Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Folks,

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
...
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron" wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
.. .
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Yes that spinal cord recovery system really
shocked me. How dumb can the industry get?
In testing 30 % of the meat they recovered tested positive for spinal
cord tissue in it. (This is not a test of the current recall, just a test on
the advanced meat recovery system) In addition to hot dogs it goes
into pizza toppings, taco fillings, meatballs, bologna.
And that stuff could end up anywhere in the country.
Since they knew it was only a matter of time when
this showed up in the states WHY did they keep
on doing this advanced meat recovery off of spinal cords?
We are getting a lot of very detailed coverage here since we are the ones who
had ended up with meat that was recalled. The only problem is what if you
already ate it??? Can't recall that!
Supposedly this cow's brains, spinal cord and nerves
were removed and sent to a rendering plant where it was going to, or already
has, been turned into chicken feed or sent to the cosmetics industry (major ew
factor there!).
Though how much we'll ever really know, I'm not sure.


ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

There is good reason to be cautious Jan. Prions (infectious proteins) have been
shown to infect muscles like the tongue thru the nervous tissue
(http://www.nature.com/nsu/021230/021230-5.html). Muscles are loaded with nerves.
But more important is what is NOT KNOWN. For instance, a meat packer in England got
the human form of BSE even tho he was a vegetarian. They think it was from handling
the meat.
Most puzzling of all is the epidemic of "mad deer" in Wisconsin and other states.
Evidently wild game farms were allowed to feed recycled meat products to their game
farm deer. These deer jumped the fence and mixed with the wild deer population and
it spread. SPREAD???!!!! nobody seems to have a handle on how it spread from deer
to deer in the wild, altho wild deer could have been jumping into the farm and eating
contaminated feed. We do know prion disease has been present in wild Elk for a long
time.
http://www.wisc.edu/foodsafety/consu...sheets/BSE.htm
suggests that prions can be spread by blood. And you are correct, normal cooking
temps dont kill it, nor does freezing. Ingrid

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron" wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
. ..
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

Ah well, its like the cow in Canada.. When everyone went nuts to avoid
Canadian Beef, it was barely noted that cow originally came from a US
producer, most likely where it originally contracted the BSE... How ironic
is it when the shoe is on the other foot.??.. I suspect the beef market in
the US is going to be in some trouble for the next year or so.

Timmer...


wrote in message
...
There is good reason to be cautious Jan. Prions (infectious proteins)
have been
shown to infect muscles like the tongue thru the nervous tissue
(http://www.nature.com/nsu/021230/021230-5.html). Muscles are loaded with
nerves.
But more important is what is NOT KNOWN. For instance, a meat packer in
England got
the human form of BSE even tho he was a vegetarian. They think it was
from handling
the meat.
Most puzzling of all is the epidemic of "mad deer" in Wisconsin and other
states.
Evidently wild game farms were allowed to feed recycled meat products to
their game
farm deer. These deer jumped the fence and mixed with the wild deer
population and
it spread. SPREAD???!!!! nobody seems to have a handle on how it spread
from deer
to deer in the wild, altho wild deer could have been jumping into the farm
and eating
contaminated feed. We do know prion disease has been present in wild Elk
for a long
time.
http://www.wisc.edu/foodsafety/consu...sheets/BSE.htm
suggests that prions can be spread by blood. And you are correct, normal
cooking
temps dont kill it, nor does freezing. Ingrid

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off
very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"
wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media
driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
. ..
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is
gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for
a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

That is true information Jan... That is why the plants that processed the
cow that tested positive recalled lots of ground meat. The other potential
problem is that grinding equipment is not cleaned and disinfected properly
in many cases. This is why we have seen mass recalls in recent years with
e-coli bacteria.
Now I will say from the perspective of a former beef producer this is
something to worry about. BSE is rarely a case of a single cow infected...
\ The US Ag dept. has been warned for years that not nearly enough
testing was/is being done to detect it. A total of 20,000 head were tested
this year, up over 50% from last year. This is still not enough animals
tested, as the EU has atested to repeatedly. Recent studies have also
pointed towards BSE being a naturally occuring gentic mutation resulting in
the prion which should be even more concerning to the general public...
Janet
A former beef producer in Niagara Falls, ON

