The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 20:44:25 +0100, "Jill"
wrote:


"Malcolm" wrote in message
news:5943dd2c8ba77e96b5e5219530fa0635@TeraNews. ..

You are probably aware of what happened when the Iceland Group switched
to
selling exclusively organic frozen vegetables in their stores.
They lost business and switched back to conventionally grown vegetables.

Fair play to Iceland for trying, it doesn't absolve the guilty farmer
of total guilt for selling us crap.he is just playing on our apathy..

but if the customer does not want organic food why should the farmers grow
it???

Some justification for immoral earnings. The crack dealers round the
corner at the elephant say the same thing about the crack heads

and the Iceland example shows beyond a doubt that the customer - barring a
few which is fine - are not interested in organic

Irrelevant. Just because the customer is ignorant, doesn't mean they
should be taken advantage of.

The fact that you think that its best does not mean that the rest of the
buying population have to agree - they obviously do not

The rest couldn't give a stuff, don't even think about it, which is
what the Dr Evils thrive on, apathy.

So if the customer wishes a different product - I do not see why you have a
problem with a producer suppling it

Fine as long as you apply it to all business dealings, crack heads
would love it.

This was not the fault of farmers.
It was the fault of customers.

What Iceland does or doesn't is between them and their customers

correct - and if Iceland's customers do not want ot buy organic then Iceland
have to find farmers who are not growing organically to supply their
customers

Keep kidding yourself.

Do s street survey and ask people what they want, chemical soaked
produce or organic produce.


--








So, you dont like reasoned,
well thought out, civil debate?

I understand.

/´¯/)
/¯../
/..../
/´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
/'/.../..../......./¨¯\
('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
\.................'...../
''...\.......... _.·´
\..............(
\.............\..

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

"Malcolm" wrote in message
news:868541f03cc6027a6410146fe478430a@TeraNews...
On Thu, 29 May 2003 20:44:25 +0100, "Jill"
wrote:


Fair play to Iceland for trying, it doesn't absolve the guilty farmer
of total guilt for selling us crap.he is just playing on our apathy..

but if the customer does not want organic food why should the farmers
grow
it???

Some justification for immoral earnings. The crack dealers round the
corner at the elephant say the same thing about the crack heads

so what is your position in the production and supply of opium and its
derivatives?
- I presume from all your previous posts that the dealers and the users are
fine
it is the very very lowly farmer in Afganistan who is to blame for
children; teenagers; stockbrokers; computor geeks; so and so's daughter and
sons being addicts


and the Iceland example shows beyond a doubt that the customer - barring
a
few which is fine - are not interested in organic

Irrelevant. Just because the customer is ignorant, doesn't mean they
should be taken advantage of.
pardon ??

just because the customers make a choice that is not yours does not make
them any better or worse than you
it is simply their choice and they made it
Well informed too - the Iceland advertising was every where


The fact that you think that its best does not mean that the rest of the
buying population have to agree - they obviously do not

The rest couldn't give a stuff, don't even think about it, which is
what the Dr Evils thrive on, apathy.

wrong - they were well informed about hte ICeland policy and products
they chose to change from buying them before to not buying them because they
were organic

no apathy there - very positive action


So if the customer wishes a different product - I do not see why you have
a
problem with a producer suppling it

Fine as long as you apply it to all business dealings, crack heads
would love it.

the producer can be a poor Afgany farmer - whom many have put their hand out
to help in the past years


What Iceland does or doesn't is between them and their customers

correct - and if Iceland's customers do not want ot buy organic then
Iceland
have to find farmers who are not growing organically to supply their
customers

Keep kidding yourself.

Do s street survey and ask people what they want, chemical soaked
produce or organic produce.
Street surveys are pieces of paper
Iceland went so much further - they believed the rhetoric of folk like
yourself
and put their business and their money into your ballpark
The result
The customers did not want the product
IT is so so simple
The majority of the population are not interested in your agenda
I and many other producers of free range/ organic / bio wotsit / etc;/etc
/etc food
do not have a problem with your point of view
but we are very realistic
we - as producers - know that the proportion of the population that are
1- interested
2 have the money
3 prepared to spend the money
4 prepared to make an effort

etc
etc
are very
very
small

I am glad for hte producers around you that you are one of them
but you are in a minority

--
Jill Bowis

http://www.poultryscotland.co.uk http://www.henhouses.co.uk
http://www.domesticducks.co.uk http://www.poultry-books.co.uk
http://www.kintaline.co.uk/cottage


--








So, you dont like reasoned,
well thought out, civil debate?

I understand.

/´¯/)
/¯../
/..../
/´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
/'/.../..../......./¨¯\
('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
\.................'...../
''...\.......... _.·´
\..............(
\.............\..

