K Barrett wrote:
Nancy, before you get "miffed".

Pat is a vendor who sells orchids and takes enomous amounts of time with his
clients to be sure they understand how to grow their orchids.

Walmart does not.

Now who will answer questions when Walmart forces vendors like Pat out of
business?


Okay, Okay. Right now for me, there are no local venders. It's a 5
hour drive to St. Louis, 2 hrs to KC, 2 hrs to Springfield. I either
have to order on line or occasionally I purchase at a box store. It's
a mess.

Our local club took a field trip to a Kansas City grower the 24th of
October. That was fun, and yes I bought from him. I was thrilled
because he had an Lc Stephen Oliver Fouraker, in bloom, and agreed to
sell. Soon as I saw the bloom, I was like a bird dog on point. All he
had to do was fire the round, I was ready to retrieve.

It is an interesting place to go. They've converted an old limestone
mine for orchid growing. Everything is under lights and the
environment is absolutely controlled. Most of his trade is blooming
plants. Some nice white phals, Onc Sharry Baby, and tropicals. All
quick sellers. As he put it, not always exciting, but pays the bills.
There were other orchids (big sign NOT FOR SALE), that he kept for his
own gratification or more serious collectors, and some tagged pods
maturing. Maybe in the future he will have some compots or seedlings,
or I will have more money.

I wish there were growers in my area. If Pat was around this area, I'd
probably get on his nerves by being a regular customer. I can see it
now, "Oh no, it's her again. Get a restraining order." The good news
is that while I may beg, I won't switch tags.

The last show I went to was in St. Louis. The venders tables had
nearly the same selections. Bread and milk, easy sales, not
particularly interesting (to me anyway). One vender had cattleyas,
bare root, thrown in a banana box under the table that was used to
restock the 3 or 4 that he displayed on the table. Yes, I bought 1,
but I must have looked at 20 or 30 before I was satisfied that the new
lead growths and root buds looked good. I probably shouldn't have
bought the best of a bad lot. The "S" on my leotard stands for stupid.

Anyway, I'm in a great mood right now. The programmable thermostats
and heaters worked perfectly last night. 2 more nights in the mid 20's
then more moderate temps.

The intent of USENET was never to be a replacement for customer service so
that box stores could save on labor costs. I think the box stores will
become the major orchid suppliers and they owe their consumers more. It is
not too much to expect all orchids to come with care instructions for the
particular plant in the mix it is potted in. And when the customer's plant
gets sick and they go back to the same store to purchase sprays, somebody in
the store should be able to recommend products and help the consumer
identify any culture problems that may be causing the problem. Some of the
box stores are better than others, but are you really going to get any worst
suggestions than some of the USENET responses you may receive. The box
stores offering the 1 years 100 % satisfaction guarantee is the best deal
out there. Don't like the spot, trade it in. Don't like that it is not in
bloom, trade it in.

Pat

wrote in message
...
I don't know... maybe a usenet newsgroup dedicated to that particular item
/ hobby, and full of professionals / amateurs / hobbyists willing to help
others (AKA newbies) learn ? :=)

Wasn't that intent of USENET? a virtual gathering place where users of
similar intersts could electronically share information.


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...

snip Where else, besides the
seller, should you first take questions or problems about any product
you've purchased??? Kenni

You're naive if you think coming into a group of vendors bragging about a
bunch of [warty] orchids you bought for cheap at Walmart then wanting to
know why they aren't growing and wanting free advice isn't going to raise
some hackles. Get your head out.

So, caveat emptor, Bruce.

And you get what you pay for.

K Barrett

"Bruce Musgrove" wrote in message
...
I don't know... maybe a usenet newsgroup dedicated to that particular item
/ hobby, and full of professionals / amateurs / hobbyists willing to help
others (AKA newbies) learn ? :=)

Wasn't that intent of USENET? a virtual gathering place where users of
similar intersts could electronically share information.