"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
...
We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"
wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
.. .
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Well said Timmer. What we find ironic up here is that when our case was
detected according to the almighty US Ag Dept it was the end of the world.
Now that a case has been found on US soil it's "nothing to worry about"...
I hate to say it but karma has a way of coming back and biting one in the
butt. Every other world market has been reopened to Canadian beef *except*
the US, all thanks to the extensive lobbying on Capital Hill of the US
Cattlemens Assoc. Thanks to that lobbying the US cattle industry has been
enjoying almost record high prices at the expense of Canadian cattlemen who
are still facing loosing everything...
For those who don't know the facts millions of head of US born beef are
shipped into Canada as "feeders" to be fattened up on cheap Canadian wheat.
They are then either shipped back to the US for slaughter or slaughtered
here and shipped back as carcasses....
Janet

"T" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Ah well, its like the cow in Canada.. When everyone went nuts to avoid
Canadian Beef, it was barely noted that cow originally came from a US
producer, most likely where it originally contracted the BSE... How ironic
is it when the shoe is on the other foot.??.. I suspect the beef market in
the US is going to be in some trouble for the next year or so.

Timmer...


wrote in message
...
There is good reason to be cautious Jan. Prions (infectious proteins)
have been
shown to infect muscles like the tongue thru the nervous tissue
(http://www.nature.com/nsu/021230/021230-5.html). Muscles are loaded
with
nerves.
But more important is what is NOT KNOWN. For instance, a meat packer in
England got
the human form of BSE even tho he was a vegetarian. They think it was
from handling
the meat.
Most puzzling of all is the epidemic of "mad deer" in Wisconsin and
other
states.
Evidently wild game farms were allowed to feed recycled meat products to
their game
farm deer. These deer jumped the fence and mixed with the wild deer
population and
it spread. SPREAD???!!!! nobody seems to have a handle on how it
spread
from deer
to deer in the wild, altho wild deer could have been jumping into the
farm
and eating
contaminated feed. We do know prion disease has been present in wild
Elk
for a long
time.
http://www.wisc.edu/foodsafety/consu...sheets/BSE.htm
suggests that prions can be spread by blood. And you are correct,
normal
cooking
temps dont kill it, nor does freezing. Ingrid

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding
new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off
very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal
column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the
heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"

wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media
driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless
you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger,
steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you
may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
. ..
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found
out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I
purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is
gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more
to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it
for
a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

That is true information Jan... That is why the plants that processed the
cow that tested positive recalled lots of ground meat. The other potential
problem is that grinding equipment is not cleaned and disinfected properly
in many cases. This is why we have seen mass recalls in recent years with
e-coli bacteria.
Now I will say from the perspective of a former beef producer this is
something to worry about. BSE is rarely a case of a single cow infected...
\ The US Ag dept. has been warned for years that not nearly enough
testing was/is being done to detect it. A total of 20,000 head were tested
this year, up over 50% from last year. This is still not enough animals
tested, as the EU has atested to repeatedly. Recent studies have also
pointed towards BSE being a naturally occuring gentic mutation resulting in
the prion which should be even more concerning to the general public...
Janet
A former beef producer in Niagara Falls, ON

"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
...
We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"
wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
.. .
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

Well said Timmer. What we find ironic up here is that when our case was
detected according to the almighty US Ag Dept it was the end of the world.
Now that a case has been found on US soil it's "nothing to worry about"...
I hate to say it but karma has a way of coming back and biting one in the
butt. Every other world market has been reopened to Canadian beef *except*
the US, all thanks to the extensive lobbying on Capital Hill of the US
Cattlemens Assoc. Thanks to that lobbying the US cattle industry has been
enjoying almost record high prices at the expense of Canadian cattlemen who
are still facing loosing everything...
For those who don't know the facts millions of head of US born beef are
shipped into Canada as "feeders" to be fattened up on cheap Canadian wheat.
They are then either shipped back to the US for slaughter or slaughtered
here and shipped back as carcasses....
Janet

"T" wrote in message
hlink.net...
Ah well, its like the cow in Canada.. When everyone went nuts to avoid
Canadian Beef, it was barely noted that cow originally came from a US
producer, most likely where it originally contracted the BSE... How ironic
is it when the shoe is on the other foot.??.. I suspect the beef market in
the US is going to be in some trouble for the next year or so.

