Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
Salinity
Hi Folks
As some of you know this is a subject quite dear to me because of the amount of salinity in and around where I live. I've stated before that I don't believe salinity is THE problem but rather A symptom of poor soil structure, and I'm increasingly frustrated when I look for info on how salinity is being managed or addressed. Most if not all the sources I can find on the net are government sponsored surveys which seem intent on telling me how bad salinity is and why it's such a problem and how they will continue to develop models to ascertain the extent of salinity and how to recognise it ...etc etc etc ....... all this is necessary I'm sure for the "experts" to gain an understanding of the so called problem and to help others understand its devastating effects, and I have no doubt that there are many many people receiving government grants to fund these surveys and refine their models and salt mapping diagrams. Almost all of the info is negative and depressing and virtually states that we are doomed to be swallowed up by mountains of salt unless we do something ... the trouble is I can't actually find anyone who IS doing anything other than devising yet another model or salt map for continued monitoring ...of course all at great expense in the form of grant money which ultimately gets passed onto the public in the form of levies and surcharges. My question is this .... does anyone know of any information on the net which shows positive results from methods which can be applied by the everyday person ?. Most of the farming resources I read understandably deal with enabling the farmer to still get a return from salt affected land whilst using techniques to reduce high water tables and salt content, but I think thy never actually address the real issue of soil structure Most of the horticultural areas seem to be on land that is unaffected by salt so there never seems to be a push within the smaller acreage groups or their growers cooperatives to address the issue ...its left to the larger properties and their organisations SAFF, NFF etc because (I presume) the effects are more noticeable and have the most damage potential to our primary production. I don't want to learn how to grow salt tolerant species I already know what plants will grow in some of the worst effected areas... I want to create soil that will grow anything that my climate, as dry as it is, will allow me to grow ... I'm talking about practical people doing practical, positive things which have yielded results however small a particular favourite of mine is the "Greening the desert" by Geoff Lawton http://www.abc.net.au/northcoast/stories/s727970.htm# There are both flash presentations and real media version links. This is the sort of info I'm looking for, I'm already getting some varied success from trying different things ...as some of you know from my postings here .... but I'm always looking for others sources of info .... no more reports, studies or models from well intentioned government sponsored surveys ... I feel like I've read all of em. I wonder if anyone would be interested if I put together a simple web page wiv piccies of my modest efforts in the hopes of helping others ? stay well, stay happy folks Pete |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
g'day pete,
dunno if you will ever find a difinitive answer as the agancies tend to hedge around the real cause in a cause and effect situation. the best and only way i know of that nature had employed to keep the salt table down was trees particularly the gum trees, so naturally any rehabilitation that way is going to take a very long time to even begin to work. at the very least probably somewhere up near 70 years. that's just how i see it these are the damages caused by long term european style agriculture on the fragile soils and systems of australia. styles that are still being emplyed although i hear farmer types saying that the tree are need they still folloow the same clear fell folly. i will help with the web page as best i can i'm sure we can help you get something online. glad to see you still about pete, remember when you use te return addy delete SPAM before sending, glad to help where i can hey and i'm no tree hugger if they weren't needed then why did nature grow them? len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
Hi Len thanks for the reply.
