Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

I have found plausible hits with some Viburnum, Philadelphus
(but is replanting OK for them?), Dipelta, Amelanchier and
Exochorda, but the main problem is getting one that is reliably
upright. Buddleia and Syringa are fallback only.

Also, can Amelanchier lamarkii be pruned to keep it that small?
The RHS says "no", but that's not always true.

And why on earth are fragrant woody plants always so much less
fragrant in my garden than elsewhere? No, don't bother with that;
it's just one of Life's Great Mysteries.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 05/02/2014 13:35, Nick Maclaren wrote:
Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

Prunus 'Amanogowa'?

I have a Prunus 'Spire' that after 25 years is beginning to spread a
little, and is under 15 feet in height.

I have found plausible hits with some Viburnum, Philadelphus
(but is replanting OK for them?), Dipelta, Amelanchier and
Exochorda, but the main problem is getting one that is reliably
upright. Buddleia and Syringa are fallback only.

Also, can Amelanchier lamarkii be pruned to keep it that small?
The RHS says "no", but that's not always true.

And why on earth are fragrant woody plants always so much less
fragrant in my garden than elsewhere? No, don't bother with that;
it's just one of Life's Great Mysteries.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.


--
Stewart Robert Hinsley

In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:

Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

Prunus 'Amanogowa'?

I have a Prunus 'Spire' that after 25 years is beginning to spread a
little, and is under 15 feet in height.

Thanks very much.

Rather too pink and not quite big enough, I am afraid, plus any
flowering cherry might fall foul of She Who Must Be Obeyed :-)
We are surrounded by ones with synthetic strawberry ice cream
colouring, and that rather taints her view (and, to some extent,
mine)!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 05/02/2014 13:35, Nick Maclaren wrote:
Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

I have found plausible hits with some Viburnum, Philadelphus
(but is replanting OK for them?), Dipelta, Amelanchier and
Exochorda, but the main problem is getting one that is reliably
upright. Buddleia and Syringa are fallback only.

Also, can Amelanchier lamarkii be pruned to keep it that small?
The RHS says "no", but that's not always true.

And why on earth are fragrant woody plants always so much less
fragrant in my garden than elsewhere? No, don't bother with that;
it's just one of Life's Great Mysteries.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.




Hi Nick,

So far I've only come up with forms of Prunus:-

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus...le-cherry).htm

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus-snow-goose.htm

I also thought of P. spinosus, which may be a little too broad but,
being a potential hedging plant, it wouldn't sulk if you took a branch
out occasionally. It's also early flowering, so very helpful to bees
and other insects at a difficult time of year, if that's important to you.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

On 05/02/2014 15:18, Spider wrote:
On 05/02/2014 13:35, Nick Maclaren wrote:
Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

I have found plausible hits with some Viburnum, Philadelphus
(but is replanting OK for them?), Dipelta, Amelanchier and
Exochorda, but the main problem is getting one that is reliably
upright. Buddleia and Syringa are fallback only.

Also, can Amelanchier lamarkii be pruned to keep it that small?
The RHS says "no", but that's not always true.

And why on earth are fragrant woody plants always so much less
fragrant in my garden than elsewhere? No, don't bother with that;
it's just one of Life's Great Mysteries.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.




Hi Nick,

So far I've only come up with forms of Prunus:-

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus...le-cherry).htm

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus-snow-goose.htm

I also thought of P. spinosus, which may be a little too broad but,
being a potential hedging plant, it wouldn't sulk if you took a branch
out occasionally. It's also early flowering, so very helpful to bees
and other insects at a difficult time of year, if that's important to you.



Sorry to follow my own message, but I forgot to comment on the chances
of moving your Philadelphus 'Belle Etoile'.

I moved a Phil (Silver showers) many years ago and found it very
stubborn to shift. The roots establish well and are deep. I am a lady
spider, so I would expect to have more trouble than you, but I was young
and fit then. If you don't want it where it is, you *will* be able to
uproot it, but it may sulk if you replant it. Mine wasn't fit for
replanting. Other struggles may vary.

