hhmmm...

i have always been blessed to surround
myself with contacts in common interests
that are 20 or 25 or 30 or 40 or even 50 years
my senior...there is so much to be learned
from the adventures that these people can
have in comparison to people my own age...

much wisdom lies in those relationships...
and great guidance...
reconsider keeping the bonsai, the bonsai club
of 'elders'...and maybe consider the essence
of your strife is not in that, but in the choices that
you make that perpetuate your hurried lifestyle...

most times, i've found it beneficial to learn from the
models of the happier people around me...bonsai-ist
and bagpipers...where they are usually 50-80 years old...
and i think...wow...i can be happy and appreciative like
them at only 35...

and we didn't sign on to do bonsai to be gods...
the deaths of plants and trees make us realize that
nature and life is precious...and each death gives
us something to compare the happiness of a life to...
maybe it is not your creativity that needs challenging,
but your techincal and botanical skills...to be god
to a tree is tough work...to know how to take care of
it and make sure the balance of life keeps thriving
is a challenge first a foremost...


good luck!


smiles,
alicia
----- Original Message -----
From: "adam roler"
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 8:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits.
i don't have time. i am a young man with a wife and a
toddler. i work 50 to 55 hours a week to try to get ahead.


i have tried my local club but the only advice i
have been given is (...stuff you didn't like to hear...)
i am 27 years old. all the
people at my local club that i have met or talked to are
over 50 (or at least significantly older than me).

i wish
so much to feel like the last two and a half years in this
art were not wasted, but it gets harder every day. i look
at my trees now and feel helpless. i don't want to quit
but it seems i have no other option.

adam roler

=====

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++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
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+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

other thoughts...

no money? want a challenge? BORED?

here you go...herb gustafson's minature bonsai...
(hi Herb!
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/boo...909838& itm=2

the FIRST bonsai book i ever owned, thanks to LEN
of this list,
this will give you the challenge of a lifetime...

try to make bonsai that fit in the cap of an acorn!
herb's book talks about how to find seedlings...
around your own neighborhood...how to
use everyday plants from your plant shop/home
shop for miniature bonsai...

give that a try, then tell me that you are BORED...

smiles,
alicia
----- Original Message -----
From: "adam roler"
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 8:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of

adam roler


************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Dear Adam,

I don't know if "bored" is the right word to use. You don't sound
so much "bored" as you sound "overwhelmed". I have to tell you
that the reason I love doing bonsai is that it is a fantastic
"sanity-saver". I started doing my first bonsais when I had three
of my children in the teenage years- talk about needing a
sanity-saver! When my last one moved out of the house, the trees
really started moving in. Now I have a whole new set of
"children" to raise- and I love it!

I have dealt with the demands of a job (I still do- I am not a
"septuagenarian"- love that word- but I did pass the half century
mark last year), the demands of raising a toddler (I did that
four times over and survived), and a big thing IS setting
priorities. Of course your family is your first and main concern-
I would be really worried about you if it wasn't. But as some of
our fellow bonsai folk have said, outside of the wonders of
springtime and all the fun repotting and wiring and pruning,
taking care of your trees doesn't have to be a full time job in
itself. I find working on my trees very relaxing, and if I have
had a stressful day and my husband sees me working at an unusual
hour on my trees, he knows to just let me be- and I will be fine.
They are a great balance in a world that all to often seems too
out of balance. I agree whole heartedly with Jim Lewis- stay away
from that "boob-tube"- nothing on there worthwhile to watch for
relaxation purposes. Though I will admit to watching the last
fifteen minutes of "The Apprentice" to see who Donald Trump gets
to tell- "You're fired!"
====================

This is why I love all of you!

Jim

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++++Sponsored, in part, by Marc Zimmerman++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Adam,

My turn to chime in here. Most of us, who have been working this hobby a while have seen many of our trees die, for reasons known and unknown. It's part of the learning curve. Being busy and over busy is part of our culture now. Squeezing in time -forc
ing ourselves to MAKE the time- for our trees is one of the things many of us face. I just celebrated the 29th anniversary of my 21st birthday yesterday, so perhaps being an -old guy- makes this hard to relate, but I also have a teenage daughter and a 10
year old son. I've been juggling bonsai and family over the last 20+ years. It can be done.