I think its well understood that deep rooted vegetation helps to lower the water table which helps to reduce salinity within the immediate area. I agree that past farming practices were/are not particularly suited to the oz situation, but I don't buy into the argument that farmers are to blame for the rising salt levels, some folks would have us believe that farmers are hell bent on destroying the environment just to make a buck, I say thats total BS, when us white folks landed here we used what we knew, the tools and practices to grow food were what we brought with us from our respective countries. The early settlers had no way of knowing that the practices their families had used for thousands of years would create any probs in this new environment. Dry land salinity was around then .... its not something that was created by farmers as a result of bad practice, it may have been worsened in areas which were sensitive and damaged by the early farming techniques ...clear felling etc, but it's not the cause, if the soil structure had been favourable to those farming practices we would be hailing the farmers as environmental saviors ... remember they didnt have soil tests, PH kits, salinity measuring or modeling tools, access to seed other than what they or their peers brought with them or access to specialised tools for minimum till, direct drilling ...there was no permapine fence posts sold at the rural supplies ... all fence posts had to be cut from the land, the house had to be built from timber from the land .... even the roof shingles, thats no different than a permaculturist clearing a patch of ground to use the timber to build a chookhouse so that it creates a space for veggie growing nearby.... the old "use the resources available" technique was the only technique they had. The plows available were the moldboard type used for many many years very effectively and pulled by horse or bullock of course on beautiful friable soil the compaction was minimal, but used on the type of sodic clays that are around many parts of Oz results in compaction and damage that takes some serious restoration work .... but what else could they use? ..... nothing, they used what they had and knew and they should be applauded for the sheer determination and true grit they showed, instead they are blamed for just about any problem we have. Sure many many mistakes were made ...still are today ...even with our highly paid consultants and computer modeling, our GPS systems and special computer designed planning procedures and land management techniques, we have world experts on water use, feed stocks, feed rates, salinity, native tree experts, fungi experts, scientists doing research into how much fat a sheep/cow/pig etc should have, we have nutritionists working out the optimum feed to meat conversion, agronomists working out the optimum fertiliser application rates ...and the list goes on and on and on ......... and we STILL make mistakes .... imagine the farmer disembarking onto Aussie soil in the 1800's with Wife and kids, a cow, a horse or ox and a plough, enough woodworking tools to cut and shape wood to make a house and enough seed and knowledge to grow food till the next harvest ..... nope I don't ... can't put the blame for mistakes on those folks they did what they had to do to survive ... as it turned out those early practices were bad for the aussie soils and climate. Enter the era of "modern" farming, huge companies producing fertilisers, herbicides, insecticides, the pre cleared land offering potential for 1000 acre paddocks and enormous potential for farming on a truly grand scale ... the banks are throwing money at farmers to encourage them to get bigger so that they can produce more and borrow more money to buy bigger tractors, bigger and better ploughs, slashers, seeders ... the fertiliser companies finding huge phosphate resources, telling farmers your problems are solved ...spray this, spread that apply this and it will increase your profits 10 fold...you can make oodles of cash ..the banks like this idea and encourage more borrowing.... Then when things don't work out the scapegoat is the farmer .... Buy a copy of "The stock journal" ... and tell me the type of adverts that appear in there are not designed to lead ANY farmer ...ANY person reading them ....to believe that every product on sale will " boost production, increase yield, reduce invasive weeds, reduce fly strike, eliminate soil erosion, contain stock better than ever before" .... and on and on. Don't blame the farmers .... they are as caught up in the system as we as average consumers are caught up in the throw away, mass production, built in obsolesance society that has emerged because we all believed that "things made from plastic/Teflon/pvc etc was going to be cheaper than wood/metal ..that computers would make things simpler and reduce costs thereby reducing prices" .... and all the other hype that the advertisers would have us believe. To ask a farmer to completely abandon a practice that produces enough return to keep his/her head above water every year and try techniques that we as permaculturists, organic gardeners or just plain "interested parties" think are great, is like telling someone who works in any other field (pardon the pun) that their lifes work is totally wrong and everything they are doing is ruining the country ...and WE have the answer .... if we do that are we not as bad as the advertisers telling the farmers that they are using the wrong spray if they are not using OUR spray ? Some of the land that is now mapped as the worst affected dryland salinity areas have never, ever had any farming on them ... so how do people presume that bad land management is to blame