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 21:36:46 +0100, "Jill"
wrote:


"Malcolm" wrote in message
news:868541f03cc6027a6410146fe478430a@TeraNews. ..
On Thu, 29 May 2003 20:44:25 +0100, "Jill"
wrote:


Fair play to Iceland for trying, it doesn't absolve the guilty farmer
of total guilt for selling us crap.he is just playing on our apathy..

but if the customer does not want organic food why should the farmers
grow
it???

Some justification for immoral earnings. The crack dealers round the
corner at the elephant say the same thing about the crack heads

so what is your position in the production and supply of opium and its
derivatives?

Don't really have one, stephen poley reckons he can get it real cheap
because he often visits Europes porn capital, but me, nah I don't need
and crutches to enjoy life.

Bang the lot of them up on Papillon

- I presume from all your previous posts that the dealers and the users are
fine

Nope, if someone is stupid enough to eat dirt that's their problem..

it is the very very lowly farmer in Afganistan who is to blame for
children; teenagers; stockbrokers; computor geeks; so and so's daughter and
sons being addicts

If he is the producer then yes.

and the Iceland example shows beyond a doubt that the customer - barring
a
few which is fine - are not interested in organic

Irrelevant. Just because the customer is ignorant, doesn't mean they
should be taken advantage of.
pardon ??

just because the customers make a choice that is not yours does not make
them any better or worse than you

I never claimed otherwise.

it is simply their choice and they made it
Well informed too - the Iceland advertising was every where

Mr Average is a might dumb sucker when it comes down to it.

The fact that you think that its best does not mean that the rest of the
buying population have to agree - they obviously do not

The rest couldn't give a stuff, don't even think about it, which is
what the Dr Evils thrive on, apathy.

wrong - they were well informed about hte ICeland policy and products
they chose to change from buying them before to not buying them because they
were organic

no apathy there - very positive action

The customer chose neither organic nor non organic, they just took
what was given.

So if the customer wishes a different product - I do not see why you have
a
problem with a producer suppling it

Fine as long as you apply it to all business dealings, crack heads
would love it.

the producer can be a poor Afgany farmer - whom many have put their hand out
to help in the past years

I don't care, immoral is immoral, who cares the justification?

What Iceland does or doesn't is between them and their customers

correct - and if Iceland's customers do not want ot buy organic then
Iceland
have to find farmers who are not growing organically to supply their
customers

Keep kidding yourself.

Do s street survey and ask people what they want, chemical soaked
produce or organic produce.
Street surveys are pieces of paper
Iceland went so much further - they believed the rhetoric of folk like
yourself
and put their business and their money into your ballpark
The result
The customers did not want the product
IT is so so simple

The customer couldn't care less. that doesn't mean it's OK to kill us
off with crap produce.

The majority of the population are not interested in your agenda

What agenda, that I don't want to be abused by wackos looking to make
a quick buck?

I and many other producers of free range/ organic / bio wotsit / etc;/etc
/etc food
do not have a problem with your point of view

I don't speak for you.

but we are very realistic
we - as producers - know that the proportion of the population that are
1- interested
2 have the money
3 prepared to spend the money
4 prepared to make an effort

etc
etc
are very
very
small

I am glad for hte producers around you that you are one of them
but you are in a minority

That's fine, your opinion, at least you have done your homework, much
more then Mr Average, which is why they get away with it.
--








So, you dont like reasoned,
well thought out, civil debate?

I understand.

/´¯/)
/¯../
/..../
/´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
/'/.../..../......./¨¯\
('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
\.................'...../
''...\.......... _.·´
\..............(
\.............\..

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 20:57:07 +0100, Derek Moody
wrote:

In article 1cabe6d7a11ffdb964d9409ca5e02bd0@TeraNews, Malcolm
wrote:

crap goods and nobody wants them. In fact I have a proper job and earn
a fortune, more then enough to pay for my choice not to be poisoned by

Hello Pete, got a job?
Does that mean you can afford to pay that grand you owe the NSPCC?

Hello Mr Michael I have nothing worth listening to saunby. When will
you be coming to kill us off?
--








So, you dont like reasoned,
well thought out, civil debate?

I understand.

/´¯/)
/¯../
/..../
/´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
/'/.../..../......./¨¯\
('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
\.................'...../
''...\.......... _.·´
\..............(
\.............\..

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 19:20:16 +0100, Oz wrote:

Peter Duncanson writes

How many months emergency rations do you (and your friends and neighbours)
have personally available? (Is it even as much as a month?)

It'd be getting pretty thin (with what's in the larder) after a couple
of weeks.

How many months reserves are there in the wholesale and retail distribution
channels?

Three days retail.

What do you mean by wholesale?

I was afraid someone might ask that!

