On Jan 26, 7:25*pm, jellybean stonerfish
wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:17:26 -0800, Billy wrote:
The U.S. is providing Israel with at least $8.2 million each day* in
military aid and is giving the Palestinians $0** in military aid during
Fiscal Year 2011.

We give Israel the money, and they give Palestine the bombs for free.

Those who do not study history...

US gives 3% total budget to foreighn aid while Denmark gives 52%.
--
Bud

Bud wrote:
US gives 3% total budget to foreighn aid while Denmark gives 52%.

I do not believe that a nation gives over half of it total budget to
foreign aid.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 23:06:15 +0000, Bud wrote:

US gives 3% total budget to foreighn aid while Denmark gives 52%.

We give away much more $ in bombs.

In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Bud wrote:
US gives 3% total budget to foreighn aid while Denmark gives 52%.

I do not believe that a nation gives over half of it total budget to
foreign aid.

These hard times do augur for a well tended garden, unfortunately. The
mechanism that brought these times to us is still in place. We don't
have a new Glass-Seagull act, and we (USians) are still vulnerable to
new pillages.

From Tunisia, to Egypt, to Greece, people are saying, the rich got the
money, and we got the bill. All these countries are repressive, American
client states, and all of them have imposed neo-liberal economic
policies that have worked so well that the people in these countries are
rioting. Neo-liberalism concentrates wealth in the hands of the few, and
gives emerging economies no way to protect themselves against large
economic powers, like the United States.

http://www.merip.org/mero/mero011300.html

The Collapse of WTO Negotiations: Implications for the Middle East

Robert Naiman and Steve Niva

(Robert Naiman is a Senior researcher at the Center for Economic and
Policy Research (CEPR) in Washington, DC. Steve Niva, former MERIP
Executive Committee member, teaches at Evergreen State College in
Olympia, Washington.)

January 13, 2000

Arab elites' opposition at the WTO may seem surprising given that the
IMF, World Bank and the US government have long promoted Arab regimes
supportive of their agenda and fostered Western-educated leaders
schooled in the theology of deregulation, reduced social protections,
and export-led growth. Algeria, Egypt, Jordan, Morocco and Tunisia were
all subject to IMF-imposed structural adjustment programs. Along with
Lebanon, they have all embarked upon export-led development strategies
and privatization schemes, dramatically cutting back public services.
Even Syria and the Gulf states have recently moved in this direction. . .

.. . . However, the IMF, the World Bank, and the US‚ extreme policies and
their frequently disastrous consequences for economic growth and the
exacerbation of poverty have caused some of the same Arab elites who
previously embraced the model to fear that increased compliance with WTO
and IMF mandates may cause greater economic suffering and thereby
further undermine their legitimacy. . .

.. . . At the same time, the US commitment to social standards remains
largely rhetorical. There is no evidence that the US is prepared to
negotiate trade concessions to developing countries in order to win
acceptance of social standards. Indeed, the US rejected Egyptian and
other developing countries‚ proposals to review existing WTO rules that
have undermined food security and economic diversification in the South.
-----

The above may also have precipitated 9/11. As far as I know there
haven't been demonstrations in Morocco, but there have been in
demonstrations in Algeria, Egypt, Jordan, Tunisia, Yemen, and Greece.

A good, quick read on neo-liberalism is "Bad Samaritans: The Myth of
Free Trade and the Secret History of Capitalism" by Ha-Joon Chang
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_no...stripbooks&fie
ld-keywords=The+Bad+Samaritan&x=16&y=15
(Available at better libraries near you.)
-----

The main points of neo-liberalism include:
1. THE RULE OF THE MARKET. Liberating "free" enterprise or private
enterprise from any bonds imposed by the government (the state) no
matter how much social damage this causes. Greater openness to
international trade and investment, as in NAFTA. Reduce wages by
de-unionizing workers and eliminating workers' rights that had been won
over many years of struggle. No more price controls. All in all, total
freedom of movement for capital, goods and services. To convince us this
is good for us, they say "an unregulated market is the best way to
increase economic growth, which will ultimately benefit everyone." It's
like Reagan's "supply-side" and "trickle-down" economics -- but somehow
the wealth didn't trickle down very much.