for the salt in those areas? There have always been inland lakes in Oz ... lakes that are saline, and some much more saline than sea water the soils around those areas are salty, the evaporation rates far in excess of the rainfall and the soil structure usually ranging from silt to fine clay particles with no organic content in them... and thats why I think that the answer to the salt symptom is to create soil ...real soil which has water holding capacity, organic content, available nutrients that the plants can access and a structure that will withstand the harsh conditions and erosive effects of the blistering sun and driving winds, only then will we be able to grow the deep rooted veg needed to reduce the salt content. But what do I know? nothing basically ... whats working for me could be absolutely the wrong thing for the aussie environment ...just as those early farmers found things which worked for them, which 200 years later have been found to be the wrong things to do ..... All I know is I'm growing a bit of veg in very salty ground, nothing really earth shattering is taking place, I'm adding organic content, ensuring the areas get as much rainfall as they can by using any contours and trying to use excess vegetation as mulch and to return nutrients to those areas. Now ...see ya made me rant on ... I wasn't gonna rant for once and Now I have .....again ...sorry...again End of rant Pete len gardener wrote: g'day pete, dunno if you will ever find a difinitive answer as the agancies tend to hedge around the real cause in a cause and effect situation. the best and only way i know of that nature had employed to keep the salt table down was trees particularly the gum trees, so naturally any rehabilitation that way is going to take a very long time to even begin to work. at the very least probably somewhere up near 70 years. that's just how i see it these are the damages caused by long term european style agriculture on the fragile soils and systems of australia. styles that are still being emplyed although i hear farmer types saying that the tree are need they still folloow the same clear fell folly. i will help with the web page as best i can i'm sure we can help you get something online. glad to see you still about pete, remember when you use te return addy delete SPAM before sending, glad to help where i can hey and i'm no tree hugger if they weren't needed then why did nature grow them? len snipped |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
"pete" wrote in message
Hi Folks Hi Pete. Nice to see you again. I've stated before that I don't believe salinity is THE problem but rather A symptom of poor soil structure, and I'm increasingly frustrated when I look for info on how salinity is being managed or addressed. Pete I've mentioned these farms here befo http://www.abc.net.au/landline/stories/s100812.htm I know that one of the major problems at least one of these farms had was salinity. somewhere I have a book on what was on those farms but I can't lay my hands on it at the moment. It is fascinating reading and I can strongly recommend it. Most if not all the sources I can find on the net are government sponsored surveys which seem intent on telling me how bad salinity is and why it's such a problem and how they will continue to develop models to ascertain the extent of salinity and how to recognise it ...etc etc etc ....... all this is necessary I'm sure for the "experts" to gain an understanding of the so called problem and to help others understand its devastating effects, and I have no doubt that there are many many people receiving government grants to fund these surveys and refine their models and salt mapping diagrams. Almost all of the info is negative and depressing and virtually states that we are doomed to be swallowed up by mountains of salt unless we do something ... the trouble is I can't actually find anyone who IS doing anything other than devising yet another model or salt map for continued monitoring ...of course all at great expense in the form of grant money which ultimately gets passed onto the public in the form of levies and surcharges. My question is this .... does anyone know of any information on the net which shows positive results from methods which can be applied by the everyday person ?. Most of the farming resources I read understandably deal with enabling the farmer to still get a return from salt affected land whilst using techniques to reduce high water tables and salt content, but I think thy never actually address the real issue of soil structure I'm not sure what you mean by "soil structure". I do know that a lot of the salinity info I've seen relating to farm salinity is about increasing humus content (wiht the recognition that this is very difficult but that increasing soil biota is very possible and also very successful) and increasing soil coverage (by vegetation muclching etc and very strong protection against any degradtion of the souil by both animal activity and human activity. This is the sort of info I'm looking for, I'm already getting some varied success from trying different things ...as some of you know from my postings here .... but I'm always looking for others sources of info ... no more reports, studies or models from well intentioned government sponsored surveys ... I feel like I've read all of em. Do you remember me posting this site befo http://www.rosneath.com.au/ipc6/ch02/withers/index.html I think it fits your criteria of soil creation and effective coping with appalling non productive soil very well and is very inspiring. You may not agree :-)) I wonder if anyone would be interested if I put together a simple web page wiv piccies of my modest efforts in the hopes of helping others ? I'd be very interested. Fran |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