A dictionary definition is: "of, relating to, or engaged in the sale of
commodities in quantity for resale".

A cash and carry outfit like Booker seems to fit the definition with its
177 branches throughout the UK and over 500,000 trade customers.

--
Peter Duncanson
UK

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 18:23:32 GMT, Malcolm wrote:


Obviously, that doesn't give them the right to feed us and try to kill
us off at the same time.

Why would farmers try to kill off their customers?
At the very least it would be a bad business practice.

--
Peter Duncanson
UK

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

In uk.rec.gardening Peter Ashby wrote:
: In article , Tim Tyler wrote:

: That's not an accurate impression - I eat turkey, liver and kidneys - and
: fish and seafood.

: You eat liver and seafood and you claim to be keen to reduce your
: exposure to toxins?

Yes.

: You are aware I hope that many toxins the liver can't handle get
: stored in it?

Livers are good sources of many nutrients - which they act as a store
for.

They are not normally particularly more toxin-laden than other animal
tissues - they excrete the compounds they filter from the blood into
the common hepatic duct.

: Also the levels of metals, not just mercury in seafood?

Indeed.

Animal products are high in the food chain and concentrate environmental
toxins. I don't consume them to minimise my toxin risk - I do so to
increase the diversity in my diet - /despite/ a somewhat increased toxin
risk.

I deal with the toxin risk by consuming small quantites. I eat liver
about once every two months - for example.

: BTW are you aware of the previous history of the land you use to grow
: your food on?

Beyond a few years, no - except that it was the garden of a domestic
house.

There's one possible toxin risk in my garden I know about - it used to
have lots of ivy berries. I have little idea what risk this involves -
but my guess is that it is relatively small.
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

On Thu, 29 May 2003 21:52:45 +0100, Peter Duncanson
wrote:

On Thu, 29 May 2003 18:23:32 GMT, Malcolm wrote:


Obviously, that doesn't give them the right to feed us and try to kill
us off at the same time.

Why would farmers try to kill off their customers?
At the very least it would be a bad business practice.

You're asking me!! ask the dealers, the farmer, the crack heads why!

I agree, seems real daft.
--








So, you dont like reasoned,
well thought out, civil debate?

I understand.

/´¯/)
/¯../
/..../
/´¯/'...'/´¯¯`·¸
/'/.../..../......./¨¯\
('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
\.................'...../
''...\.......... _.·´
\..............(
\.............\..

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: "Tim Tyler" wrote in message ...
: In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: : "Tim Tyler" wrote in message ...
: : In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: : : "Tim Tyler" wrote in message

: : : I'm not sure how best to deal with pollution. Probably the world
: : : should tax the pollutors - and use the proceeds to undo the damage
: : : they cause.
: :
: : : so if you are rich you are allowed to pollute? [...]
: :
: : Basically you would only be permitted to make a mess if
: : reasonable steps to clean it up afterwards followed.
: :
: : More realistic than attempts to curb pollution entirely -
: : and more environmentally friendly than permitting it to
: : go on unchecked.
:
: : just stop the pollution in the first place. ban the flying of fruit. If
: : it cannot survive by sea then tough
:
: I don't think that is a realistic goal, though.

: so you would happily let the destruction of the environment continue

I recall I just mentioned a plan for decreasing pollution levels:

``I'm not sure how best to deal with pollution. Probably the world
should tax the pollutors - and use the proceeds to undo the
damage they cause.''

Pollution is already monitored and controlled by governments -
but probably not anywhere near enough.
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

Tim Tyler writes

Animal products are high in the food chain and concentrate environmental
toxins.

Seafood more than most because the stuff we eat are predators of
predators of predators.

Unless you eat krill that is (and even then).

Much safer to eat ruminants. Only one stage.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

Peter Duncanson writes

Oz:
What do you mean by wholesale?

I was afraid someone might ask that!

A dictionary definition is: "of, relating to, or engaged in the sale of
commodities in quantity for resale".

Hmmm.

Well for vegetables typically it's one stop, grower to supermarket.
So none.

For things like flour, grain stores at millers are typically a few
weeks (or less). Flour stores are probably much less.

--
Oz
This post is worth absolutely nothing and is probably fallacious.
Note: soon (maybe already) only posts via despammed.com will be accepted.

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

"Old Codger" wrote in message
...
"Oz" wrote in message
...

It's like cars and congestion.

"They" shouldn't be allowed on the roads because 'they'
cause
congestion.

"We" should be freely allowed on the roads, of course ...