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...

snip Where else, besides the
seller, should you first take questions or problems about any product
you've purchased??? Kenni

You should read the articles written by Dr. Yin-Tung Wang from Texas A&M
about how to force an orchid to bloom. Then you'll realize what the
wholesaler does to an orchid intended for sale at a box-store and why you'll
probably never be able to get the thing to rebloom for you. Sure people can
do it, even I've done it, but the poor things have been 'ridden hard and put
away wet' so you can't expect too much from them after that sort of
treatment.

http://primera.tamu.edu/orchids/articles.htm

K Barrett

"Nancy G." wrote in message
oups.com...
Okay, Okay. Right now for me, there are no local venders. It's a 5
hour drive to St. Louis, 2 hrs to KC, 2 hrs to Springfield. I either
have to order on line or occasionally I purchase at a box store. It's
a mess.
[snip]

At the risk of being flamed half to death, I'm chiming in here. Just about
all of us have had questions for this group at one time or another, and
everyone was a "newbie" at one time.

Do I purchase most of my orchids from reputable vendors? Yeah. Do I value
their hard work and try to help them stay in business? Yeah. Do I ever see
something at HD and pick it up? Yeah again. And I daresay that, with the
[possible] exception of the commercial growers in this group, most of us
have done the same.

Are we suddenly hostile to questions from people seeking information because
of where they bought their plants? C'mon, guys. Let's get back to friendly
and welcoming.

Just my two cents. Flame retardant suit is on.

Diana

"K Barrett" wrote in message
. ..
You're naive if you think coming into a group of vendors bragging about a
bunch of [warty] orchids you bought for cheap at Walmart then wanting to
know why they aren't growing and wanting free advice isn't going to raise
some hackles. Get your head out.

So, caveat emptor, Bruce.

And you get what you pay for.

K Barrett

"Bruce Musgrove" wrote in message
...
I don't know... maybe a usenet newsgroup dedicated to that particular item
/ hobby, and full of professionals / amateurs / hobbyists willing to help
others (AKA newbies) learn ? :=)

Wasn't that intent of USENET? a virtual gathering place where users of
similar intersts could electronically share information.


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...

snip Where else, besides the
seller, should you first take questions or problems about any product
you've purchased??? Kenni

Just saying let's all be friends doesn't raise the awareness of the issues
for the newbies, now does it?

Or do newbies only deserve certain kinds of education?

And I object to the characterization of 'hostile'. 'Adult' would be more
like it.

K Barrett

"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
At the risk of being flamed half to death, I'm chiming in here. Just about
all of us have had questions for this group at one time or another, and
everyone was a "newbie" at one time.

Do I purchase most of my orchids from reputable vendors? Yeah. Do I value
their hard work and try to help them stay in business? Yeah. Do I ever see
something at HD and pick it up? Yeah again. And I daresay that, with the
[possible] exception of the commercial growers in this group, most of us
have done the same.

Are we suddenly hostile to questions from people seeking information
because of where they bought their plants? C'mon, guys. Let's get back to
friendly and welcoming.

Just my two cents. Flame retardant suit is on.

Diana

"K Barrett" wrote in message
. ..
You're naive if you think coming into a group of vendors bragging about a
bunch of [warty] orchids you bought for cheap at Walmart then wanting to
know why they aren't growing and wanting free advice isn't going to raise
some hackles. Get your head out.

So, caveat emptor, Bruce.

And you get what you pay for.

K Barrett

"Bruce Musgrove" wrote in message
...
I don't know... maybe a usenet newsgroup dedicated to that particular
item / hobby, and full of professionals / amateurs / hobbyists willing
to help others (AKA newbies) learn ? :=)

Wasn't that intent of USENET? a virtual gathering place where users of
similar intersts could electronically share information.


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...

snip Where else, besides the
seller, should you first take questions or problems about any product
you've purchased??? Kenni

On Fri, 3 Nov 2006 12:54:32 -0800, K Barrett wrote:
Just saying let's all be friends doesn't raise the awareness of the issues
for the newbies, now does it?

Or do newbies only deserve certain kinds of education?

And I object to the characterization of 'hostile'. 'Adult' would be more
like it.

Rude would be more appropriate.

Bob

Kathy, I certainly didn't mean to offend you; I'm sure you know me better
than that by now. And of course newbies need education in lots of areas. I
guess what I'm trying to say is that I would hope we can accomplish that and
still be civil to one another.

There's so much incivility around these days. It's nice to come here and be
able to express opinions without rancor. I'm no Pollyanna, Kath. I can sling
the s**t with the best of them, and on the rare occasions when I do it can
get ugly. It seems to me, though, that this is one place where that's rarely
necessary.