Len I promised that I'd sendyou some wattle seeds when they were ripe in
Autumn. Sorry mate, the cockies beat me to the seeds and I can't even find anything but empty seed cases on the ground. Fran |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
Farm1 wrote: Pete I've mentioned these farms here befo http://www.abc.net.au/landline/stories/s100812.htm I know that one of the major problems at least one of these farms had was salinity. somewhere I have a book on what was on those farms but I can't lay my hands on it at the moment. It is fascinating reading and I can strongly recommend it. Hiya Fran I remember the last link but couldnt remember the first one so thanks for them I'll save em as faves and have a good read. I have to admit the farming organisations seem to be doing lots of stuff to try new things and the farmers themselves seem much more open to trying new things these days too, at one time not so long ago farmers wouldn't have even admitted to having a salt prob because it was seen as a failure to manage the property properly, I think ...I hope those attitudes are changing and farmers now seem to openly discuss it and look for ways of dealing with it. I'm not sure what you mean by "soil structure". I do know that a lot of the salinity info I've seen relating to farm salinity is about increasing humus content (wiht the recognition that this is very difficult but that increasing soil biota is very possible and also very successful) and increasing soil coverage (by vegetation muclching etc and very strong protection against any degradtion of the souil by both animal activity and human activity. OK Tomorrow I'm definitely taking some soil pics, before and after pics of what simple hoss poop can do to a poor excuse for a soil.... you'll see what I mean by soil structure then my girl I'll give you soil structure (oops ..slipped into grumpy old fart mode then) ......actually of course its just my interpretation of what a good soil structure should be but if I manage to take good pics I'm sure you'll agree that the structure is more like soil and less like dried pea soup waiting for moisture, plus it has "things" growing in it. This is basically what I've been saying all along ...look after the soil and the rest will follow ...I know on a broad acre place this is a nightmare task of mammoth proportions ya can't just cart manure to a spot when you see a need because of other needs, crops, grazing etc, I'm only working on this new section which is tiny compared to a paddock but its taking some work to even get a few rows to mature into what I call real soil so I take my hat off to anyone tackling many hectares, my only problem with their well intentioned and sometimes spectacular results is that most of the time I can't directly relate to the procedures they are using, reading an old -ish Stock Journal a farmer is applying 2T/HA of Gypsum onto very clayey and saline paddocks which increases his DSE from 1 DSE/8HA to 4DSE/HA !!!! now thats a huge difference and it's improving the moisture retention of the clay soils by enabling the particles to form colloidal (help spell checker) mass ..... rather than minute particles that form a dense clod. Do you remember me posting this site befo http://www.rosneath.com.au/ipc6/ch02/withers/index.html I think it fits your criteria of soil creation and effective coping with appalling non productive soil very well and is very inspiring. You may not agree :-)) I always agree with you ...you know that, remember I had the worms? ,,, they are still around in a much broader area and possibly less dense population ....the original vermicompost has been used for different projects with varying degrees of success ...it dries out to almost the same unwettable stuff that we've talked about before if it's left too long without moisture, I lost my raspberry bush which was at one stage going rampant in the old worm beds because I became complacent and thought the moisture was actually getting deep into the "soil" ... it wasnt, one thing we have found the ex vermicompost good for is growing native trees in, which would seem to confirm that there is little high nutrient value left in it but when watered carefully it holds water while still being free draining. I wonder if anyone would be interested if I put together a simple web page wiv piccies of my modest efforts in the hopes of helping others ? I'd be very interested. Fran Then thats 2 of ya's ...and it shall be done ...just don't expect earth shattering discoveries.... just a simple guy playing in the dirt. Pete |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
pete wrote:
I can't directly relate to the procedures they are using, reading an old -ish Stock Journal a farmer is applying 2T/HA of Gypsum onto very clayey and saline paddocks which increases his DSE from 1 DSE/8HA to 4DSE/HA !!!! now thats a huge difference and it's improving the moisture retention of the clay soils by enabling the particles to form colloidal (help spell checker) mass .... rather than minute particles that form a dense clod. oops I meant to add here ... that I havent got the means to buy, spread and dig in those sorts of amounts of gypsum even though I KNOW it would help greatly .. so while I know Gyspum is great for clay soils and I'm impressed with this farmers results ... I'm more interested in creating a living soil structure by more modest means, (read cheap here). Pete |
#8
|
|||
|
|||
that's ok fran,
we are on the narket yet again this time for real things if nothing else constantly change hey. len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
For anyone interested.