This is getting to be a habit, again I agree with Oz. If it
wasn't for all the other buggers motoring would be a
pleasure. :-)


Could I invite a select few to try the M6 in Cumbria, north of Junction 36.
Motoring as it used to be, I have found myself doing 80 in the left hand
lane with no other vehicle in sight

Jim Webster

--
Old Codger
e-mail use reply to field

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: "Tim Tyler" wrote in message ...
: In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: : "Tim Tyler" wrote in message
...
: : In uk.rec.gardening Jim Webster wrote:
: : : "Tim Tyler" wrote in message

: : : I'm not sure how best to deal with pollution. Probably the world
: : : should tax the pollutors - and use the proceeds to undo the
damage
: : : they cause.
: :
: : : so if you are rich you are allowed to pollute? [...]
: :
: : Basically you would only be permitted to make a mess if
: : reasonable steps to clean it up afterwards followed.
: :
: : More realistic than attempts to curb pollution entirely -
: : and more environmentally friendly than permitting it to
: : go on unchecked.
:
: : just stop the pollution in the first place. ban the flying of fruit. If
: : it cannot survive by sea then tough
:
: I don't think that is a realistic goal, though.

: so you would happily let the destruction of the environment continue

I recall I just mentioned a plan for decreasing pollution levels:

``I'm not sure how best to deal with pollution. Probably the world
should tax the pollutors - and use the proceeds to undo the
damage they cause.''

I already dealt with that, you are happy to allow pollution for the rich.


Pollution is already monitored and controlled by governments -
but probably not anywhere near enough.

So it is someone elses problem.

Do your bit, stop buying food flown in, just buy stuff that comes by sea.

Jim Webster
--

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

Xref: kermit uk.environment.conservation:43449 uk.rec.gardening:146290 uk.rec.natural-history:14952 uk.business.agricultu114260

In uk.rec.gardening Oz wrote:
: Tim Tyler writes
:In uk.rec.gardening Oz wrote:
:: Tim Tyler writes
::In uk.rec.gardening Oz wrote:
::: Tim Tyler writes
:
:::I'm not sure how best to deal with pollution. Probably the world should
:::tax the pollutors - and use the proceeds to undo the damage they cause.
::
::: Ultimately the consumer is the polluter.
::
::: If they did not demand and buy the things that have caused the
::: pollution, then they would never have been made and the pollution
::: would never have happened.
::
::The consumer just wants the fruit.
::
::Where it is grown - and whether it is transported by burning fossil fuels
::- is not under their control,
:
:: ********. Just refuse to buy imported products.
:
:Well, you could do that -

: And if you have conservationist views, you SHOULD do that.
: All else is hypocrisy.

My diet is the way it is for health reasons; conservationist issues
enter into the picture only rather peripherally.

::and consequently it's hard to see how they
::can be held responsible for any resulting damage.
:
:: By buying them. They are the SOLE cause.
:: If they didn't buy them, they wouldn't be shipped over.
:: YOU are responsible.
:
:No event as complex as shipping fruit around can possibly
:have a single cause.

: It does. The cause is consumer demand allowing a business to produce
: them to be set up. It's horribly simple.

It does not. Perhaps you need to look up the word "cause" in a dictionary?

:You could equally well argue that if the farmer didn't pick them,
:they wouldn't be shipped over - or if the aeroplane pilot
:didn't take off they wouldn't be shipped over.

: No, because they are directly doing it on behalf of and paid for by the
: consumer.

Nobody's forcing them to perform these actions. The pilot takes off
under his own free will. There is no coercion. If he was concerned
about the environment he could simply avoid taking the action that
directly damages it.

::Even if they /could/ specify how it was done, blame would still not
::be clear:
::
::If A pays B to shoot C, who should be imprisoned for C's murder?
:
:: A and B, in all courts of law I know of.
:
:You suprise me - A has committed no murder.

: Murder by proxy.

Conspiring to commit murder is a bit of a different crime from murder.

: On you argument they should kill the gun used, and let both A & B go free.

No - guns can't choose.

If you hit someone with a club, you are the offender - not the club -
since it has no freedom to behave otherwise.
--
__________
|im |yler http://timtyler.org/

The dangers of weed killers - Glyphostae aka Roundup, the hidden killer.
 

"Jim Webster" wrote in message
...

"Old Codger" wrote in message
...
"Oz" wrote in message
...

It's like cars and congestion.

"They" shouldn't be allowed on the roads because
'they'
cause
congestion.

"We" should be freely allowed on the roads, of course
....

This is getting to be a habit, again I agree with Oz.
If it
wasn't for all the other buggers motoring would be a
pleasure. :-)


Could I invite a select few to try the M6 in Cumbria,
north of Junction 36.
Motoring as it used to be, I have found myself doing 80 in
the left hand
lane with no other vehicle in sight

Problem is getting there Jim. Lower down it is as bad, or
worse, as the M25.

--
Old Codger
e-mail use reply to field