Jes' sayin'. Didn't mean to hijack the thread. I'll butt out now.

Diana
"Robert Lorenzini" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 3 Nov 2006 12:54:32 -0800, K Barrett wrote:
Just saying let's all be friends doesn't raise the awareness of the
issues
for the newbies, now does it?

Or do newbies only deserve certain kinds of education?

And I object to the characterization of 'hostile'. 'Adult' would be more
like it.

Rude would be more appropriate.

Bob

"Robert Lorenzini" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 3 Nov 2006 12:54:32 -0800, K Barrett wrote:
Just saying let's all be friends doesn't raise the awareness of the
issues
for the newbies, now does it?

Or do newbies only deserve certain kinds of education?

And I object to the characterization of 'hostile'. 'Adult' would be more
like it.

Rude would be more appropriate.

Bob

Bob, I hope this is the rudest exchange you ever experience in your life.
If so, you should get down on your knees and thank God every day that you
lead such a blessed existence.

K Barrett

I'm not offended. I'm just amazed that any dissention, alternate opinion or
even alternate phraseology in exchanges should be described as 'rude'.

So.

Where do you cut the Phal spike?

Since that's all that everyone deems appropriate conversation around here.

K Barrett

"Diana Kulaga" wrote in message
...
Kathy, I certainly didn't mean to offend you; I'm sure you know me better
than that by now. And of course newbies need education in lots of areas. I
guess what I'm trying to say is that I would hope we can accomplish that
and still be civil to one another.

There's so much incivility around these days. It's nice to come here and
be able to express opinions without rancor. I'm no Pollyanna, Kath. I can
sling the s**t with the best of them, and on the rare occasions when I do
it can get ugly. It seems to me, though, that this is one place where
that's rarely necessary.

Jes' sayin'. Didn't mean to hijack the thread. I'll butt out now.

Diana
"Robert Lorenzini" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 3 Nov 2006 12:54:32 -0800, K Barrett
wrote:
Just saying let's all be friends doesn't raise the awareness of the
issues
for the newbies, now does it?

Or do newbies only deserve certain kinds of education?

And I object to the characterization of 'hostile'. 'Adult' would be
more
like it.

Rude would be more appropriate.

Bob

I see a lot of people asking for "free" advice here, and not getting the
hostile response I have received over this one. What did I say or do to get
this reaction?

It was a simple innocent little question, not spam, a flame, or a rant.
I had done a lot of internet research and book research before asking and
had not seen or read anything like it . I had a theory of what it may be,
based on when it showed up and what I had been doing. Confirmation that it
was what I thought it was , and not some other MAJOR disease would have been
nice. I don't care how many times I read about diseases, until I actually
see a picture (or a live plant) with a disease, it is difficult to relate
the words to practice. At least for me it is as I am more visual.

The question had nothing to do with what store it was bought at. That
particular plant is a healthy flowering DGMRA Winter Wonderland "White
Fairy" ( http://katkom01.home.comcast.net/wfairy.jpg ). It was bought at
the Dallas Home and Garden show from the Greater North Texas Orchid Society
(GNTOS), along with 4 others. The person who placed it at the booth for the
benefit of the GNTOS was a local Commercial orchid seller. Does that make me
more or less entitled to "free advice"? Would any of the group feel
differently if my previous posts of what I though were unusually patterned
or colored flowers had not mentioned where they were bought? I thought it
mind blowing that Wal Mart, Lowes, or home depot even carried Orchids , much
less one of the patterns I bought.

By the way, just to balance things out, I now have 27 orchids. Of those, 12
were bought at local garden shows from one of the two orchid clubs in our
area. Several of those had no name on them, and were not in any better (or
worse ) shape than the ones I bought at the box stores. At the one orchid
show I went to, I was not impressed with the ones I saw for sale. They were
ALL, plane jane vanilla orchids, nothing special to them. All of the unusual
ones I saw that I liked were the ones submitted for judging , which were not
for sale, even if I took a day off from work to drive the 30+ miles to that
particular orchid vendors shop.

