I've been lurking here a week or so and it seems that there is enough
expertise around here for there to be someone to help me with my
problem.

I have recently come back to veg gardening by getting an allotment in
Cambridge. It has been 25 years or so since I put down the lawn at home
to grass when our first child came along.

At that time my bible for growing veg was "Know and Grow Vegetables"
published by Oxford UP and written by P J Salter and others of the
National Vegetable Research Station. It is long out of print but I have
obtained a secondhand copy.

What I found particularly useful then was the idea of pregerminating
seeds (on damp paper in a plastic box in the airing cupboard). I have
used it successfully this year in the allotment. The pregerminated bean
and sweetcorn seeds went into individual pots; the peas went straight in
the ground once they were germinated.

However, what one is supposed to do with smaller seeds after
pregermination is mix them in something like wallpaper paste, put them
in a plastic bag, cut a corner off, and squeeze a line of paste + seeds
into one's drill in the soil. This is the so-called "Fluid Sowing"
method, and very fine it is too. It means you don't have to handle the
seeds with their delicate roots and they come out fairly equally spaced
into the drill.

The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
it. I presume that would kill the plants. Unfortunately you only appear
to be able to get such paste with fungicide in it these days. I did try
and make a flour paste, but it was a lumpy mess and the seeds, though
nicely germinated when I put them in it, failed completely to come up.

Please can anyone suggest a substitute product I could buy or an
idiot-proof recipe for a suitable paste. The technique is too valuable
to lose.


--
tragomaschalos
Cambridge

(tragomaschalos: Classical Greek adjective meaning "with armpits smelling like
a he-goat")

In article ,
Philip Lund writes:
|
| The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
| it. I presume that would kill the plants. Unfortunately you only appear
| to be able to get such paste with fungicide in it these days.

It may also include an algicide, and that could well harm vascular
plant seedlings.

| I did try
| and make a flour paste, but it was a lumpy mess and the seeds, though
| nicely germinated when I put them in it, failed completely to come up.
|
| Please can anyone suggest a substitute product I could buy or an
| idiot-proof recipe for a suitable paste. The technique is too valuable
| to lose.

The following is how to make flour-and-water paste. I don't know
if strong or cake flour would work better, but you must use white,
plain flour.

Stir a small quantity of flour together with a small quantity of
cold water until it forms a smooth paste. Stir in enough more cold
water until it has the texture of very thin cream. Heat it gently,
stirring constantly, until it starts to thicken.

Whenever it starts to thicken, immediately remove it from the heat,
and stir in enough more water of a similar (but not hotter)
temperature to restore it to a thin cream. You are finished when
it has been at boiling point for a couple of minutes with no change.

Under NO circumstances heat it on the stove or by adding hot water
when it has even a proto-lump in it.

You can recover from minor lumpiness by sieving, mixing THOROUGHLY,
and recooking, but major lumpiness is irrecoverable.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Sep 3, 5:37 pm, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,Philip Lund writes:

|
| The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
| it. I presume that would kill the plants. Unfortunately you only appear
| to be able to get such paste with fungicide in it these days.

It may also include an algicide, and that could well harm vascular
plant seedlings.

| I did try
| and make a flour paste, but it was a lumpy mess and the seeds, though
| nicely germinated when I put them in it, failed completely to come up.
|
| Please can anyone suggest a substitute product I could buy or an
| idiot-proof recipe for a suitable paste. The technique is too valuable
| to lose.

The following is how to make flour-and-water paste. I don't know
if strong or cake flour would work better, but you must use white,
plain flour.

Stir a small quantity of flour together with a small quantity of
cold water until it forms a smooth paste. Stir in enough more cold
water until it has the texture of very thin cream. Heat it gently,
stirring constantly, until it starts to thicken.

Whenever it starts to thicken, immediately remove it from the heat,
and stir in enough more water of a similar (but not hotter)
temperature to restore it to a thin cream. You are finished when
it has been at boiling point for a couple of minutes with no change.

Under NO circumstances heat it on the stove or by adding hot water
when it has even a proto-lump in it.

You can recover from minor lumpiness by sieving, mixing THOROUGHLY,
and recooking, but major lumpiness is irrecoverable.


Just replace water with milk, season to taste with salt, pepper and
nutmeg, and you have a good bechamel.

Cat(h) (so, it may not be suitable to sow germinated seeds, but it's
spiffing poured over blanched swiss chard and gratine in the oven)

In article . com,
"Cat(h)" writes:
|
| Just replace water with milk, season to taste with salt, pepper and
| nutmeg, and you have a good bechamel.