--
Spider.
On high ground in SE London
gardening on heavy clay

In article ,
Spider wrote:

So far I've only come up with forms of Prunus:-

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus...le-cherry).htm

http://www.frankpmatthews.com/prunus-snow-goose.htm

Thanks very much.

I also thought of P. spinosus, which may be a little too broad but,
being a potential hedging plant, it wouldn't sulk if you took a branch
out occasionally. It's also early flowering, so very helpful to bees
and other insects at a difficult time of year, if that's important to you.

I think I'll skip that one - it's a little uncouth for the location!
Sloe is a nice plant, but not an elegant one.

I moved a Phil (Silver showers) many years ago and found it very
stubborn to shift. The roots establish well and are deep. I am a lady
spider, so I would expect to have more trouble than you, but I was young
and fit then. If you don't want it where it is, you *will* be able to
uproot it, but it may sulk if you replant it. Mine wasn't fit for
replanting. Other struggles may vary.

Thanks :-( I may leave it until after flowering and just get rid
of it. I like it, but it's never been a total success.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 2014-02-05 15:12:33 +0000, Nick Maclaren said:

In article ,
Stewart Robert Hinsley wrote:

Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

Prunus 'Amanogowa'?

I have a Prunus 'Spire' that after 25 years is beginning to spread a
little, and is under 15 feet in height.

Thanks very much.

Rather too pink and not quite big enough, I am afraid, plus any
flowering cherry might fall foul of She Who Must Be Obeyed :-)
We are surrounded by ones with synthetic strawberry ice cream
colouring, and that rather taints her view (and, to some extent,
mine)!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

Would any of the Hoherias do for you or in your temperatures, I wonder?
H. sexstylosa Stardus might be worth a look. Or a white Buddleia? I
was thinking, too, of a Betula jacquemontii - no flowers, of course but
wonderful, elegant, white bark that positively glows in twilight. The
other, which can be clipped, and seems to flower on and off all year
here is Myrtus communis but whether it would take your winters, I don't
know.

--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.com
South Devon

In article ,
sacha wrote:

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably

Would any of the Hoherias do for you or in your temperatures, I wonder?
H. sexstylosa Stardus might be worth a look. Or a white Buddleia? I
was thinking, too, of a Betula jacquemontii - no flowers, of course but
wonderful, elegant, white bark that positively glows in twilight. The
other, which can be clipped, and seems to flower on and off all year
here is Myrtus communis but whether it would take your winters, I don't
know.

Thanks very much, but probably not. It's in rather an exposed
position, and Hoheria and Myrtis would need a wall. I am not
keen on a Buddleia because they get tatty very quickly, but one
would certainly meet the requirement! I hadn't thought of a
birch, but will do so - cautiously!


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 05/02/2014 13:35, Nick Maclaren wrote:
Many years ago, I planted a Philadelphus "Belle Etoile" but did
not realise that it would not grow above 4-5 feet. So:

What are the chances of me moving one with a basal width of a
few inches? Yes, I know how, but not what the chances are.

Can anyone think of a good small tree or shrub that will grow
in an upright fashion (critical) to 10-20' - or can be pruned
to be no higher than 10' and to avoid spreading sideways too
much (as I do with Abelia and Berberis vulgaris) - and preferably
is a good show of white in the spring for a reasonable period?

I have found plausible hits with some Viburnum, Philadelphus
(but is replanting OK for them?), Dipelta, Amelanchier and
Exochorda, but the main problem is getting one that is reliably
upright. Buddleia and Syringa are fallback only.

Also, can Amelanchier lamarkii be pruned to keep it that small?
The RHS says "no", but that's not always true.

And why on earth are fragrant woody plants always so much less
fragrant in my garden than elsewhere? No, don't bother with that;
it's just one of Life's Great Mysteries.

