Hi,
I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it. They
did great. Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air. In
addition, since I put in the goldfish, there has been airbubbles
floating on the surface. I have caught the fish "burping" up these
bubbles. Not alot of bubbles, but bubbles that weren't there before I
added the fish. I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Also, does anyone possibly have insight to the
reasoning behind my observations.

Thanks alot!!

Dan

The fish could be feeding on insect lavra or they could be starved for oxygen.
Two entirely different situations. How many gallons do you think the pond is
and how many fish do you have in?

If oxygen is the problem - can you put in a fountain? There are ones that run
from a solar panel if electricity is a problem. (Go to froogle.com to find
them.) There are air pumps that add more oxygen to the water.

Do you know if the city adds chloramines, you can call and ask. They don't gas
out like chlorine does. A treatment is needed.

Ponds with an assortment of plants and very few fish don't have to be filtered.
But garden ponds are rarely understocked. You can test for ammonia and see if
the plants are keeping up with the fish waste.

Anyway with more information we can track down what's going on.

kathy :-)
zone 7, SE WA state

On 7 Oct 2004 22:04:00 -0700, (Dan) wrote:

Hi,
I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it. They
did great. Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air. In
addition, since I put in the goldfish, there has been airbubbles
floating on the surface. I have caught the fish "burping" up these
bubbles. Not alot of bubbles, but bubbles that weren't there before I
added the fish. I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Also, does anyone possibly have insight to the
reasoning behind my observations.

Thanks alot!!

Dan

It sounds like the water is stagnant. Add a fountain, aerator, or
filter with pump. If you don't want to add any of these options, at
least keep the fish population to a few small fish, stir the water by
hand to break the surface-growing bacteria, and be extra careful about
anything decaying in the water including unconsumed fish food. At
this point it will be good to hold back feeding for a few days until
the condition clears up.

If your water supply has chloramine instead of chlorine, their gills
might be burned, which means they would be suffocating.

Buy a bottle of dechlorinator (be sure it specifies chloramine) and
treat.

You may have another problem, but this is the first thing that came to
my mind.

HTH
Mike

On 7 Oct 2004 22:04:00 -0700, (Dan) wrote:

Hi,
I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it. They
did great. Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air. In
addition, since I put in the goldfish, there has been airbubbles
floating on the surface. I have caught the fish "burping" up these
bubbles. Not alot of bubbles, but bubbles that weren't there before I
added the fish. I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Also, does anyone possibly have insight to the
reasoning behind my observations.

Thanks alot!!

Dan

Mike Patterson
Please remove the spamtrap to email me.
"I always wanted to be somebody...I should have been more specific..." - Lily Tomlin

"Dan" wrote:

Hi,
I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it. They
did great. Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air. In
addition, since I put in the goldfish, there has been airbubbles
floating on the surface. I have caught the fish "burping" up these
bubbles. Not alot of bubbles, but bubbles that weren't there before I
added the fish. I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Also, does anyone possibly have insight to the
reasoning behind my observations.

Thanks alot!!

Dan
Hi Dan,

Always good to see a new ponder in San Diego.

When you added the water did you use dechlorinator? We have chloramines in
our water rather than just chlorine, so a dechlor is a must as far as I'm
concerned. While chlorine will dissipate over a brief time period,
chloramines, for all intents and purposes, does not. The chloramines will
inhibit the fish's ability to absorb oxygen through their gills. If you
haven't done it, go immediately and buy some.

Where in SD are you, maybe I can direct you to a source.


San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Goldfish, a RES named Colombo and an Oscar.



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"Dan" wrote:

Hi,
I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it. They
did great. Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air. In
addition, since I put in the goldfish, there has been airbubbles
floating on the surface. I have caught the fish "burping" up these
bubbles. Not alot of bubbles, but bubbles that weren't there before I
added the fish. I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Also, does anyone possibly have insight to the
reasoning behind my observations.

Thanks alot!!

Dan
Hi Dan,

Always good to see a new ponder in San Diego.

When you added the water did you use dechlorinator? We have chloramines in
our water rather than just chlorine, so a dechlor is a must as far as I'm
concerned. While chlorine will dissipate over a brief time period,
chloramines, for all intents and purposes, does not. The chloramines will
inhibit the fish's ability to absorb oxygen through their gills. If you
haven't done it, go immediately and buy some.

Where in SD are you, maybe I can direct you to a source.


San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Goldfish, a RES named Colombo and an Oscar.