The national dryland salinity program has a free CD and a coupla manuals available at http://www.ndsp.gov.au/about.asp?section=105 Pete |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
"pete" wrote lots of interesting things in his
message Then thats 2 of ya's ...and it shall be done ...just don't expect earth shattering discoveries.... just a simple guy playing in the dirt. In extrme haste - have read and roughly digested what you wrote, but have to get of this machine and get ready for work - will write more tomorrow (I hope - if not then, then shortly thereafter). Fran |
#11
|
|||
|
|||
In article ,
pete wrote: Almost all of the info is negative and depressing and virtually states that we are doomed to be swallowed up by mountains of salt unless we do something ... the trouble is I can't actually find anyone who IS doing anything other than devising yet another model or salt map for continued monitoring ...of course all at great expense in the form of grant money which ultimately gets passed onto the public in the form of levies and surcharges. My question is this .... does anyone know of any information on the net which shows positive results from methods which can be applied by the everyday person ?. I posted about this last year: Chookie Nov 1 2004, 9:33 pm Newsgroups: alt.permaculture From: Chookie - Find messages by this author Date: Mon, 01 Nov 2004 21:33:39 +1100 Local: Mon,Nov 1 2004 9:33 pm Subject: Permie Practices Take Over WA We did a bit of travelling in the Wertern Australian wheat belt a few weeks ago (did a circuit from York to Corrigin to Wickepin to Narrogin, then across to Mandurah and Perth) and were interested to see permie things taking root, so to speak, on broadacre farms. There is a new (and plainly recent) fad for swales, belts of natives, and I even saw something that looked suspiciously like alley cropping -- single rows of trees with wheat belts one harvester wide planted between them. It's very odd to come upon all this hippie stuff in Ironbar Tuckey country! The reason, we discovered, was salination. The wheat belt was originally forest, and clearing and planting to wheat has raised the water table to such an extent that low-lying patches are visibly swampy and infertile (they are evil-looking brown areas, like something out of the Lord of the Rings). The remedial work, familiar to anyone who's read any permie stuff, is working, and is working quickly, too. The problem isn't gone yet, but there has been a noticeable improvement, and the locals are hopeful that they can produce grain sustainably over the long term. Thought you'd all like to know. WA is viewed by most Easterners as populated almost entirely by racists and conmen who believe anything that moves should be hunted down and anything that doesn't should be chopped down or dug up. Plainly, it is not! -- Chookie -- Sydney, Australia (Replace "foulspambegone" with "optushome" to reply) "In Melbourne there is plenty of vigour and eagerness, but there is nothing worth being eager or vigorous about." Francis Adams, The Australians, 1893. |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Farm1 wrote:
"pete" wrote lots of interesting things in his message Then thats 2 of ya's ...and it shall be done ...just don't expect earth shattering discoveries.... just a simple guy playing in the dirt. In extrme haste - have read and roughly digested what you wrote, but have to get of this machine and get ready for work - will write more tomorrow (I hope - if not then, then shortly thereafter). Fran Stop rushing around ... Have a look at this quick, rushed ...oops I mean simple but carefully crafted web page that I've thrown ... I mean lovingly put together just for you and Len cos ya said ya wuz interested .... it's not much and I'll try to make it a bit more user freindly and hopefully informative as time goes on .... anyways here tis http://whatsallthisthen.100free.com/ yes of course its on a free server waddya expect from me? Pete |
#13
|
|||
|
|||
Chookie wrote:
In article , pete wrote: Almost all of the info is negative and depressing and virtually states that we are doomed to be swallowed up by mountains of salt unless we do something ... the trouble is I can't actually find anyone who IS doing anything other than devising yet another model or salt map for continued monitoring ...of course all at great expense in the form of grant money which ultimately gets passed onto the public in the form of levies and surcharges. My question is this .... does anyone know of any information on the net which shows positive results from methods which can be applied by the everyday person ?. I posted about this last year: Chookie Nov 1 2004, 9:33 pm Newsgroups: alt.permaculture From: Chookie - Find messages by this author Date: Mon, 01 Nov 2004 21:33:39 +1100 Local: Mon,Nov 1 2004 9:33 pm Subject: Permie Practices Take Over WA We did a bit of travelling in the Wertern Australian wheat belt a few weeks ago (did a circuit from York to Corrigin to Wickepin to Narrogin, then across to Mandurah and Perth) and were interested to see permie things taking root, so to speak, on broadacre farms. There is a new (and plainly recent) fad for swales, belts of natives, and I even saw something that looked suspiciously like alley cropping -- single rows of trees with wheat belts one harvester wide planted between them. It's very odd to come upon all this hippie stuff in