On 31/1/07 10:58, in article ,
"Steve Wolstenholme" wrote:

On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:05:22 +0000, Sacha
wrote:

On 30/1/07 12:18, in article ,
"Steve Wolstenholme" wrote:

On Tue, 30 Jan 2007 11:58:53 +0000, Sacha
wrote:

Our lemon tree is covered with fruit and knowing that others have this
plant, I thought I'd post this recipe

I am more interested in how you grow the lemon tree. Mine looks quite
healthy but never flowers.


Steve, another comeback on this one - I mentioned it to Ray this morning
over the toast and he asked if you'd grown it from a pip. I said I had no
idea. Apparently, lemon and orange trees grown from pips are rather like
e.g. Bramley pip seedlings. They can take many, many years to flower and
fruit and then there is no guarantee that what you get will be anything like
the 'parent' plant. If you didn't grow it from a pip, he agrees that it
probably needs feeding.

It was one from my mum. She grew a few from pips. The one she kept
does flower and fruit but it is much smaller than the one she gave to
me. I'm using Growmore but not too often. Maybe I should feed it on
something else. It is quite a few years old but I can't remember
exactly how many.

Ray's comment on trees grown from pips was quite specific as to
unreliability of outcome AND as to how long it might take to flower -
anything from 5 to 50 years was his (possibly slightly exaggerated!) remark!

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/
(remove weeds from address)

On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:18:15 +0000, Sacha
wrote:

Ray's comment on trees grown from pips was quite specific as to
unreliability of outcome AND as to how long it might take to flower -
anything from 5 to 50 years was his (possibly slightly exaggerated!) remark!

I wonder why there is a difference. What else can they grown from
besides pips? Are you using established plants?

I maybe over 100 when mine flowers. It's a good job I'm patient.

Steve

--
Steve Wolstenholme Neural Planner Software Ltd

EasyNN-plus. The easy way to build neural networks.
$39.50 until 1st February. That is half the usual price.
http://www.easynn.com

"Steve Wolstenholme" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:18:15 +0000, Sacha
wrote:

Ray's comment on trees grown from pips was quite specific as to
unreliability of outcome AND as to how long it might take to flower -
anything from 5 to 50 years was his (possibly slightly exaggerated!)
remark!

I wonder why there is a difference. What else can they grown from
besides pips? Are you using established plants?


Many cultivated varieties of fruit trees are genetically unstable.
The cells can divide and grow vegetatively to produce new roots, shoots and
leaves (and fruit) and all of these bits are genetically identical to the
parent plant. However, to make seeds, you need to undergo sexual cell
division and this causes DNA to rearrange and with some highly cultivated
varieties, the progeny are a mish mash of all sorts of combinations of the
parent features.

Fruit trees are usually propagated vegetatively e.g. from cuttings and often
with grafting onto established root stocks.
This way, you get mature plants faster and they are genetically identical to
the parents.

Des


I maybe over 100 when mine flowers. It's a good job I'm patient.

Steve

--
Steve Wolstenholme Neural Planner Software Ltd

EasyNN-plus. The easy way to build neural networks.
$39.50 until 1st February. That is half the usual price.
http://www.easynn.com

On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 12:45:51 -0000
"Des Higgins" wrote:

parent plant. However, to make seeds, you need to undergo sexual cell
division and this causes DNA to rearrange and with some highly cultivated
varieties, the progeny are a mish mash of all sorts of combinations of the
parent features.

Here's a nit to pick, which I only do because I found it interesting personally.

What you say is true unless the plant reproduces apomictically, in which case
the child plant grown from seed is genetically identical to the parent. This is
the case for many Rowans, which is the context in which I found out about
this fascinating mechanism.

No quibble at all with what you said visavis the lemon, of course.

-E
--
Emery Davis
You can reply to ecom
by removing the well known companies
Questions about wine? Visit http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

"Emery Davis" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 12:45:51 -0000
"Des Higgins" wrote:

parent plant. However, to make seeds, you need to undergo sexual cell
division and this causes DNA to rearrange and with some highly cultivated
varieties, the progeny are a mish mash of all sorts of combinations of
the
parent features.

Here's a nit to pick, which I only do because I found it interesting
personally.

What you say is true unless the plant reproduces apomictically, in which
case
the child plant grown from seed is genetically identical to the parent.
This is
the case for many Rowans, which is the context in which I found out about
this fascinating mechanism.

I had no idea that Rowans did it (apomyxis).
I knew Dandelions and Blackberries did.
Weird business; causes endless headaches for taxonomists (or endless
employment).



No quibble at all with what you said visavis the lemon, of course.