2. CUTTING PUBLIC EXPENDITURE FOR SOCIAL SERVICES like education and
health care. REDUCING THE SAFETY-NET FOR THE POOR, and even maintenance
of roads, bridges, water supply -- again in the name of reducing
government's role. Of course, they don't oppose government subsidies and
tax benefits for business.

3. DEREGULATION. Reduce government regulation of everything that
could diminsh profits, including protecting the environmentand safety on
the job.

4. PRIVATIZATION. Sell state-owned enterprises, goods and services to
private investors. This includes banks, key industries, railroads, toll
highways, electricity, schools, hospitals and even fresh water. Although
usually done in the name of greater efficiency, which is often needed,
privatization has mainly had the effect of concentrating wealth even
more in a few hands and making the public pay even more for its needs.

5. ELIMINATING THE CONCEPT OF "THE PUBLIC GOOD" or "COMMUNITY" and
replacing it with "individual responsibility." Pressuring the poorest
people in a society to find solutions to their lack of health care,
education and social security all by themselves -- then blaming them, if
they fail, as "lazy."
------

When the Soviet Union collapsed, people survived because of there
gardens. Don't think that it can't happen here. So, water those plants,
and renew the mulch.
----

Heading this on back to the barn. I'm a couple of weeks away from
germinating plants for the 2011 garden. I'm thrilled to be here. The
overlooked potatoes have already expressed themselves and are on their
way to a new bed. Sulfured around the blueberrys this morning. I've had
them for 5 years now and they haven't done much. I'm hoping the sulfur
will give them a kick in the hip pockets. I'll start with germinating
the lettuce, cabbage, and peas. In the following month, I'll start the
tomatoes, peppers, and whatever else I can shoehorn in, as fast as I
can. Hope to be in the ground (the crops) by mid-May at the latest.
Hoping for some heat this year. Last year, here, was very nice to live
in, but it was crummy for gardens in Northern California.
--
- Billy
“When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist.�
-Archbishop Helder Camara
http://peace.mennolink.org/articles/...acegroups.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth...130964689.html

Interesting article on the middle east and the WTO.

I see the world from a different perspective. I see the world in terms of
evolution. First there was tribes, then city states, then nations, then
finally groups of nations:
Like the United States, European Union, Failed Soviet Union, The failed
United Nations. Each of which had extreme violence in their evolutionary
formation. What is left and last is the formation of a one world
government. This will happen if the human race survives.

Things change, economic and social models of the past will not work. Like
restoring the Glass–Steagall Act of 1932, going back to slavery, stopping
gay marriages or even getting rid of multinational corporations. When ever
their is a problem many look to the past for answers. Try looking to the
future for the answers.

In the future, imagine a world in which through automation that ten percent
of the worlds population can provide for one hundred percent of the worlds
goods and services. We are heading in this direction. This is the scenario
for the rich getting richer and poor getting poorer. What kind of economic
system will be in place where ninety percent of the world will have no
jobs? It will not be capitalism!

The only answer that will work is a one world government. One that can deal
with the four prophets of doom: over population, fresh water, global
warming and nuclear weapons. Only a strong one world government can deal
with these problems. Until then I see a world collapsing into chaos. This
may take decades and only if the human race can survive the four horseman.
Until then, in see the multinational corporations ruling the earth, which
in the end leave the planet in a great mess. The corporations will use Asia
as the manufacturing for cheap labor and the U.S. as the security for those
corporate interest around the world.

I see those individuals that are be self sufficient in providing their own
shelter and food will have the best opportunities of survival in the coming
times. I have five inches of new snow this morning. I will begin some seed
starting next week for petunias and peppers. Today will be a baking day,
fresh bread, cookies and perhaps a chocolate cake. I can smell the aromas
now.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Things change, economic and social models of the past will not work. Like
restoring the Glass–Steagall Act of 1932, going back to slavery, stopping
gay marriages or even getting rid of multinational corporations. When ever
their is a problem many look to the past for answers. Try looking to the
future for the answers.


The Glass–Steagall Act of 1932 worked well for 70 years, and has not
been replaced to insure that "Great Depression III" doesn't occur.