I agree with Nina about your local club. If someone told ME they couldn't find trees to work besides those you listed I'd nut up, and tell them to get over to my house and I'd let them choose from any potensai they want, and I've got LOTS to choose from.
I love it when someone young enough (like you) to live with a tree (or trees) is interested in bonsai and would do all I could to encourage and help them.

I have a hard time still with some time management. Where I am it's now spring. The almond and apricot blossoms are out, peaches in the popcorn stage, and I've got bud swell going on, on too many trees to work. It's also baseball season (I coach at the
local high school, and little league) which consumes over 5 hours daily of physical time, and several more in -head- time. Some things don't get done to my trees in a timely manor. Oh well.

Four years ago I posted this message to this list in answer to a newbies question about what bonsai is:

It's all that, and more. It's frame of mind, it's the never finished
painting, growth, death, rebirth, success, failure, joy, disappointment, and
much, much more.

I still believe it. Be at ease and do what's right for you, bonsai and it's joys will still be here when you are ready again.
Regards,
Shelly Hurd Central CA - Sunset Zone 8-USDA Zone 9

----- Original Message -----
From: adam roler
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 6:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my life. but
now as i watch powerlessly as all my beautiful trees die, i
am almost certain that a chapter in my life has closed.
SNIP

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Adam,

My turn to chime in here. Most of us, who have been working this hobby a while have seen many of our trees die, for reasons known and unknown. It's part of the learning curve. Being busy and over busy is part of our culture now. Squeezing in time -forc
ing ourselves to MAKE the time- for our trees is one of the things many of us face. I just celebrated the 29th anniversary of my 21st birthday yesterday, so perhaps being an -old guy- makes this hard to relate, but I also have a teenage daughter and a 10
year old son. I've been juggling bonsai and family over the last 20+ years. It can be done.

I agree with Nina about your local club. If someone told ME they couldn't find trees to work besides those you listed I'd nut up, and tell them to get over to my house and I'd let them choose from any potensai they want, and I've got LOTS to choose from.
I love it when someone young enough (like you) to live with a tree (or trees) is interested in bonsai and would do all I could to encourage and help them.

I have a hard time still with some time management. Where I am it's now spring. The almond and apricot blossoms are out, peaches in the popcorn stage, and I've got bud swell going on, on too many trees to work. It's also baseball season (I coach at the
local high school, and little league) which consumes over 5 hours daily of physical time, and several more in -head- time. Some things don't get done to my trees in a timely manor. Oh well.

Four years ago I posted this message to this list in answer to a newbies question about what bonsai is:

It's all that, and more. It's frame of mind, it's the never finished
painting, growth, death, rebirth, success, failure, joy, disappointment, and
much, much more.

I still believe it. Be at ease and do what's right for you, bonsai and it's joys will still be here when you are ready again.
Regards,
Shelly Hurd Central CA - Sunset Zone 8-USDA Zone 9

----- Original Message -----
From: adam roler
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 6:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my life. but
now as i watch powerlessly as all my beautiful trees die, i
am almost certain that a chapter in my life has closed.
SNIP

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Adam,

As you can see there are many ways of doing bonsai and
having a life. Deciding to take a break instead of
quit, is one option.

I think I have belonged to clubs like the one in your
area, where new members are given a trial by fire to
see if they will be acceptable to the club's criteria.
These clubs are dying because of lack of new members.

I had a hard time starting bonsai. My son aged 7 at
the time wanted to learn. He was teacher's pet. so
some of the older club members put him down at every
turn instead of encoraging him. My son has a good
eye, but hadn't yet learned the rules. Rude comments
like perhaps he would gain a true apprieciation of
bonsai after he grew up or that if he didn't obey
rules, he would never be any good, etc.