Not quite. For bechamel, you gently cook the flour in butter first.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Sep 3, 5:50 pm, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article . com,"Cat(h)" writes:

|
| Just replace water with milk, season to taste with salt, pepper and
| nutmeg, and you have a good bechamel.

Not quite. For bechamel, you gently cook the flour in butter first.

Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Gasp. In the trauma of a Monday, I forget my basic roux making
skills.
Well spotted.
Cat(h)

In message , Nick Maclaren
writes
Whenever it starts to thicken, immediately remove it from the heat,
and stir in enough more water of a similar (but not hotter)
temperature to restore it to a thin cream. You are finished when
it has been at boiling point for a couple of minutes with no change.

Thanks for the advice, though I don't think I quite get the above
paragraph. Won't this process just go on for ever with me stirring in
ever more water, it thickening, me taking it off and stirring in more
water, ad infinitum? I envisage a room full of jam kettles with enough
nearly ready flour paste to fluid sow an East Anglian prairie.

--
Philip Lund
Cambridge

"Nick Maclaren" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Philip Lund writes:
|
| The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
| it. I presume that would kill the plants. Unfortunately you only appear
| to be able to get such paste with fungicide in it these days.

It may also include an algicide, and that could well harm vascular
plant seedlings.

| I did try
| and make a flour paste, but it was a lumpy mess and the seeds, though
| nicely germinated when I put them in it, failed completely to come up.
|
| Please can anyone suggest a substitute product I could buy or an
| idiot-proof recipe for a suitable paste. The technique is too valuable
| to lose.

The following is how to make flour-and-water paste. I don't know
if strong or cake flour would work better, but you must use white,
plain flour.

Weak, cake (i.e.'plain' flour - not bread flour) would work best.

Mary

"Cat(h)" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Sep 3, 5:37 pm, (Nick Maclaren) wrote:
In article ,Philip Lund
writes:

|
| The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
| it. I presume that would kill the plants. Unfortunately you only
appear
| to be able to get such paste with fungicide in it these days.

It may also include an algicide, and that could well harm vascular
plant seedlings.

| I did try
| and make a flour paste, but it was a lumpy mess and the seeds, though
| nicely germinated when I put them in it, failed completely to come up.
|
| Please can anyone suggest a substitute product I could buy or an
| idiot-proof recipe for a suitable paste. The technique is too valuable
| to lose.

The following is how to make flour-and-water paste. I don't know
if strong or cake flour would work better, but you must use white,
plain flour.

Stir a small quantity of flour together with a small quantity of
cold water until it forms a smooth paste. Stir in enough more cold
water until it has the texture of very thin cream. Heat it gently,
stirring constantly, until it starts to thicken.

Whenever it starts to thicken, immediately remove it from the heat,
and stir in enough more water of a similar (but not hotter)
temperature to restore it to a thin cream. You are finished when
it has been at boiling point for a couple of minutes with no change.

Under NO circumstances heat it on the stove or by adding hot water
when it has even a proto-lump in it.

You can recover from minor lumpiness by sieving, mixing THOROUGHLY,
and recooking, but major lumpiness is irrecoverable.


Just replace water with milk, season to taste with salt, pepper and
nutmeg, and you have a good bechamel.

Not without butter!

Mary

In article ,
Philip Lund writes:
|
| Whenever it starts to thicken, immediately remove it from the heat,
| and stir in enough more water of a similar (but not hotter)
| temperature to restore it to a thin cream. You are finished when
| it has been at boiling point for a couple of minutes with no change.
|
| Thanks for the advice, though I don't think I quite get the above
| paragraph. Won't this process just go on for ever with me stirring in
| ever more water, it thickening, me taking it off and stirring in more
| water, ad infinitum? I envisage a room full of jam kettles with enough
| nearly ready flour paste to fluid sow an East Anglian prairie.

No. It may feel like it, but it won't. Actually, it doesn't take
all that long, with practice - my recipe is also the one you should
use when making paste for very small children to stick their hair
together and stick their clothes to themselves with, er, I mean
work with papier mache.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Get some agar flakes from the organic/green shop or even the chinese
supermarket.

These are used by the tissue culture people to make the gel that the
plants grow on in laboratory. Also other nasty things in the hospital
labs.

Agar is also used for jelly making amongst other things.

An odorless, tasteless, 100 percent vegetable gelatin made of a
variety of wild sea vegetables/seaweed. Check out 'Agar Agar flakes'
on Google.

Just make it a bit more watery than you would in making a jelly.

"Philip Lund" wrote in message
...
The book says you mustn't use wallpaper paste that has a fungicide in
it.

Try batter.

In message , bbb
writes
Get some agar flakes from the organic/green shop or even the chinese
supermarket.

This also sounds worth trying out. Thanks.

--
Philip Lund
Cambridge