-E
--
Emery Davis
You can reply to ecom
by removing the well known companies
Questions about wine? Visit http://winefaq.hostexcellence.com

On 31/1/07 11:46, in article ,
"Steve Wolstenholme" wrote:

On Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:18:15 +0000, Sacha
wrote:

Ray's comment on trees grown from pips was quite specific as to
unreliability of outcome AND as to how long it might take to flower -
anything from 5 to 50 years was his (possibly slightly exaggerated!) remark!

I wonder why there is a difference. What else can they grown from
besides pips? Are you using established plants?

Ray takes cuttings.

I maybe over 100 when mine flowers. It's a good job I'm patient.

You never know - this may be the very year! A few years ago fairly elderly
man admired the 150 year old Atlantic cedar at the bottom of our garden and
asked how long it would take to grow some from the seeds in a cone. I
asked him just how long he was planning to live and luckily, he saw the
funny side! ;-)

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/
(remove weeds from address)

Des Higgins wrote:
[...snip...]

Many cultivated varieties of fruit trees are genetically unstable.
The cells can divide and grow vegetatively to produce new roots, shoots and
leaves (and fruit) and all of these bits are genetically identical to the
parent plant. However, to make seeds, you need to undergo sexual cell
division and this causes DNA to rearrange and with some highly cultivated
varieties, the progeny are a mish mash of all sorts of combinations of the
parent features.

Fruit trees are usually propagated vegetatively e.g. from cuttings and often
with grafting onto established root stocks.
This way, you get mature plants faster and they are genetically identical to
the parents.

Oh, and what would *you* know about genetics and DNA, Higgins ?















P.s. hi !

On Jan 31, 2:23 pm, "R.A.Omond" wrote:
Des Higgins wrote:
[...snip...]

Many cultivated varieties of fruit trees are genetically unstable.
The cells can divide and grow vegetatively to produce new roots, shoots and
leaves (and fruit) and all of these bits are genetically identical to the
parent plant. However, to make seeds, you need to undergo sexual cell
division and this causes DNA to rearrange and with some highly cultivated
varieties, the progeny are a mish mash of all sorts of combinations of the
parent features.

Fruit trees are usually propagated vegetatively e.g. from cuttings and often
with grafting onto established root stocks.
This way, you get mature plants faster and they are genetically identical to
the parents.

Oh, and what would *you* know about genetics and DNA, Higgins ?

P.s. hi !


I will have you know young man that being a father of 17 good
strapping
patriotic surviving childer, I know a lot about genetics and DNA.

Des

"Farm1" wrote after "Bob Hobden" wittered on and "Sacha" wrote ((snip))
Now, Bob, here's a challenge - what will you make from the
fruit of our Citrus medica - they are *enormous*!

Has the rind got a nice strong pleasant citrus scent?
If so the same recipe would work.
Or you can candy it.

Someone on uk.food+drink.misc has told me about candying it
(sigh..)
I'll
go and sniff it tomorrow for the Limoncello idea which sounds
*much* more
attractive!


Stick your nail into the rind and see what it smells like.
You do have to guard against getting the white pith (bitter) in the
bottle
so need to pare off the yellow rind carefully, thinly.
Candying it would work fine but how much does one want, even with a
Tea Shop
there are only so many cakes it can be used in/on. Hot Cross Buns
spring to
mind. :-)

I'm green with envy. My husband always likes to have a Boiled Fruit
Cake sitting on the cake stand ready for his numerous snacks during
the day and candied peel is one of the important ingredients for it.
And the blasted local shop seems to think that country cooks only want
candied peel at Christmas time for some strange reason known only to
themselves!

I think we can get mixed chopped candied fruit all year here in the UK and
there must be somewhere near you that stocks it all year. Even if it's in a
major city some distance away they may post it to you.

Anyway, couldn't you grow such a citrus plant outside where you are in Oz?
The fruit truly are huge and it would make a good talking point, Lemons the
size of Ozzy Rules footballs, imagine it. :-)

--
Regards
Bob H
17mls W. of London.UK

On Jan 31, 1:14 pm, Emery Davis wrote:

Here's a nit to pick, which I only do because I found it interesting personally.

What you say is true unless the plant reproduces apomictically, in which case
the child plant grown from seed is genetically identical to the parent. This is
the case for many Rowans, which is the context in which I found out about
this fascinating mechanism.

.... and in the context of many Citrus, highly relevant. Although
oranges are the most likely to produce apomictic seedlings (in other
words progeny identical to the mother plant), lemons can do the same.
Occasionally a seed will produce several to many seedings, the least
vigorous (or most 'runtish' ) of which will be the result of sexual
reproduction and a combination of the pollen donor and mother plant.
In this case, almost anything and everything can happen. The more
vigorous 'seedlings' will be clones of the mother and eventually
produce fruits that are similar to those from which they arose. How
long that takes though, is another question.

