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#31
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Miracle gro
"Doug Freyburger" wrote in message
... FarmI wrote: "songbird" wrote: has anyone grown cloves? The spice? Sorry, I don't live in a tropical area. When I lived in Los Angeles metro I saw a peppercorn bush at a farmers market. Even there it was for indoors. You'd need a hot house to grow a clove plant almost anywhere in the temperate zones. Huh? Since when was a peppercorn a clove? |
#32
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Miracle gro
Billy wrote:
songbird wrote: Gunner wrote: Welcome, to Gunny's world, songbird. No facts, no references, but lots of pronouncements and innuendo. Enjoy it, if you can. Gunny enjoys arguments. In part he tries to do this by starting as many arguments as possible, and as you nail him down on one, he will ignore it, and attack a different argument (personal experience). Now, you may feel like some light hearted bantering, but, trust me, he will take it as a personal challenge to crush you. Personally, I think he is a "tweaker", but that is an unsubstantiated opinion. yeah, i figured that out for several folks already, but if they decide they actually want to talk gardening practices and actual experiences then i'd still listen. Derald does seem to actually grow things in intensive and small interplantings which to me is a really productive way to grow a lot of produce and it does keep the soil covered more than monocropping and leaving the ground idle. so he's worth listening to when he's not on about you or being idiotically obtuse. i suspect they are both somehow connected to the agribusiness or the chemical business or perhaps even big oil. not that they've had the guts to give any of their backgrounds here... tis the season of hot airs... (btw Gunner assuming someone is one gender or another on usenet is pointless as i'm not here to wave my genitalia around to prove my gardening prowess, but perhaps that is what you need to be impressed) ....much snipped... Gunny, give an example of a faux google reference that I have given, please, or continue to show yourself as an idiot. Now, as far as implying that chemferts kill soil life, I don't imply, I quote experts. Teaming with Microbes: A Gardener's Guide to the Soil Food Web Jeff Lowenfels and Wayne Lewis i suppose these are just beer swilling high school dropouts without any actual soil science experiences... or? http://www.amazon.com/Teaming-Microb...l/dp/088192777 5/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1206815176&sr= 1-1 (Available at a library near you.) Chapter 1 What Is the Soil Food Web and Why Should Gardeners Care? Negative impacts on the soil food web Chemical fertilizers negatively impact the soil food web by killing off entire portions of it. What gardener hasn't seen what table salt does to a slug? Fertilizers are salts; they suck the water out of the bacteria, fungi, protozoa, and nematodes in the soil. Since these microbes are at the very foundation of the soil food web nutrient system, you have to keep adding fertilizer once you start using it regularly. The microbiology is missing and not there to do its job, feeding the plants. ....much more snipped... ---- Lab tests may tell you where you are starting, but a properly maintained garden will take you where you want to go. but do you need them? i haven't used one in all my years of gardening. if i were in a place that had difficult soils or severe climate (but one reason i live where i do is that i don't want to put up with arid soil gardening). They did throw you a bone, Gunny-boy: a properly tuned ecological garden rarely needs soluble fertilizers. That implies that there may be, on the rare occasion, a place for chemferts. QED Meanwhile, back at the ranch. no i do not have to imply that at all if i tell the OP to not dump it at all then i've helped them avoid the problems it can cause. We all know that is a grossly exagerrated lie. Nute salts are the same regardless. Ya just can't change science and really, emperical data is so much more accurate than your ilk's taste test method. Classic Gunny. Do you still beat your wife, Gunny? No attempt to show that the statement is a lie, just a simple unsubstantiated declaration that Gunny knows