowsaw and other manual tools. Trees of much above that should be left
| to professionals.
|
| Or to people with chainsaws who know what they are doing, as I do.

Your opinion of your own competence is noted.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

sally H wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

I've read all the advice below........now I'll ask........'why' do you want
a chainsaw, ie, specific perpose??
--
ßôyþëtë
London, UK

In article ,
Malcolm writes:
|
|| I'm beginning to wonder whether you have the slightest idea what I am
| talking about. The hard hat I have has ear defenders which reduce the
| noise to acceptable decibel levels according to the relevant British
| Standard specification, and a fine wire gauze visor which is hinged so
| that it comes down in front of the whole face and protects it, but
| especially the eyes, from sawdust and larger particles, which can fly
| out at some speed from the saw blade. Indeed, if I'm doing much sawing,
| I will wear goggles as well. But then I'm rather fond of my hearing and
| my eyesight, and looking after them in this way seems good common sense
| to me, as well as being mandatory for professionals and mandatory on
| training courses which instruct you about wearing the necessary
| protective items.

I have some news for you, that you are apparently unaware of. You can
buy quite excellent quality ones that do not need to be attached to a
helmet.

| You should NEVER cut anything heavy above your head, chainsaw, bowsaw
| or light saber. A helmet will not protect you from a broken neck, and
| a light branch will not crack a skull when falling from a mere 1' above
| your head.
|
| Sigh.
|
| No, Nick, of *course* you shouldn't and of *course* it won't.
| But it *will* protect your head against knocks as well as providing a
| very strong framework to which the vital ear defenders and visor can be
| attached. And, believe it or not, things can bang into your head (or
| vice versa) when working around trees even without you cutting anything
| above head level.

Bizarre. You are far more likely to knock your head when poking around
cupboards in the home - and knocking your head in the bath or shower is
a very common cause of death. Do you wear a helmet around the house, and
in the bath, too?

| Obviously they take milliseconds to cut the current, but I think we can
| take it that the laid-down electrical standards used for wiring in
| domestic houses are regarded as sufficient. The stipulated shortest
| disconnection time in "dangerous" areas around the home, e.g. bathrooms
| and gardens, is actually 0.4 seconds (400 milliseconds). which is deemed
| short enough to avoid a life-threatening electric shock. If you
| disagree, then you are saying that the IEE regulations are wrong.
|
| A circuit breaker, or in this instance what is probably better termed a
| residual current device, if properly selected and installed, will make
| it nearly impossible for anyone silly enough to slice through the cable
| supplying a chainsaw, which is what, after all, I have been talking
| about, to receive a dangerous shock. If you don't believe me, I suggest
| you do some experiments, but don't forget to wear a helmet while you do
| them!

I don't give a damn what you do to yourself, but I don't like seeing
you misleading other people into dangerous practices. You clearly
know next to nothing about this area - and, as part of my previous
task at work, I did need to find out about it.

The safety regulations are what is required to reduce the risk to what
the authorities believe is an acceptable level (and all evidence is
that they are right). Such devices do NOT eliminate ALL risk of death
by electric shock; indeed, anyone with an adequate knowledge of either
physiology or physics would know that they can't.

The latter case is simpler, so I shall explain that. There is a very
small chance that cutting a cable (possibly combined with a device that
has the neutral wire incorrectly attached to the casing - a very common
error) will pass the current from the live to the neutral through the
person. In that case, a RCD will NOT trip.

So, everybody except Malcolm, use RCDs but don't trust them to give you
absolute protection from shock. Don't use mains electrical devices in
wet conditions, wear insulating boots (and possibly gloves, too) and
generally be careful. Malcolm is welcome to trust the RCDs absolutely.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Malcolm writes:
|
| So what? The wearing of a helmet is mandatory for professionals and on
| training courses, and I prefer to wear one. As I understand it, you've
| never used a chainsaw, and you've very obviously never been on a
| chainsaw training course, so your views are strictly limited in value.

Your understanding is incorrect.

| I note that you have realised you have nothing sensible to say on the
| matter. If you want to work in close proximity to trees being felled and
| branches being stripped off without head protection, then you are
| welcome to do so. But DON'T mislead people into thinking it's safe.