Bob wrote:

Anyway, couldn't you grow such a citrus plant outside where you are in Oz?

Not wishing to have a dig ;-) but ironically I'm sitting in front of
the screen, sipping a glass of Shirnoff that has several chunks of
lime floating with the ice . Nothing unusual about that, but before I
poured the 'snifter', I popped outside to pick the lime and there are
plenty more on the bush for future forays into ethyl oblivia!

"Dave Poole" wrote
Bob wrote:

Anyway, couldn't you grow such a citrus plant outside where you are in
Oz?

Not wishing to have a dig ;-) but ironically I'm sitting in front of
the screen, sipping a glass of Shirnoff that has several chunks of
lime floating with the ice . Nothing unusual about that, but before I
poured the 'snifter', I popped outside to pick the lime and there are
plenty more on the bush for future forays into ethyl oblivia!

Nothing like ones own Lime to liven the taste buds.
Fresh picked and ripened on the tree, they do seem to taste better.
26 to go in our case. :-)
--
Regards
Bob H
17mls W. of London.UK

On 31/1/07 23:10, in article , "Bob
Hobden" wrote:


"Dave Poole" wrote
Bob wrote:

Anyway, couldn't you grow such a citrus plant outside where you are in
Oz?

Not wishing to have a dig ;-) but ironically I'm sitting in front of
the screen, sipping a glass of Shirnoff that has several chunks of
lime floating with the ice . Nothing unusual about that, but before I
poured the 'snifter', I popped outside to pick the lime and there are
plenty more on the bush for future forays into ethyl oblivia!

Nothing like ones own Lime to liven the taste buds.
Fresh picked and ripened on the tree, they do seem to taste better.
26 to go in our case. :-)

In that case you, like David, will no doubt be drinking Shirnoff. ;-))

--
Sacha
http://www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/
(remove weeds from address)

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
"Farm1" wrote after "Bob Hobden" wittered on and "Sacha" wrote
((snip))

Candying it would work fine but how much does one want, even with
a
Tea Shop
there are only so many cakes it can be used in/on. Hot Cross Buns
spring to
mind. :-)

I'm green with envy. My husband always likes to have a Boiled
Fruit
Cake sitting on the cake stand ready for his numerous snacks
during
the day and candied peel is one of the important ingredients for
it.
And the blasted local shop seems to think that country cooks only
want
candied peel at Christmas time for some strange reason known only
to
themselves!

I think we can get mixed chopped candied fruit all year here in the
UK and
there must be somewhere near you that stocks it all year. Even if
it's in a
major city some distance away they may post it to you.

I can get it easily enough if I go to a major supermarket but that's a
hike. It's the small village supermarket which doens't stock it.
this supermarket has all sorts of fancy Thai ingredients and doesn't
even have candied peel and we are in teh country where I know there
are lots of other old fashioned country cooks. I'd rather have the
basic ingredients than the fancy prepared stuff like the Thai bits and
bobs which I can make easily enough. Candied peel isn't one of the
quick ones to whip up.

Anyway, couldn't you grow such a citrus plant outside where you are
in Oz?

Not easily. I live in a cold climate where it gets down to a min
of -9 C in winter. I've tried one lemon and it died but I do have a
mandarin which is supposedly a lot more tender doing rather well. I
planted it where the sun can't hit it before the frost melts and that
seems to work. The lemon got the sun on it too early in the day.

The fruit truly are huge and it would make a good talking point,
Lemons the
size of Ozzy Rules footballs, imagine it. :-)

Sounds a bit like an Osage Orange which always remind me of brains. I
have been told that I should be able to grow finger limes here by
someone who I respect so I may just try one of them. I think the only
thing they are good for is the peel.

Dave Poole wrote:


Not wishing to have a dig ;-) but ironically I'm sitting in front of
the screen, sipping a glass of Shirnoff that has several chunks of
lime floating with the ice . Nothing unusual about that, but before I
poured the 'snifter', I popped outside to pick the lime and there are
plenty more on the bush for future forays into ethyl oblivia!


Dave, I'm sure your garden exists in a parallel universe not connected
to this one ;-)

Do you happen to know what variety of lime it is?

I have a 'lime' tree that I bought in Florida about 10 years ago.
It flowers regularly each winter but the flowers always drop :-(
I'd love a lime tree that would actually set fruit (in conservatory)

Also, Have you heard of Lemon Eureka?
It's available from T&M for £50 :-O but is supposedly hardy to -10oC
I'm thinking of buying it for the conservatory.
You can check it out he

http://fruit.thompson-morgan.com/uk/en/product/cww3360

Good to see you back here - I find your knowledge and advice invaluable!

Cheers,

Jeff
NE England