best. i never argue with drunks or people with guns (if i can possibly know it). As far as the nutrients from chemferts, and organic fertilizer being equivalent, Gunny is WRONG. Nitrate is nitrate to be sure, but one nitrate comes from a salt (that's bad, as you will know if you read the above), and the other comes from organic material. Just another example of Gunny-boy's ignorance, or another of his disingenuous prevarications. Are you an ilk, songbird? Do you have a taste test? Gunny-boy again makes accusations without substantiation. i do have taste tests for a lot of garden veggies and i sure know the difference between a strawberry that hasn't been sprayed with fungicides and those that have. i love being able to go out and have breakfast right in the garden as i'm weeding or picking without having to worry about various poisons that are on most produce that doesn't come from organic means. no ilk that i know of, but several inklings and a severe case of impishness at times. if by emperical data you mean millions of acres of destroyed top soil then you've got all the evidence you need from dumping "Nute salts" (whatever those are). As for being free everything has a cost. King of the bleeding obvious, Gunny-boy is. Keep burning that wood birdie, love how that saves the environment! i dunno how much more burning i'll be doing, but talking about the carbon cycle from the rotting of organic materials in the compost pile (or buried in the ground) and comparing that to what happens to the carbon when you make charcoal and the various soil nutrition aspects of that is probably a much more scientific process than telling someone "ok, dump that on the soil". but whatever. Not to mention the release into the environment of carbon that had been long sequestered (gas and oil), instead of cycling the present carbon. Three hundred and fifty parts per million of CO2 is considered safe, and we are presently at 390 ppm CO2. As St Molly said, "When you find yourself in a hole, stop digging." yep, but the selfish buggers refuse to stop their behaviors and that means that millions will be displaced as a result and likely millions will starve or die in the mayhem. Joining in the laughter!! yuk yuk. Why not? It's Gunny-boy, who is the joke ;O) Bottom line, Gunny isn't interested at arriving at an understanding. He, for some reason, wants an argument for arguments sake. nothing wrong with that if he could actually put a coherent argument together. so far i'd say _not likely_. songbird |
#33
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Miracle gro
Kumbaya, my friend, kumbaya......Grow the **** up!
You sound like ole Preacher Jones," according to Luke, chapter 2, verse.....If you don't believe the true word as I have truly spoken from the very mouth of God , the world as we know it will end. I am here to show you the TRUE light as only revealed to me by the man himself....... Ignore that man behind the curtain" Does that pretty much sum it up? The rest seems to be so much BS rhetoric. Since you ELFies hijacked the Conservation Agenda to breed with your commune "we are the world" BS view, you have pretty muched ****ed up the English speaking world's understanding of science. But your "Expert" writers can always cherry pick enough crap to trow around and get something to stick The answer is still YES Miracle Gro is ok to use |
#34
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Miracle gro
On Jul 9, 1:29*am, songbird wrote:
Billy wrote: songbird wrote: And still the answer is YES |
#35
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Miracle gro
FarmI wrote:
"Doug Freyburger" wrote: When I lived in Los Angeles metro I saw a peppercorn bush at a farmers market. Even there it was for indoors. You'd need a hot house to grow a clove plant almost anywhere in the temperate zones. Huh? Since when was a peppercorn a clove? Both well know tropicals. If you have the facilities to grow one you should be able to grow the other. In LA metro even the peppercorn plant needed to be kept in a hothouse. No way anyone in ConUS is going to be able to grow a clove plant anywhere but a hothouse. Possibly in Hawaii but definitely not in any of the continental states. |
#36
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Miracle gro
wow, your deep!