If you want to know your future, look at your past. We see that
neo-liberal economics doesn't work, and is only proposed by those that
don't understand it, or profit from it. What we are seeing now, around
the Mediterranean, is the "push-back" by people who don't have a livable
choice, against those who say,"Greed is good".
---

On the eve of this G-20 (Toronto) gathering, let’s look at a few facts.
Fact, the world has divided into rich and poor as at no time in our
history. The richest 2% own more than half the household wealth in the
world. The richest 10% hold 85% of total global assets and the bottom
half of humanity owns less than 1% of the wealth in the world. The three
richest men in the world have more money than the poorest 48 countries.
Fact, while those responsible for the 2008 global financial crisis were
bailed out and even rewarded by the G-20 government’s gathering here,
the International Labor Organization tells us that in 2009, 34 million
people were added to the global unemployed, swelling those ranks to 239
million, the highest ever recorded. Another 200 million are at risk in
precarious jobs and the World Bank tells us that at the end of 2010,
another 64 million will have lost their jobs.
http://www.democracynow.org/2010/7/2/maude

Most of us cannot completely disconnect from the grid, but we increase
our survivability in direct proportion to the extent that we can. South
America was nearly ruined by the IMF imposition of "structural
adjustment programs" (See Oliver Stone's documentary "South of the
Border"), which corporate controlled Washington calls socialism (vs. a
capitalistic aristocracy).

South America, the Asian Tigers, and now the Mediterranean have all come
to feel the harsh effects of neo-liberal economics. Our government
leaves us no privacy, our web browsing leads to tailor made commercials
for us, 90% of the U.S. news media is controlled by 5 companies*. Food
production is in the hands of a few.**

You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.

"Bad Samaritans: The Myth of Free Trade and the Secret History of
Capitalism" by Ha-Joon Chang
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_no...stripbooks&fie
ld-keywords=The+Bad+Samaritan&x=16&y=15
(available at better libraries near you, or $3.91 new, in paperback, +
S&H, or $9.35 in Kindle format)

*
AOL Time Warner, General Electric, Viacom, Disney, and Rupert Murdoch's
NewsGroup

**
http://www.hrw.org/reports/2005/usa0105/1.htm
--
- Billy
“When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist.�
-Archbishop Helder Camara
http://peace.mennolink.org/articles/...acegroups.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth...130964689.html

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world. The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment. For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

Mega corps like the global banks will say "if you do not comply, your
nation will suffer economically. Restrict oil and your nation goes into a
major recession. Lower interest rates and so bankers get richer or the
wheat farmers will not get loans and starve your nation. Globalization and
modern technology made this black mail possible by major corporations. Want
electric power for those on the grid... Do as I say! My understanding even
the CEOs of these mega corporations have nice deep bunkers to hold out from
anything but the military. I believe Walmart's family bunker is worth
hundreds of millions of dollars and well armed.

Only a world government can reign in these mega corps. Why do think no one
at BP oil ever when to prison for their negligence. Mega corps have the
world by the balls! Mega corporations probably can ruin any nation on this
earth. The only way for change in my opinion is a global economic collapse
and try and form a new world government that can reign in these mega
corporations. No where to hide!

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world. The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment. For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

Mega corps like the global banks will say "if you do not comply, your
nation will suffer economically. Restrict oil and your nation goes into a
major recession. Lower interest rates and so bankers get richer or the
wheat farmers will not get loans and starve your nation. Globalization and
modern technology made this black mail possible by major corporations. Want
electric power for those on the grid... Do as I say! My understanding even
the CEOs of these mega corporations have nice deep bunkers to hold out from
anything but the military. I believe Walmart's family bunker is worth
hundreds of millions of dollars and well armed.

Only a world government can reign in these mega corps. Why do think no one
at BP oil ever when to prison for their negligence. Mega corps have the
world by the balls! Mega corporations probably can ruin any nation on this
earth. The only way for change in my opinion is a global economic collapse
and try and form a new world government that can reign in these mega
corporations. No where to hide!

http://seattlest.com/2009/05/28/gary_snyder_has_had_it_with_you_pun.php

I believe in world states based on tribal groups. Somewhere in the the
past I saw a world map that would include the Basque's and wondering a
free S. Jersey yes.. Decentralization please like small is beautiful.