That is changing the context.

| Your instruction to me in your last message was: "I suggest that you
| investigate further."

And I suggest that you do so.

| I did so and came up with information which I posted and which doesn't
| agree with you - now there's a surprise. You clearly don't believe that
| the IEE Wiring Regulations are correct. In that case, what have you done
| about it, other than show up your ignorance about chainsaws?

That is a deliberate misquotation.


Carry on - I am bored with your trolling.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 23 Mar, 23:46, "sally H" wrote:
I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.

You seem to have opened a can of worms here Sally ;~}
You've decided you have the wood and trees that justify the expense of
the saw, safety kit and training and the significant effort involved
in the training, all you are asking is for saw recommendations.

I can't offer anything on the low end 'occasional user' saws because
I have no experience of them. Most chainsaw work even in large gardens
such as those I worked in can be tackled safely and comfortably with
saws such as those offered by Stihl as 'mid range professional saws'
At the smaller end of that range is their MS260 - the successor to the
026 which has been a favourite of gardeners and tree workers for many
years. It is a 50cc machine with a choice of guide bars from 13" to
18", easy to start, not too heavy, very little vibration, nice clean
burning engine, fast smooth cutting, reliable and backed by good
servicing dealers. We had 2 of the 026s at work where they really did
work and I now own an M260. At work faced with several machines to
choose from I picked up the 026 perhaps 99 times in every 100. Don't
be put off by the catalogue price, you should be able to buy one at a
discount of around 20%, ie. around £400 and you'll never need to buy
another one. With a 15" guide bar and the training provided by the 5
day basic course you'll be able to safely fell trees up to 15" dia.
You could go up to 30" dia with further training though most folks
would prefer to use a bigger saw for those. The saw is small enough
and light enough for general cutting up of fallen trees and for low
level pruning - not above chest height and absolutely not from a
ladder.

Rod wrote:
On 23 Mar, 23:46, "sally H" wrote:

I should like to buy a small chainsaw and should like recommendations
please.
Thanks.


You seem to have opened a can of worms here Sally ;~}
You've decided you have the wood and trees that justify the expense of
the saw, safety kit and training and the significant effort involved
in the training, all you are asking is for saw recommendations.

Lidl had a small electric chain saw in the special offers about a week
ago, and there was one left in my local Lidl yesterday. I think they
were £40. I have a small electric Black and Decker which has proved
very reliable and is quiet, unlike the two stroke I had before which was
VERY noisy.

All the best,

Chris Potts

In article ,
Chris Potts writes:
|
| Lidl had a small electric chain saw in the special offers about a week
| ago, and there was one left in my local Lidl yesterday. I think they
| were £40. I have a small electric Black and Decker which has proved
| very reliable and is quiet, unlike the two stroke I had before which was
| VERY noisy.

The money for the chainsaw isn't the issue. While even the best
bowsaw is cheaper, the difference between 20 and 40 quid is neither
here nor there. The 5 day course and full protective kit costs FAR
more than that!

Whenever this has come up before, all of the professionals have
confirmed the bowsawyers' claims that using a bowsaw is much safer
and no more effort and time for small amounts of cutting down and
up. While there ARE circumstances when using a chainsaw is safe
without either the full kit (including a kevlar 'overall') or proper
training, damn few people will know when that is so without training.
And a 5 day course isn't justified unless you do a LOT of such work
or are particularly interested.

In this context, it would be useful to know how much such work the
OP is planning to do, in terms of number and size of trees removed,
tons of wood or whatever, per annum.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Malcolm wrote:
In article , Nick Maclaren
writes

In article ,
Malcolm writes:
BIG snip

Having watched aborealists at work at close quarters outside my home, I have
to say that every thing you say seems to be correct. Apart from it being
common sense of course.
--
ßôyþëtë
London, UK

In article ,
"BoyPete" writes:
| Malcolm wrote:
|
| BIG snip
|
| Having watched aborealists at work at close quarters outside my home, I have
| to say that every thing you say seems to be correct. Apart from it being
| common sense of course.

I have never seen one wear a helmet and no protective trousers when
cutting below chest height. Where did you see that bizarre behaviour?


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.