There are suitable one gallon trees at your local
nursery that would be a good, cheap way to start.
Most nurseries have japanese maples, crabapples, and
some junipers (procumbens, hollywood, etc.) you can
use.

Lastly, something you have as your own and love to do
will save your saity during these times. There is the
concept that we are all creative beings and all need
to do something creative to survive.

I started bonsai at 35, I am now 63. I have had on
and off periods. When I worked full time, had a
teanager at home, and was going for my masters, I
thought I had to quit hobbies. I became very
irritable. The only thing that calmed me was going
out there and pinching my trees.

Regards,

Kitsune Miko
From: adam roler
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 6:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits.
as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art
than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that
could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my
life. but
now as i watch powerlessly as all my beautiful
trees die, i
am almost certain that a chapter in my life has
closed.
SNIP


************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken
Rutledge++++

************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
+++++

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Adam,

As you can see there are many ways of doing bonsai and
having a life. Deciding to take a break instead of
quit, is one option.

I think I have belonged to clubs like the one in your
area, where new members are given a trial by fire to
see if they will be acceptable to the club's criteria.
These clubs are dying because of lack of new members.

I had a hard time starting bonsai. My son aged 7 at
the time wanted to learn. He was teacher's pet. so
some of the older club members put him down at every
turn instead of encoraging him. My son has a good
eye, but hadn't yet learned the rules. Rude comments
like perhaps he would gain a true apprieciation of
bonsai after he grew up or that if he didn't obey
rules, he would never be any good, etc.

There are suitable one gallon trees at your local
nursery that would be a good, cheap way to start.
Most nurseries have japanese maples, crabapples, and
some junipers (procumbens, hollywood, etc.) you can
use.

Lastly, something you have as your own and love to do
will save your saity during these times. There is the
concept that we are all creative beings and all need
to do something creative to survive.

I started bonsai at 35, I am now 63. I have had on
and off periods. When I worked full time, had a
teanager at home, and was going for my masters, I
thought I had to quit hobbies. I became very
irritable. The only thing that calmed me was going
out there and pinching my trees.

Regards,

Kitsune Miko
From: adam roler
To:
Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2004 6:31 PM
Subject: [IBC] bored


to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits.
as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art
than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that
could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my
life. but
now as i watch powerlessly as all my beautiful
trees die, i
am almost certain that a chapter in my life has
closed.
SNIP


************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken
Rutledge++++

************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
+++++

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

The only thing that calmed me was going out there and pinching
my trees.


Gosh! That sounds a bit cruel, to me. g

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

The only thing that calmed me was going out there and pinching
my trees.


Gosh! That sounds a bit cruel, to me. g

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Much better than kicking the dog or beating the kids.
Actually good for me and the trees.
;-}
Kitsune Miko
--- Jim Lewis wrote:
The only thing that calmed me was going out there
and pinching
my trees.


Gosh! That sounds a bit cruel, to me. g


************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken
Rutledge++++

************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
+++++

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

Much better than kicking the dog or beating the kids.
Actually good for me and the trees.
;-}
Kitsune Miko
--- Jim Lewis wrote:
The only thing that calmed me was going out there
and pinching
my trees.


Gosh! That sounds a bit cruel, to me. g


************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken
Rutledge++++

************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail
+++++

************************************************** ******************************
++++Sponsored, in part, by Ken Rutledge++++
************************************************** ******************************
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

HI
Jim Lewis wrote:

Dear Adam,

I don't know if "bored" is the right word to use. You don't sound
so much "bored" as you sound "overwhelmed". I have to tell you
that the reason I love doing bonsai is that it is a fantastic
"sanity-saver". I started doing my first bonsais when I had three
of my children in the teenage years- talk about needing a
sanity-saver! When my last one moved out of the house, the trees
really started moving in. Now I have a whole new set of
"children" to raise- and I love it!
Help? e-mail +++++

Because of few circumstances and following itnrospection
I realized yesterday that *happily * I had my bonsais all these years
exactly as you said as *sanity -saver* I did not have problem with
kids nor wife in a bad sense
but I am living in an insulated world of no-comunication... and
contact between my bonsais and myself were probbly a excellent outlet
for me
Theo