gotta say it still amazes me that you can tell all that for a internet reading. Psychic card reading and all that that black magic is amazing. Oh here ya go on that Biochar thingie for you and your little eco group here. You boys can surely twist this one as you like. Your good at pseudo science. http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...biochar-again/ |
#37
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biochar
Gunner wrote:
.... Oh here ya go on that Biochar thingie for you and your little eco group here. You boys can surely twist this one as you like. Your good at pseudo science. http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...biochar-again/ reads like a lightweight blog post but it fairly reflects what i've seen elsewhere. frauds and scammers galore, the buyer should always educate themself. songbird |
#38
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biochar
In article ,
songbird wrote: Gunner wrote: ... Oh here ya go on that Biochar thingie for you and your little eco group here. You boys can surely twist this one as you like. Your good at pseudo science. "Ad hominem" is Gunny's middle name. Is English your second language? YOU'RE not very good at it. What is this pseudo science of which you speak, or do you even know? Your fascination with "escape from nature" hydroponics seems to have blinded you to the eco-system in which your organism lives, just as surely as your lack of attention must be responsible for your not recognizing that songbird is of the feminine persuasion. http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...on-biochar-aga in/ reads like a lightweight blog post but it fairly reflects what i've seen elsewhere. You are far too generous, songbird, to refer to this blog as lightweight. Obviously Gunny isn't literate, or he would have noticed that the article claims bio-char is good. The only real question posed in it is how good. Then the article wanders-off looking for a straw man to bash, and comes up with the red herring of the "emission-free" biomass stove, which should appeal to Gunny, because it is a no-brainer. What isn't addressed is the fact that whatever emissions a biomass stove makes is small in comparison to the amount of carbon sequestered in the char. That the char from a millennia ago can still be found in the Amazon region (where decomposition rates for organic materials is very high) seems to have completely escaped Gunny's fallible powers of observation in his egregiously weak, partisan attack on "organic" farming/gardening (which is the motivating force behind most of his posts). Lastly, the article that Gunny presents rails against the exploitation of "cap and trade" in carbon credits. Beyond this exploitation is the question of why these CO2 pollution credits are given freely, instead of being sold, to polluters. That money could be used for off-sets, instead of just lining polluters pockets. frauds and scammers galore, the buyer should always educate themself. Hopefully, the new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau established by Elizabeth Warren will help (until corporations co-opt it), but the first line of defense always needs to be self-defense. Caveat emptor. songbird -- - Billy Both the House and Senate budget plan would cut Social Security and Medicare, while cutting taxes on the wealthy. Kucinich noted that none of the government programs targeted for elimination or severe cutback in House Republican spending plans "appeared on the GAO's list of government programs at high risk of waste, fraud and abuse." http://www.politifact.com/ohio/state...is-kucinich/re p-dennis-kucinich-says-gop-budget-cuts-dont-targ/ [W]e have the situation with the deficit and the debt and spending and jobs. And itšs not that difficult to get out of it. The first thing you do is you get rid of corporate welfare. Thatšs hundreds of billions of dollars a year. The second is you tax corporations so that they donšt get away with no taxation. - Ralph Nader http://www.democracynow.org/2011/7/19/ralph_naders_solution_to_debt_crisis |
#39
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biochar
Billy wrote:
songbird wrote: Gunner wrote: ... Oh here ya go on that Biochar thingie for you and your little eco group here. You boys can surely twist this one as you like. Your good at pseudo science. "Ad hominem" is Gunny's middle name. Is English your second language? YOU'RE not very good at it. What is this pseudo science of which you speak, or do you even know? Your fascination with "escape from nature" hydroponics seems to have blinded you to the eco-system in which your organism lives, just as surely as your lack of attention must be responsible for your not recognizing that songbird is of the feminine persuasion. while i am in tune with my self and have no specific concerns about which gender i appear to be on-line i do find it amusing how people pigeon hole me based upon a name. remember your biological facts and you won't be wrong in guessing. http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...on-biochar-aga in/ reads like a lightweight blog post but it fairly reflects what i've seen elsewhere. You are far too