Timmer...


wrote in message
...
There is good reason to be cautious Jan. Prions (infectious proteins)
have been
shown to infect muscles like the tongue thru the nervous tissue
(http://www.nature.com/nsu/021230/021230-5.html). Muscles are loaded
with
nerves.
But more important is what is NOT KNOWN. For instance, a meat packer in
England got
the human form of BSE even tho he was a vegetarian. They think it was
from handling
the meat.
Most puzzling of all is the epidemic of "mad deer" in Wisconsin and
other
states.
Evidently wild game farms were allowed to feed recycled meat products to
their game
farm deer. These deer jumped the fence and mixed with the wild deer
population and
it spread. SPREAD???!!!! nobody seems to have a handle on how it
spread
from deer
to deer in the wild, altho wild deer could have been jumping into the
farm
and eating
contaminated feed. We do know prion disease has been present in wild
Elk
for a long
time.
http://www.wisc.edu/foodsafety/consu...sheets/BSE.htm
suggests that prions can be spread by blood. And you are correct,
normal
cooking
temps dont kill it, nor does freezing. Ingrid

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding
new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off
very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal
column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the
heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"

wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media
driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless
you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger,
steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you
may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
. ..
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found
out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I
purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is
gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more
to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it
for
a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

Top of the evening,
The Question I have is why only one cow in the Middle of Washington State?


"Ka30P" wrote in message
...

Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

Top of the evening,
The Question I have is why only one cow in the Middle of Washington State?


"Ka30P" wrote in message
...

Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

Clyde asked
The Question I have is why only one cow in the Middle of Washington State?

Latest word is the cow came from Canada
and there will be more.
(NOT to get in the middle of the strains
of "Blame Canada" being of Canadian birth
mineself, but that is what we are hearing
now)


ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

Ingrid is such a gem when it comes to stuff like this.

She gives an article URL and did any one read it or just assumed she knows
what she is talking about. The article states that the tongues of Hamsters
showed high level of prions when the abnormal prions were injected into the
Hamster's Brain. The article goes on to say, and I quote;

"This doesn't prove that cows with BSE have prion-loaded tongues, or that
eating these tongues could cause human disease, says Bessen, who works at
Creighton University in Omaha, Nebraska."

Also research has not shown the prions to be in nerve ends and ganglia of
muscle tissue of beef. This is usually found in the brains and the spinal
column nervous system. The article also pointed out that mice remained
healthy when injected with nerve tissue from Beef tongue.

All the article said was that because of what happened with Hamsters, it
would support further research in to this avenue, but nothing conclusive as
been found.

Let us all remember that one cow was found to have the disease and it was
found to have come from Canada two years ago. Also there is no human
response to the disease yet here in the US or Canada from what I have heard
in the form of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease.

Also something to remember is that when disease was found in Great Britain
in 1994 in humans by the end of the year only 8 people were infected and to
this day only supposition has been given as to how these people got it,
since there was no correlation between these eight people. Now as the
counting continued in 1999, five years later, the accumulated total of
people that succumbed to the disease were 24.

It would seem to me that if you want to get your underwear in a knot about
something why not start stamping your feet about the AID epidemic in Africa
where every third person in Central Africa has AIDS and in southern Africa
every 4th person has it. In provinces in and around South Africa there are
200,000 children orphaned by AIDS taking both Mother and Father. These chi
ldren have no one. There are no social services like here in the US or
Canada. The children have nothing or no one to help.