Ironbar Tuckey country! The reason, we discovered, was salination. The wheat belt was originally forest, and clearing and planting to wheat has raised the water table to such an extent that low-lying patches are visibly swampy and infertile (they are evil-looking brown areas, like something out of the Lord of the Rings). The remedial work, familiar to anyone who's read any permie stuff, is working, and is working quickly, too. The problem isn't gone yet, but there has been a noticeable improvement, and the locals are hopeful that they can produce grain sustainably over the long term. Thought you'd all like to know. WA is viewed by most Easterners as populated almost entirely by racists and conmen who believe anything that moves should be hunted down and anything that doesn't should be chopped down or dug up. Plainly, it is not! Fanks Chookie ...I stand somewhat corrected, as I said before though I see many initiatives taken up by farmers and larger properties and they seem to be working well, trouble is things like alley cropping although great in the right situation don't really have much in common with me growing a few veg for home use. I love the swales idea and thats one that I can use, at the moment I'm pretty intent on getting some actual soil that will support life cos it's great having a swale and planting on the up or downside of it but that soil has to be able to grow something .... so thats where I'm at ....making some real soil so that when I do dig down I don't just fall into a quicksand pit. Thanks for that info it really is great to see farmers doing all this stuff. Pete |
#14
|
|||
|
|||
Janet Baraclough wrote:
The message from pete contains these words: Have a look at this quick, rushed ...oops I mean simple but carefully crafted web page that I've thrown ... I mean lovingly put together just for you and Len cos ya said ya wuz interested .... it's not much and I'll try to make it a bit more user freindly and hopefully informative as time goes on .... anyways here tis http://whatsallthisthen.100free.com/ Thanks Pete, I found that fascinating and the progression of pics really brought it home. Off at a tangent, I was reading that the areas hit by the tsunami 4 months ago were so badly salinated by it, the usual crops won't grow. There are proposals to wash the soil with fresh water ( !!!!!!!!!!plenty of that available there) but meanwhile experiment with more salt-tolerant crops. Although the situation and Indian Ocean climate is so different from your own it might be worth keeping an eye on progress reports there to see if they come up with any answers that could be adapted for your own use. Janet Hiya Janet glad you enjoyed the page, simple as it is,I'm going to keep it going though winter to try to show the difference by this time next year, by the time I get into the REALLY low spot I hope I'll have proved my point about soil structure. I understand the Tsunami efforts ... they are panicking, I would too in that situation of course it's the wrong thing to do for the long term but if the area wasnt saline before the tsunami then they may get away with it. If they can get the salt away and start to revegetate then they may be in with a fighting chance. The area I'm working on now has been flooded twice in the last 10 years and the water has sat for about 2 weeks becoming more and more saline as time goes on. I can't even imagine the size of the task they have in front of em, of course I've seen the pics but wow ... I felt like a little kid who sees the RSPCA adverts and immediately wants to give all her/his pocket money to saving lost puppies, I actually wanted to fly over and help in some way .. not really practical says the wife ... nope, so I send a bit of cash .... geez, I'll keep up with news there, if ever there was a salt project worth watching this would have to be one of em. Pete |
#15
|
|||
|
|||
"pete" wrote in message
I'll try to make it a bit more user freindly and hopefully informative as time goes on .... anyways here tis http://whatsallthisthen.100free.com/ Pete you DO have shitty soil! My sympathies Sunshine. Where exactly is this area you are trying to rehabilitate with the Fergie? By that I want to know if it is in a paddock or close to the house as in where I would expect to find a normal veggie patch? The reaon why I ask is that I wonder whether you perhaps need to get far more protection from the sun in terms of shade and prevention of evaporation. The one thing that the one combine harvester wide section between the trees in WA (that Chookie wrote about) would do is give that sort of protection as well as drininking up saline water at root level. Why I'm even thinking about this angle is that I have found over the last year that the only things I could grow in summer were things that were either in full shade or under shade cloth. That stinking sun and the constant hot winds just killed anything else. I've also been reading Michael Boddy and Richard Beckett's book "Surviving in the Eighties" and he has some good ideas about growing food in foul summer conditions. I think its is the sort of book you'd enjoy and you may be able to get it on interlibrary loan. What have you managed to achieve with the addition of horse poop? |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Salinity? | Ponds | |||
Salinity [Was: Environmental Hypocrisy] | sci.agriculture | |||
salinity testing | Ponds |