--
EU Zone 7 GE (CH)
S.O.S.Bonsai online @ : or ICQ
25 666 169 4
my bonsais:http://groups.msn.com/BonsaiItalia/ibonsaiditheo.msnw
Membro di : Internet Bonsai Society. I.B.S USA; F.F.B (BE)E.E.B.F (
FR);F.R.J.B(CH)

adam roler wrote:

to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my life. but

Spend the time and attention with your child. A little one is the worlds
best hobby!
They love to learn and do what others are doing. My grandaughter is less
than 2 years yet she loves spending time in the greenhouse helping to repot,
water, weed and enjoy. Yes she may unpot an orchid that didn't need to be
repotted from time to time but the plants always seem to survive and she
flourishes. I can't wait for spring and her help in the gardens.
She likes to be involved in what I do, yesterday she and I looked at a book
on Monet. She pointed at things in the pictures that I may not have
noticed. Later she showed me her book of Clifford the little red dog and we
played with her pack of stickers. She enjoys showing and sharing things
that are part of a toddlers world and also those things that are usually in
our world. She is not very interested in the TV shows that I like to watch
but she enjoys her shows the most when we watch them together. Blues Clues,
Dora or the Wiggles are more fun when you figure them out together and do
the moves to some of the dances. Sharing an inside joke with a toddler is
the best, she may not speak in full sentences yet but she has a great sense
of humour.
It is important for us to develop our interests so that we can share them
with others of all ages.
All the Best
Don

adam roler wrote:

to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my life. but

Spend the time and attention with your child. A little one is the worlds
best hobby!
They love to learn and do what others are doing. My grandaughter is less
than 2 years yet she loves spending time in the greenhouse helping to repot,
water, weed and enjoy. Yes she may unpot an orchid that didn't need to be
repotted from time to time but the plants always seem to survive and she
flourishes. I can't wait for spring and her help in the gardens.
She likes to be involved in what I do, yesterday she and I looked at a book
on Monet. She pointed at things in the pictures that I may not have
noticed. Later she showed me her book of Clifford the little red dog and we
played with her pack of stickers. She enjoys showing and sharing things
that are part of a toddlers world and also those things that are usually in
our world. She is not very interested in the TV shows that I like to watch
but she enjoys her shows the most when we watch them together. Blues Clues,
Dora or the Wiggles are more fun when you figure them out together and do
the moves to some of the dances. Sharing an inside joke with a toddler is
the best, she may not speak in full sentences yet but she has a great sense
of humour.
It is important for us to develop our interests so that we can share them
with others of all ages.
All the Best
Don

adam roler wrote:

to all,

well, i think its about time to call it quits. as of
late, i have been more discouraged about my art than ever.
i truly love bonsai. it is the only thing that could bring
me peace during a time of great turbulence in my life. but

Spend the time and attention with your child. A little one is the worlds
best hobby!
They love to learn and do what others are doing. My grandaughter is less
than 2 years yet she loves spending time in the greenhouse helping to repot,
water, weed and enjoy. Yes she may unpot an orchid that didn't need to be
repotted from time to time but the plants always seem to survive and she
flourishes. I can't wait for spring and her help in the gardens.
She likes to be involved in what I do, yesterday she and I looked at a book
on Monet. She pointed at things in the pictures that I may not have
noticed. Later she showed me her book of Clifford the little red dog and we
played with her pack of stickers. She enjoys showing and sharing things
that are part of a toddlers world and also those things that are usually in
our world. She is not very interested in the TV shows that I like to watch
but she enjoys her shows the most when we watch them together. Blues Clues,
Dora or the Wiggles are more fun when you figure them out together and do
the moves to some of the dances. Sharing an inside joke with a toddler is
the best, she may not speak in full sentences yet but she has a great sense
of humour.
It is important for us to develop our interests so that we can share them
with others of all ages.
All the Best
Don