I find this thread interesting that there is all this pointing of fingers,
and some of Canadian members seem to be gleeful because is has happened here
in the US. If you wanted to be scared about a possible situation, think
what would happen in both the US, Canada and Europe if MCD got into the
Holstein herds. Holsteins produce 95% of the milk worldwide. Hey, milk
has proteins, if milk producing herds had to be destroyed it would devastate
both the US and Canada, not forgetting Europe.

Let's just hope that now something will we done, instead of just pointing
fingers and the making of political accusations.

Tom L.L.
----------------------------------------
wrote in message
...
There is good reason to be cautious Jan. Prions (infectious proteins)
have been
shown to infect muscles like the tongue thru the nervous tissue
(http://www.nature.com/nsu/021230/021230-5.html). Muscles are loaded with
nerves.
But more important is what is NOT KNOWN. For instance, a meat packer in
England got
the human form of BSE even tho he was a vegetarian. They think it was
from handling
the meat.
Most puzzling of all is the epidemic of "mad deer" in Wisconsin and other
states.
Evidently wild game farms were allowed to feed recycled meat products to
their game
farm deer. These deer jumped the fence and mixed with the wild deer
population and
it spread. SPREAD???!!!! nobody seems to have a handle on how it spread
from deer
to deer in the wild, altho wild deer could have been jumping into the farm
and eating
contaminated feed. We do know prion disease has been present in wild Elk
for a long
time.
http://www.wisc.edu/foodsafety/consu...sheets/BSE.htm
suggests that prions can be spread by blood. And you are correct, normal
cooking
temps dont kill it, nor does freezing. Ingrid

~ jan JJsPond.us wrote:

We've been getting some interesting info in our local paper regarding new
machinery called Advance Meat Recovery Systems. This scrapes meat off
very
close to the bone and supposedly can pick up some brain or spinal column
tissue where the prions of (BSE) Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy hangs
out. True, it's not in the muscle meat, but hamburger is definitely
suspect
w/hot dogs being more so. Heat doesn't kill it.... at least not the heat
temps we cook at.

They say the risk is low, but who wants to be that or 1 person? I'm not
scared enough to toss the meat I have in the freezer purchased prior to
Daisy going thru the system, but I'm not eating it, or any beef, till I
get
more answers. ~ jan


On Fri, 26 Dec 2003 23:54:19 -0600, "Tom La Bron"
wrote:

Of course, you must know that the majority of this scare is media
driven.
Mad Cow Disease (MCD) is transmitted trough nerve tissue and unless you
are
eating raw meat you won't get MCD. Plus there are no known cases of
anyone,
I repeat, anyone getting MCD from Muscle tissue, like hamburger, steaks,
etc.

Now if you are into eating Cow Brains in your scramble eggs then you may
be
at risk.

Tom L.L.
"~ jan JJsPond.us" wrote in message
. ..
Yup, and jj was in the now infamous Moses Lake, her home town, for
Christmas.

The internet is so nice though, I was able to go right to a website
with
the phone #s of the meat company. They where very nice and I found out
that
Death Daisy isn't in any of the hamburger-in-a-tube that I purchased.
Though I do worry that Daisy might have gone thru the grinder just
before
my burger did, so one pack that is dated well after her demise is
gonna
get
tossed. As always though, it appears our industry needs to do more to
clean
up its act, according to news articles coming out.

Everyone might want to consider buying their beef and freezing it for
a
month before consuming since it took 10 days for them to notify
consumers
after slaughter. We yet to be given information on how long it takes
from
slaughter to the dinner table. Perhaps someone here knows? ~ jan


On 25 Dec 2003 20:17:57 GMT, EROSPAM (Ka30P) wrote:
Well, drat!
Here SE WA is in the news and not a happy
story. The Mad Moo Cow came from a farm
not too far from where jj and k30a live.
And it looks like both jj and k30a had ground
beef from the plant that processed the poor
cow. All ground meat is off the shelves at
our stores, part of the recall.
Not that we're all that worried from what
we've been reading but sheesh!
What a way to waltz into Christmas!
And here I was teasing my CA brother about
his free range turkey at Thanksgiving! ;-)






ka30p
http://www.geocities.com/watergarden...dors/home.html

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website


See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.