Naive ? No. I know what to expect when I buy from the box stores. So far
all I have bought from box stores have been pretty healthy and are doing
good. That comes from doing research and carefully inspecting the plants
before making a decision. Box stores are also open at convenient hours. My
local orchid growers are not. Box stores are nearby. My local orchid
growers are not. Box stores allow me to visually see and inspect the item
before buying. Most of my local orchid growers are mail order and you cannot
touch and inspect the plant before buying it . As you said, caveat emptor,
and I am. I am not trying to imply the local / mail order growers are fly by
night, but I do not know them, and plants are one thing I really need to
know the supplier or be able to visually inspect before buying.

This group is not for vendors only. As with all USENET groups it is for
anyone who is interested in the group and wishes to exchange information
(chat or socialize if you will) about their interest. Some of the people
here may be vendors. Some of them are "professional" hobbyists. Some of
them are newbie's looking for more information. I doubt any of them come
here to be verbally attacked, especially me. I get enough of that from my
teenage daughter!

The little smiley at the end of the post, meant it was not a rant, flame or
put down. It was TONGUE IN CHEEK! Maybe I should have used :-J


"K Barrett" wrote in message
. ..
You're naive if you think coming into a group of vendors bragging about a
bunch of [warty] orchids you bought for cheap at Walmart then wanting to
know why they aren't growing and wanting free advice isn't going to raise
some hackles. Get your head out.

So, caveat emptor, Bruce.

And you get what you pay for.

K Barrett

"Bruce Musgrove" wrote in message
...
I don't know... maybe a usenet newsgroup dedicated to that particular item
/ hobby, and full of professionals / amateurs / hobbyists willing to help
others (AKA newbies) learn ? :=)

Wasn't that intent of USENET? a virtual gathering place where users of
similar intersts could electronically share information.


"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...

snip Where else, besides the
seller, should you first take questions or problems about any product
you've purchased??? Kenni

We find (by entirely unscientific "survey" of those who talk to us about
orchids) that box store purchases tend to lead to one of two results, in
about equal numbers:

1. The purchaser "graduates" and begins to frequent local growers; or
2. The purchaser decides, based on the poor performance of the box store
purchases, that orchids are "too difficult" and gives up on them.

Kenni


"Robert Lorenzini" wrote in message
...

I have a feeling these cheap orchids may provide a hook to lure
unsuspecting folks into the dark side of collecting. I would pay
50% more for those big box plants if they just had a tag. I think
for most people they are just table flowers and disposable after
a month or so. Oh, and thank you Trader Joe's for not charging extra
for the mealy bugs.


Bob

Hi Kenni,

It used to be that way here a few years ago, but the terrain has changed.

1. The box stores are eating the local garden centers lunches. The garden
centers have learned to unpack boxes from Hawaii, but they are not large
enough to get the price breaks and their markup rates just can not stand up.

2. Some of the box stores have developed very nice orchids sections with
plants from a variety of sources. The plants are well cared for, but the
heavy traffic does take a toll. I have seen box stores with knowledgeable
staff and have seen them participate in society sponsored orchid shows.
Customers from these store will also buy from me, but neither the customer
or I consider it a graduation.

3. We are starting to get a real throw away market here. The plants (white
phals) arrive at the peak of the Florida season and sold for between $15 and
$20 dollars. It is now pretty common for people to enjoy the blooms,
rebloom the spikes and then throw away the plant before the next season
arrives.

I heard last week one of the big box stores had fired a major grower. They
said it was a quality issue, but I expect one of those operation Mick was
talking about decided it could play the pay per scan game for less. Anyways
sounds like I'm about to see some new plants and there is a grower down your
way with a whole bunch of unsold plants.

Pat

"Kenni Judd" wrote in message
...
We find (by entirely unscientific "survey" of those who talk to us about
orchids) that box store purchases tend to lead to one of two results, in
about equal numbers:

1. The purchaser "graduates" and begins to frequent local growers; or
2. The purchaser decides, based on the poor performance of the box store
purchases, that orchids are "too difficult" and gives up on them.

Kenni


"Robert Lorenzini" wrote in message
...

I have a feeling these cheap orchids may provide a hook to lure
unsuspecting folks into the dark side of collecting. I would pay
50% more for those big box plants if they just had a tag. I think
for most people they are just table flowers and disposable after
a month or so. Oh, and thank you Trader Joe's for not charging extra
for the mealy bugs.


Bob