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I have recently moved into a new place in san diego with an empty fish
pond (6 x 4). I filled it up and put a few water plants in it.
Three weeks later, I put in some small comet goldfish.
They appear to be doing fine. BUT, I have noticed at times they are
at the surface not moving and what appears to be sucking up air.
I have not done any water treatment nor do I have a
water filter. I am trying to do it natural. Are these normal
observations? Dan

Hi Dan,

For a natural pond, one should only add 2 goldfish for your size pond (they
will make extras) as there is not enough O2 & bacteria in a new pond to
support more. Do not feed. There will be enough in there for them, and you
don't want them growing fast or making too many fry that survive. The pond
will seek it's own balance, therefore if you put in too many, it will kill
them down to what it can support.

After 3 weeks I would think chloramines wouldn't be a problem. The chlorine
would be gone and the ammonia converted by bacteria and/or used by the
plants. ~ jan


See my ponds and filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Wet!~
Tri-Cities WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote:

After 3 weeks I would think chloramines wouldn't be a problem. The chlorine
would be gone and the ammonia converted by bacteria and/or used by the
plants. ~ jan

Hi Jan,

Do you have info on that? It has always been my understanding that
chloramines don't break down into their component parts without the addition
of a chemical that breaks the bond between chlorine and ammonia.


San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Goldfish, a RES named Colombo and an Oscar.



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I found out the there is chloramine in my water. Also, I do have
insect larva floating around, so maybe they are eating them. In this
6 x 4 pond (un sure about the gallons), i have four small comet gold
fish, and they seem relatively happy.
thanks for the info. i will try chloramine treatment.

dan




EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote in message ...
The fish could be feeding on insect lavra or they could be starved for oxygen.
Two entirely different situations. How many gallons do you think the pond is
and how many fish do you have in?

If oxygen is the problem - can you put in a fountain? There are ones that run
from a solar panel if electricity is a problem. (Go to froogle.com to find
them.) There are air pumps that add more oxygen to the water.

Do you know if the city adds chloramines, you can call and ask. They don't gas
out like chlorine does. A treatment is needed.

Ponds with an assortment of plants and very few fish don't have to be filtered.
But garden ponds are rarely understocked. You can test for ammonia and see if
the plants are keeping up with the fish waste.

Anyway with more information we can track down what's going on.

kathy :-)
zone 7, SE WA state

After 3 weeks I would think chloramines wouldn't be a problem. The chlorine
would be gone and the ammonia converted by bacteria and/or used by the
plants. ~ jan

Hi Jan,

Do you have info on that? It has always been my understanding that
chloramines don't break down into their component parts without the addition
of a chemical that breaks the bond between chlorine and ammonia.
San Diego Joe

My understanding, from stuff posted here and thru my KHA classes, claims
have been made that the bond will break when introduced to contaminates in
a pond. The chlorine part will spend itself out on them, leaving the
ammonia that will be taken care of by a filter, or as mentioned above,
bacteria & plants. They only bind the two so that in clean water the
chlorine sticks around longer to react to contaminants without gassing off
so soon. ~ jan
~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

I found out the there is chloramine in my water. Also, I do have
insect larva floating around, so maybe they are eating them. In this
6 x 4 pond (un sure about the gallons), i have four small comet gold
fish, and they seem relatively happy.
thanks for the info. i will try chloramine treatment.

dan

You found out by testing it, or someone told you? You can always take a
water sample in to most LFS and they will test your water, ammonia,
nitrites, pH & KH are important numbers to know. ~ jan


~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~

"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote:

I found out the there is chloramine in my water. Also, I do have
insect larva floating around, so maybe they are eating them. In this
6 x 4 pond (un sure about the gallons), i have four small comet gold
fish, and they seem relatively happy.
thanks for the info. i will try chloramine treatment.

dan

You found out by testing it, or someone told you? You can always take a
water sample in to most LFS and they will test your water, ammonia,
nitrites, pH & KH are important numbers to know. ~ jan


~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~
I called the water department here in San Diego and they told me we use
chloramine.

San Diego Joe
4,000 - 5,000 Gallons.
Goldfish, a RES named Colombo and an Oscar.



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I found out the there is chloramine in my water.
dan

You found out by testing it, or someone told you? You can always take a
water sample in to most LFS and they will test your water, ammonia,
nitrites, pH & KH are important numbers to know. ~ jan

I called the water department here in San Diego and they told me we use
chloramine.
San Diego Joe

I saw that, but since he didn't respond directly, I wasn't sure if he had
seen your post. One thing about it, adding the chemicals now, will detox
any ammonia, whether from the water or fish, still in there. )

Dan, you might want to read up on the "nitrogen cycle". This website has a
short explanation: http://www.vcnet.com/koi_net/dan.html ignore the part
that "bacteria live on gravel". Good bacteria, of which we speak, lives on
everything in the pond, and those of us with filters use lighter medias now
days. Surface area of the media is the key component for maximum bacteria.
Not necessary for size of pond and 4 small goldfish. ~ jan


~Power to the Porg, Flow On!~