Meanwhile the Arabs seem to starting to to understand that British
conquest does not make a state. Dam imperialist good for nothing.

--
Bill S. Jersey USA zone 5 shade garden

In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.
Economic times got better for the top 10%.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/28/business/28wages.html

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world.
Great, now we can fly lamb from New Zealand to England with all its
attendant effects on the environment.
The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment.
Screw "free trade", bring on "fair trade". The Glass-Steagall Act was
repealled in, (what 1998?) and the blood suckers made their move. It
took 10 years to sell all the toxic derivative.

For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

I think you are making my case for me.


Mega corps like the global banks will say "if you do not comply, your
nation will suffer economically. Restrict oil and your nation goes into a
major recession. Lower interest rates and so bankers get richer or the
wheat farmers will not get loans and starve your nation. Globalization and
modern technology made this black mail possible by major corporations. Want
electric power for those on the grid... Do as I say! My understanding even
the CEOs of these mega corporations have nice deep bunkers to hold out from
anything but the military. I believe Walmart's family bunker is worth
hundreds of millions of dollars and well armed.

Only a world government can reign in these mega corps. Why do think no one
at BP oil ever when to prison for their negligence. Mega corps have the
world by the balls! Mega corporations probably can ruin any nation on this
earth. The only way for change in my opinion is a global economic collapse
and try and form a new world government that can reign in these mega
corporations. No where to hide!

It is instructive to see the crowds in Cairo. The well armed police, and
paramilitary were surrounded by unarmed people, and shoved back.

Viva, Freedom
--
- Billy
“When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist.�
-Archbishop Helder Camara
http://peace.mennolink.org/articles/...acegroups.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth...130964689.html

Billy wrote:
In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.
Economic times got better for the top 10%.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/28/business/28wages.html

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world.
Great, now we can fly lamb from New Zealand to England with all its
attendant effects on the environment.
The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment.
Screw "free trade", bring on "fair trade". The Glass-Steagall Act was
repealled in, (what 1998?) and the blood suckers made their move. It
took 10 years to sell all the toxic derivative.

For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

I think you are making my case for me.


Mega corps like the global banks will say "if you do not comply, your
nation will suffer economically. Restrict oil and your nation goes into a
major recession. Lower interest rates and so bankers get richer or the
wheat farmers will not get loans and starve your nation. Globalization and
modern technology made this black mail possible by major corporations. Want
electric power for those on the grid... Do as I say! My understanding even
the CEOs of these mega corporations have nice deep bunkers to hold out from
anything but the military. I believe Walmart's family bunker is worth
hundreds of millions of dollars and well armed.

Only a world government can reign in these mega corps. Why do think no one
at BP oil ever when to prison for their negligence. Mega corps have the
world by the balls! Mega corporations probably can ruin any nation on this
earth. The only way for change in my opinion is a global economic collapse
and try and form a new world government that can reign in these mega
corporations. No where to hide!

It is instructive to see the crowds in Cairo. The well armed police, and
paramilitary were surrounded by unarmed people, and shoved back.

Viva, Freedom

The weapon systems used against the crowds were "Made in the USA" from the
tanks to gas cans for crowd control. Remember the revolts failed in Iran
and others middle east countries. It will be interesting how this one turns
out.

I think, I can say, we both do not like the world as it is. I want the
international corporations brought down. I am for equal distribution of
wealth. I just think looking to the past for answers will not work in the
future climate of things. Corporations have learned to by pass many
existing laws. Also there are just too many people for everyone to live
like the Amish.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world. The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment. For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

Apparently, not everyone agrees with you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/28/opinion/28krugman.html?_r=1