Maybe some of the fastigiate Cornus might meet the bill. But if you can
do without the spring flowers, and get them at a time of the year when
not much else will be in flower, then Eucryphia x nymansensis ‘Nymansay’
or E. cordifolia might be worth consideration.

--

Jeff

On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 15:57:10 +0000, Nick Maclaren wrote:

I moved a Phil (Silver showers) many years ago and found it very
stubborn to shift. The roots establish well and are deep. I am a lady
spider, so I would expect to have more trouble than you, but I was young
and fit then. If you don't want it where it is, you *will* be able to
uproot it,
but it may sulk if you replant it. Mine wasn't fit for replanting.
Other struggles may vary.

Thanks :-( I may leave it until after flowering and just get rid of it.
I like it, but it's never been a total success.

Hi Nick,

I did move an unnamed Philadelphus, around 20 years ago. It wasn't that
small at the time, and although it did sulk for a year it settled in and
did fine. In fact it's outgrown the spot a little; but it is fabulous
when it flowers.

As for another small tree, how about one of the small snake bark maples?
A x conspicuum 'Silver Vein' is one of the best: very well striped white/
green bark, showy flowers, green with yellow centres in umbels, shiny
young leaves, reliable bright yellow fall colour. I don't think it would
outgrow 20 ft. Others I'd suggest would be A. micranthum 'Candlabrum',
which has small and very pretty leaves, great red/orange fall colour,
bright green striped bark; also A. tegmentosum which has light, white
bloomed bark, and nice broad trilobed leaves with acuminate tips and
yellow/orange fall colour. Tegmentosum does need a little shade, though.

cheers,

-E



--
Gardening in Lower Normandy

In article ,
Jeff Layman wrote:

Maybe some of the fastigiate Cornus might meet the bill. But if you can
do without the spring flowers, and get them at a time of the year when
not much else will be in flower, then Eucryphia x nymansensis ‘Nymansay’
or E. cordifolia might be worth consideration.

Thanks very much. Yes, Cornus might. I doubt that Eucryphia
would like the cold, though :-(


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

In article ,
Emery Davis wrote:

I did move an unnamed Philadelphus, around 20 years ago. It wasn't that
small at the time, and although it did sulk for a year it settled in and
did fine. In fact it's outgrown the spot a little; but it is fabulous
when it flowers.

Thanks very much.

As for another small tree, how about one of the small snake bark maples?

I should love to, but ....

The problem is the position catches the wind - NOT ideal for maples :-(


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On Wed, 05 Feb 2014 20:10:31 +0000, Nick Maclaren wrote:

As for another small tree, how about one of the small snake bark maples?

I should love to, but ....

The problem is the position catches the wind - NOT ideal for maples :-(


Well, don't be to sure! 'Silver Vein' is very tough, maybe the
toughest of the snake barks. It can definitely stand up to some wind!
Not that I'd recommend it for the coast, mind.

Your dead on for the other two I mentioned, though.

--
Gardening in Lower Normandy

In article ,
Emery Davis wrote:

As for another small tree, how about one of the small snake bark maples?

I should love to, but ....

The problem is the position catches the wind - NOT ideal for maples :-(

Well, don't be to sure! 'Silver Vein' is very tough, maybe the
toughest of the snake barks. It can definitely stand up to some wind!
Not that I'd recommend it for the coast, mind.

Thanks again. That's definitely worth thinking about, then.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.

On 05/02/2014 20:46, Nick Maclaren wrote:
In article ,
Emery Davis wrote:

As for another small tree, how about one of the small snake bark maples?

I should love to, but ....

The problem is the position catches the wind - NOT ideal for maples :-(

Well, don't be to sure! 'Silver Vein' is very tough, maybe the
toughest of the snake barks. It can definitely stand up to some wind!
Not that I'd recommend it for the coast, mind.

Thanks again. That's definitely worth thinking about, then.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.



Just to be different, what about ilex pyramidalis?