Also, the subtle aesthetic quality that an excellent
bonsai pot can convey as part of a bonsai display is prized for obvious
reasons.

-----------

Another vote for the ceramic as desirable is the close relationship
between the mediums of tree and pot. Probably we consider a ceramic pot
made of clay as pretty fundamental in the medium used. Mica, as all
mediums, is from nature, too, but not as closely a natural ground of the
tree. I always prefer it on that basis, but I couldn't hope to handle some
of my trees without the lighter weight of mica and I am happy to have them.

Lynn

Lynn Boyd, Oregon, USA
Zone 7-8

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I agree with all you say, Marty. Ceramic pot adds value to a good bonsais.

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot summer?
This characteristic could be important in a warm climate like Mediterranean or
Californian.

-Ireneu-


Marty Haber wrote:

I agree with all you say, Marty. Ceramic pot adds value to a good bonsais.

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot summer?
This characteristic could be important in a warm climate like Mediterranean or
Californian.

-Ireneu-


Marty Haber wrote:

Also, the subtle aesthetic quality that an excellent
bonsai pot can convey as part of a bonsai display is prized for obvious
reasons.

-----------

Another vote for the ceramic as desirable is the close relationship
between the mediums of tree and pot. Probably we consider a ceramic pot
made of clay as pretty fundamental in the medium used. Mica, as all
mediums, is from nature, too, but not as closely a natural ground of the
tree. I always prefer it on that basis, but I couldn't hope to handle some
of my trees without the lighter weight of mica and I am happy to have them.

Lynn

Lynn Boyd, Oregon, USA
Zone 7-8

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Also, the subtle aesthetic quality that an excellent
bonsai pot can convey as part of a bonsai display is prized for obvious
reasons.

-----------

Another vote for the ceramic as desirable is the close relationship
between the mediums of tree and pot. Probably we consider a ceramic pot
made of clay as pretty fundamental in the medium used. Mica, as all
mediums, is from nature, too, but not as closely a natural ground of the
tree. I always prefer it on that basis, but I couldn't hope to handle some
of my trees without the lighter weight of mica and I am happy to have them.

Lynn

Lynn Boyd, Oregon, USA
Zone 7-8

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Hello to All,
General Response,

been growing a Tamarind and a Gmelina in black
mica pots and these trees require full sun.Thus
far no problems with roots and overheating.

Growth remains even and trees are green.
Stay Well All.
Khaimraj
[West Indies/Caribbean]

*Perhaps the plastic type look of the mica pot
is what cheapens it,whereas stoneware has a
surface that is seductively touchable and mates
so well with tree/trunk textures/colours.



-----Original Message-----
From: Ireneu Castillo
To:
Date: 26 January 2004 13:44
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots


I agree with all you say, Marty. Ceramic pot adds value to a good bonsais.

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot
summer?
This characteristic could be important in a warm climate like Mediterranean
or
Californian.

-Ireneu-

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Hello to All,
General Response,

been growing a Tamarind and a Gmelina in black
mica pots and these trees require full sun.Thus
far no problems with roots and overheating.

Growth remains even and trees are green.
Stay Well All.
Khaimraj
[West Indies/Caribbean]

*Perhaps the plastic type look of the mica pot
is what cheapens it,whereas stoneware has a
surface that is seductively touchable and mates
so well with tree/trunk textures/colours.



-----Original Message-----
From: Ireneu Castillo
To:
Date: 26 January 2004 13:44
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots


I agree with all you say, Marty. Ceramic pot adds value to a good bonsais.

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot
summer?
This characteristic could be important in a warm climate like Mediterranean
or
Californian.

-Ireneu-

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In a message dated 1/26/2004 4:44:47 PM Eastern Standard Time,
writes:

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot
summer?

I don't think so. The mica pots I have seen are fairly thick.
Billy on the Florida Space Coast
BSF Annual Convention May 28 - 31, 2004 Radisson Hotel, Cape Canaveral,
Florida
Sponsored by The Bonsai Society of Brevard and the Treasure Coast Bonsai
Society
http://www.bonsaisocietyofbrevard.org/2004/2004.html

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I believe Jim Lewis said to keep them in the shade.... and I mentioned
that you could put reflective material on the pot, such as aluminum foil
(shiny side out).

Carl L. Rosner

Ireneu Castillo wrote:

I agree with all you say, Marty. Ceramic pot adds value to a good bonsais.

But nobody answers my question: Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot summer?
This characteristic could be important in a warm climate like Mediterranean or
Californian.

-Ireneu-









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Over here in the UK, very acceptable Chinese pots are now cheaper than
mica pots.

I'm looking into a club order of a container load from China.

Cheers

Kev Bailey
Vale Of Clwyd, North Wales

Snip

"mica pots are really one step DOWN from a pretty good
Chinese bonsai pot."



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Jim Lewis wrote:


I use mica pots for training, as one step up from a wooden box.

Oh, come now!

Mica pots are SEVERAL steps up from a wooden box.

One step up would be a terra cotta pot.

Two steps up would be a bulb pot.

Three steps up would be a plain old plastic bonsai pot.

Four steps up would be a cracked bonsai pot.

and then, five steps up would be a mica pot.

Others may have a few in-betweens, and others may change the
order, but mica pots are really one step DOWN from a pretty good
Chinese bonsai pot.

Jim Lewis - - Tallahassee, FL - Only where
people have learned to appreciate and cherish the landscape and
its living cover will they treat it with the care and respect it
should have - Paul Bigelow Sears.