January 27, 2011

Their Own Private Europe
By PAUL KRUGMAN

"The lesson of the Irish debacle, then, is very nearly the opposite of
what Mr. Ryan would have us believe. It doesn’t say “cut spending now,
or bad things will happen�; it says that balanced budgets won’t protect
you from crisis if you don’t effectively regulate your banks — a point
made in the newly released report of the Financial Crisis Inquiry
Commission, which concludes that “30 years of deregulation and reliance
on self-regulation� helped create our own catastrophe. Have I mentioned
that Republicans are doing everything they can to undermine financial
reform?"
-----
Rain today, garden tomorrow :O)
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyE5wjc4XOw

In article ,
Bill who putters wrote:

http://seattlest.com/2009/05/28/gary...th_you_pun.php

Ah, it takes me back. I arrived in the Bay Area early 60's when Snyder,
and Ginsberg would hold forth at Ferlinghetti's bookstore, "City of
Lights" in North Beach.

How's the sledding coming along?
--
- Billy
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the
merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_vN0--mHug
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyE5wjc4XOw

Billy wrote:
In article ,
Nad R wrote:

Times are different than the thirties. Banks in the seventies were
struggling with high inflation and high interest rates handcuffed by many
parts of Glass-Steagall. President Reagan removed many parts of that Act.
President Bill Clinton just finished it off. Economic times did get
better, but they also have consequences, like going into a great
depression.

Jumbo jets, gigantic transport ships the Internet and other modern
technologies have changed the world. The Glass-Steagall Act will not work
in a free trade global environment. For the Glass Steagall Act to work some
what, one first has to ban free trade.. If any nation can. In this global
corporations will just set up somewhere and black mail any nation they
choose from abroad.

Apparently, not everyone agrees with you.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/28/opinion/28krugman.html?_r=1

January 27, 2011

Their Own Private Europe
By PAUL KRUGMAN

"The lesson of the Irish debacle, then, is very nearly the opposite of
what Mr. Ryan would have us believe. It doesn’t say “cut spending now,
or bad things will happen�; it says that balanced budgets won’t protect
you from crisis if you don’t effectively regulate your banks � a point
made in the newly released report of the Financial Crisis Inquiry
Commission, which concludes that “30 years of deregulation and reliance
on self-regulation� helped create our own catastrophe. Have I mentioned
that Republicans are doing everything they can to undermine financial
reform?"
-----
Rain today, garden tomorrow :O)

I know that most will disagree with me. I do agree that the banks went
wild. So are you saying that the US is responsible for Europe's financial
collapse because Glass-Steagall also controls the worlds banks. Does not
Europe have their own banking laws? I can see removing Glass-Steagall can
wreck the U.S. Banks, but Europe's banks as well? So Europe's banks are
controlled by our laws? I find this hard to believe.

I see the real-estate collapse more due to free trade, people loose their
jobs to slave labor nations like China, then they cannot make their house
payment, then property values drop, then banks assets go down, then banks
fail.

So Europe does not have their own banking laws, they use the U.S. Laws?

It is not U.S. Banking laws, it is evolution of the worlds economics
systems. What was true then is not true today. I will use physics as a
metaphor, Galileo stated "Mass is independent of Gravity", Newton proved
this wrong with his Laws of Gravity. Newton stated "Time was independent of
everything". Einstein proved that statement was wrong with his theories of
Relativity ( more fact than theory ). And between each time period for
hundreds of years, people believed they were correct until proven wrong.

Economics is more art, than science, Economics is more trial and error that
has evolved over the years and still evolving.

--
Enjoy Life... Nad R (Garden in zone 5a Michigan)

In article ,
Nad R wrote:


I know that most will disagree with me. I do agree that the banks went
wild. So are you saying that the US is responsible for Europe's financial
collapse because Glass-Steagall also controls the worlds banks. Does not
Europe have their own banking laws? I can see removing Glass-Steagall can
wreck the U.S. Banks, but Europe's banks as well? So Europe's banks are
controlled by our laws? I find this hard to believe.

Some of them bought the same high performing, toxic derivatives that our
banks did. But whether you're talking Ireland, or Spain, or Greece, the
story is the same. They got the money, and we got the bill.
--
- Billy
"When you give food to the poor, they call you a saint. When you ask why the poor have no food, they call you a communist."
-Archbishop Helder Camara
http://peace.mennolink.org/articles/...acegroups.html
http://english.aljazeera.net/indepth...130964689.html