generous, songbird, to refer to this blog as lightweight. Obviously Gunny isn't literate, or he would have noticed that the article claims bio-char is good. The only real question posed in it is how good. i wasn't going to critique... not enough time or energy at the moment. Then the article wanders-off looking for a straw man to bash, and comes up with the red herring of the "emission-free" biomass stove, which should appeal to Gunny, because it is a no-brainer. What isn't addressed is the fact that whatever emissions a biomass stove makes is small in comparison to the amount of carbon sequestered in the char. That the char from a millennia ago can still be found in the Amazon region (where decomposition rates for organic materials is very high) seems to have completely escaped Gunny's fallible powers of observation in his egregiously weak, partisan attack on "organic" farming/gardening (which is the motivating force behind most of his posts). i have no idea what a biomass stove is... i haven't looked it up. as for sequestering carbon, at this stage i'm glad for any help in getting it done easily at low cost and with as few emissions as possible. Lastly, the article that Gunny presents rails against the exploitation of "cap and trade" in carbon credits. Beyond this exploitation is the question of why these CO2 pollution credits are given freely, instead of being sold, to polluters. That money could be used for off-sets, instead of just lining polluters pockets. you'd hear "the end of the earth is coming!" rhetoric if the USoA ever actually had a carbon cap and trade system. the USoA has made a lot of progress even without it in the past 20 years. i hope that progress continues. frauds and scammers galore, the buyer should always educate themself. Hopefully, the new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau established by Elizabeth Warren will help (until corporations co-opt it), but the first line of defense always needs to be self-defense. Caveat emptor. we shall see. i suspect it will be quickly defanged (if it has any teeth to begin with). songbird |
#40
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biochar
"songbird" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: songbird wrote: Gunner wrote: ... Oh here ya go on that Biochar thingie for you and your little eco group here. You boys can surely twist this one as you like. Your good at pseudo science. "Ad hominem" is Gunny's middle name. Is English your second language? YOU'RE not very good at it. What is this pseudo science of which you speak, or do you even know? Your fascination with "escape from nature" hydroponics seems to have blinded you to the eco-system in which your organism lives, just as surely as your lack of attention must be responsible for your not recognizing that songbird is of the feminine persuasion. while i am in tune with my self and have no specific concerns about which gender i appear to be on-line i do find it amusing how people pigeon hole me based upon a name. remember your biological facts and you won't be wrong in guessing. http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...on-biochar-aga in/ reads like a lightweight blog post but it fairly reflects what i've seen elsewhere. You are far too generous, songbird, to refer to this blog as lightweight. Obviously Gunny isn't literate, or he would have noticed that the article claims bio-char is good. The only real question posed in it is how good. i wasn't going to critique... not enough time or energy at the moment. Then the article wanders-off looking for a straw man to bash, and comes up with the red herring of the "emission-free" biomass stove, which should appeal to Gunny, because it is a no-brainer. What isn't addressed is the fact that whatever emissions a biomass stove makes is small in comparison to the amount of carbon sequestered in the char. That the char from a millennia ago can still be found in the Amazon region (where decomposition rates for organic materials is very high) seems to have completely escaped Gunny's fallible powers of observation in his egregiously weak, partisan attack on "organic" farming/gardening (which is the motivating force behind most of his posts). i have no idea what a biomass stove is... i haven't looked it up. as for sequestering carbon, at this stage i'm glad for any help in getting it done easily at low cost and with as few emissions as possible. Lastly, the article that Gunny presents rails against the exploitation of "cap and trade" in carbon credits. Beyond this exploitation is the question of why these CO2 pollution credits are given freely, instead of being sold, to polluters. That money could be used for off-sets, instead of just lining polluters pockets. you'd hear "the end of the earth is coming!" rhetoric if the USoA ever actually had a carbon cap and trade system. the USoA has made a lot of progress even without it in the past 20 years. i hope that progress continues. frauds and scammers galore, the buyer should always educate themself. Hopefully, the new Consumer Financial Protection Bureau established by Elizabeth Warren will help (until corporations co-opt it), but the first line of defense always needs to be self-defense. Caveat emptor. we shall see. i suspect it will be quickly defanged (if it has any teeth to begin with). songbird As in, only the males birds sing. |