Jim, I think you misunderstood me. I was not saying that in the grand scheme of
things, mica pots are one step up from a wooden box. What I said was that for me,
personally, in MY bonsai garden, in MY personal bonsai practice, etc. mica pots
are the next step from wooden boxes. You wouldn't have any way of knowing this,
but I have a lot of trees in wooden boxes. Some more in kitty litter pans or the
equivalent, nursery pots, etc. A number in less expensive Chinese ceramic pots.
Nothing in real high-quality ceramic pots (Tokonome level).

Craig Cowing
NY
Zone 5b/6a Sunset 37

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it sound like another case of traditional vs. contemporary...
as with anything...
smiles,
alicia
diplaced to zone 9, LA
waiting to get back to Hawaii...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andy Rutledge"
To:
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 10:59 AM
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots


Hi Mark,

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Hill"
Hi all...
Here's a question to prolong this thread ..... Why are mica pots not
preferred show containers?
snip
Is it simply because ceramic pots cost much more, therefore they must be
better ?
Sounds a bit snooty to me !!
Mark Hill
-------------------------------

I'll bite. Yes, it's snooty - for the same reason that diamonds are
coveted
over cubic zirconia, though from most views, the CZ looks beautiful and
dazzling. The reason is twofold (at least):

1) This is an art. The art of bonsai display is one that touts quality
and,
in many cases, is concerned with ties to the artistry of long ago (antique
chinese pots for high quality bonsai in an exhibit) or of today (great
modern potters). Also, the subtle aesthetic quality that an excellent
bonsai pot can convey as part of a bonsai display is prized for obvious
reasons.

2) We're human. When dealing with artistry - an admittedly snooty
endeavor
(and define "snooty" at your peril) - the specific quality of the elements
involved has an impact on the viewer (from small to enormous) AND the
exhibitor. Humans generally enjoy exhibiting and viewing rare quality and
great craftsmanship more than we enjoy exhibiting and viewing "plastic"
make-do elements. Often, what we know about an objet d'art impacts our
enjoyment.

So sure, recognize that bonsai artistry has snooty elements. Every art
does
and for simple reasons. However, thinking that to be a negative is just
silly, and deriding bonsai for its elements of snootiness does the art and
enthusiasts no good. It's just part of this endeavor. Care about it or
not, but criticize it makes us look silly.

Kind regards,
Andy Rutledge
www.andyrutledge.com/palaver/main.htm
zone 8, Texas


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maybe they used ceramic in the past...
because they couldn't make mica ones...
hahahah
after all, prior to ceramic, was porcelain...
and prior to porcelain...was ...what...
bone?

smiles,
alicia
----- Original Message -----
From: "Marty Haber"
To:
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 10:57 AM
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots


Ireneu & Mark - this thread has been explored ad infinitum a couple of
years
ago at this site. It all boils down to the argument of artificial
flowers
vs. real ones.
AHA! You must stop me here. Artificial flowers are NOT real flowers, but
both mica pots and ceramic pots are artificial. Well, you have me there.
HOWEVER - artists have been using ceramics for thousands of years. There
has to be a reason. A beautiful ceramic bonsai pot can sit on a shelf
all
by itself and be a source of visual enjoyment all by itself. I can't say
the same for mica pots.
NEVERTHELESS - I agree with the mica protagonists who argue for the
positive
qualities found in mica.
End of discussion - Mica is great for training purposes:
ceramics are great for great bonsai.
Marty
P.S. This is not an expression of snobbery. M.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ireneu Castillo"
To:
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 9:21 AM
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots


Thank you, Andy

I'm from Barcelona (Catalonia-Spain), and here we have a lot of heat and
sun in
summer. I had heard that some people had problems with mica pots because
they absorb
more heat than ceramic due to his black colour. It's really this?

-Ireneu-


Andy Rutledge wrote:

Of course you can damage the tree - but not by use of mica pots. Mica
pots
are great pots for training and they don't look half bad, either. Go
for
it, save a buck and get a good pot.

Kind regards,
Andy Rutledge
www.andyrutledge.com/palaver/main.htm
zone 8, Texas




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Thank you for mentioning cracked bonsai pots in the #5 slot. I have a few
of them. To patch them, I use Bondo
(the auto repair product), which makes good contact and is water-proof.
Marty
P.S. I'm going to Florida next month. Any suggestions for a quiet spot
where we can get away from the maddening throng?
Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Lewis"
To:
Sent: Monday, January 26, 2004 3:32 PM
Subject: [IBC] Mica Pots




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Greetings...

Is it simply because ceramic pots cost much more, therefore
they must be better?

I think that what we must see here it's that ceramic pots are traditional
and mica pots are something very new and useful.

Mica pots are done with a machine that makes about 5 each minute and a
"machine" that builds a ceramic pot will build one each 2 or 3 minutes!
Traditional ones are build by hand and take at least 15min each. So, it's a
matter of economy.

Other thing, nowadays everything that's plastic (kind of J ) it's supposed
to be less expensive, we got used to this. If Mica pots were has expensive
has ceramic ones, I think they wouldn't sell at all!



Mica pots can overheat the roots in a hot summer?

Yes. I am in Portugal (Europe). Mica pots get very hot in the summer. Over
here we have 2 colors, black and light grey. Both of them get very hot at
direct sun.

In the summer the best is to place the tree in a shadowed place, in winter
it's an advantage to be in the sun because it keeps the roots less stressed
to extreme cold!




Pedro Amorim Pereira _ Porto - Portugal

http://amorimpereira.no.sapo.pt
http://sapp.telepac.pt/bonsai-pt/
http://www.geocities.com/pedropereira.geo

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