#42
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biochar
On Aug 1, 8:02*am, songbird wrote:
Gunner wrote: http://www.re-char.com/2011/07/19/se...raight-on-bioc... * reads like a lightweight blog post but it fairly reflects what i've seen elsewhere. i have no idea what a biomass stove is... i haven't looked it up. (snipped from below) Really,.... Biochar? Well Bird, you need to have an " idea what a biomass stove is... " to understand biochar. Charcoal, on the other hand? Yah. just burn a bunch of wood, perhaps you will get some benefit somehow, maybe as a fluffly stuff or as a nutrient source of some sort, otherwise you just blowing smoke L&F. Wood ashes contain about 6 per cent potash, plus a good bit of some lime. A good burn of Corn cobs might give you more potash for your particular soil- 20-30 % perhaps. Just don't burn manure plies for the ash. So again, regardless of a soil test or a soil taste, what does the soil type need? A bit more potassium and Lime? Any idea of the pH your plant need? Misuse, as well as overuse is stupid. I think most will agree to that, except maybe billy. It has to be his lazy man, no till, bury it and they will come but you have to endure his political BS enroute * frauds and scammers galore, the buyer should always educate themself. As the man adeptly points out in his "lightweight article" and the reason I gave it. Zealots like billy attempt to BS about it being some sorta panacea mysticism. But that is just pseudoscience version billy pushes. The little pearl of an epiphany that only the devout can see. So you buy into his version? Does "evil chemferts" kill soil? Really you want to read deeper or R U just posturing for position like billy? If so join in one of the Google Biochar groups like this" http://groups.google.com/group/bioch...32ea18b4bc957a. Please take note, these guys are not the usual Book Writers oft referenced here as subject matter experts. Some of these guys are real serious players and not so theory lite, although your results may vary in your locale. Perhaps you can translate for billy as he & his are still a bit clueless since they read 1491 and this lame attempt to integrate terrre peta into to his great global hope will get some sort of traction. Still gotta say I am impressed with your Shamanista abilities in analyzing that man's soil solely over the Internet, quite a mystic feat. Indulge me for a moment for curiosity sake, what was the CEC and potassium level of the man's soil? BTW, still the answer is YES, it is OK to use Miracle Gro, but you know that. The rest is just posturing |
#43
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biochar
On Aug 1, 10:55*am, Billy wrote:
In article , Your fascination with "escape from nature" hydroponics seems to have blinded you to the eco-system in which your organism lives, just as surely as your lack of attention must be responsible for your not recognizing that songbird is of the feminine persuasion. Ohh billy! You been played boy and you still don't get it. Take a bit of your own political advice and go pound yourself in the ass. Power up that scooter chair billy boy, its a quick fast ride to the future and your already struggling trying to keep up. My bet is you never been in the tropics or much less spent time in any environment besides sitting your little backyard garden trying to spin your BS. Admit it billy you never been anywhere nor done anything in your little miserable existence. Your just another Walter Mitty being a legend in your own mind. Hopefully you will someday know how ignorant your statement above is. but I doubt it. |
#44
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biochar
On Aug 1, 10:55*am, Billy ignorantly wrote:
Your fascination with "escape from nature" hydroponics seems to have blinded you to the eco-system in which your organism lives, I assume this ignorance means something to you and your pseudoscience beliefs ? Perhaps when the lithium begins to take effect you will be able recall what it was. Meanwhile, have you ever spent time in nature except in your Walter Mitty mind? Until then, I believe I called songbird a Shamanista, which is colloquial gringo word play for medicine woman, her being all clairvoyant and such. A word which you later repeat. However, if you insist that she is of the feminine persuasion, who am I to stop ya. Before you try to tell everyone that you have KF ... again as you always do please send me your shoe size, I'll get ya some peppermint tennis shoes for the many times ya got your foot, or what ever, in your mouth. Meantime, it seems funny that I can grow plants using water and the evil chemicals you are telling everyone kills soil, plants and people. However you may have a point, my bonsai seems not to have any soil after I use fertilizers. Some even organic. Oh right, ...never mind I didn't put any soil in , opps, my bad. |
#45
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biochar
not likely
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