In article ,
(Jaques d'Alltrades) wrote:

where presumably you accumulate your extensive
knowledge of hunting?

I acquired enough thank you the time the hunt trespassed through our
garden when I was a kid. The arrogant ****s may call their coats pink
but they ARE red. Their dogs (no I won't call them hounds) chased me and
our black labrador cross which suggest they're similarly colour blind.
The prats were too up themselves to apologise. Quite what they thought
they were doing crashing around a residential area at least half a mile
from open country I don't know but if it was educating the public about
the true nature of their "sport" they succeeded!

I would want to see them outlawed even if the fox was guaranteed to die
painlessly.

Steve Harris - Cheltenham - Real address steve AT netservs DOT com

In article ,
(Mary Fisher) wrote:

on horses with red

Pink.

When you call a colour that's clearly red "pink" we wonder if you're
also using a different definition of "cruel", etc.

Steve Harris - Cheltenham - Real address steve AT netservs DOT com

Bob Hobden6/12/03 5:16


"Tom wrote in message

That's what foxes do. Kill your stock and that's why they need to be
controlled in some way. The only fox control for the moment is hunting.


If you have a fox at your livestock you sit up all night and shoot it.
My neighbour did just this and shot 3 in a week, all the hunt does is
distribute the foxes round the countryside.
If you don't want to do this yourself there are plenty of sports hunters
out
there who will do it for you for nothing.

True, but as it's difficult, to say the least, to get a certificate for a
rifle for use in the open, I have a problem if someone tries to kill foxes
with a shotgun having come across one that had just died having been badly
wounded in the hind legs. It must have starved to death in agony over some
weeks.

I don't hunt, never have and I was very anti until I came to know people who
really do *know* the countryside and talked to them at length. I still
couldn't hunt but I do have a better understanding, now.
S0 - it is very difficult to get a clean shot at a fox, even if one has
permission to have a gun. Once shot, foxes go to ground and unlike dogs,
cannot lick wounds clean, so they die slowly and agonisingly from gangrene
or as said above, starvation.
Poisoning is hardly an option because not only is it a very slow, painful
death, how is one to be selective in its use over acres of wild or even
farmed, land? Foxes come into our garden - shall we poison the fox (if we
wanted to) or our dogs and the badgers that visit sometimes?
Last year, we picked up a badger which we think had been poisoned and then
hit by a car. We rang the RSPCA for help and after some garbled and
confusing exchange of info, I established that I was talking to a girl on a
London switchboard, asking me the "name of the street you're in". We were
in an un-named lane which is just one of the many rambling around here. She
suggested we 'pick it up and take it to a vet' - nul points for badger
knowledge, too. Using two other boxes, my husband managed to get the
badger into a crate and into the back of my Land Rover. That will show
anyone who knows anything about badgers, how very sick this one was. We
took it home, put it in a comfortable place in a shed, waited 60 minutes and
then my husband shot it. The poor brute was foaming at the mouth, had gone
blind and was in a terrible state of distress, barely breathing.
My fear is that this is what will happen to foxes in the future. No run,
chance to escape, get away, live to fight another day - just a horrible,
poisoned, gangrenous death.
I have no time for stopping earths, stag hunting, hare coursing but I do
have a better understanding of fox hunting, now.

(cross posting deleted)
--

Sacha
(remove the 'x' to email me)

Bob Hobden wrote in message
...

"Christina wrote in message
That's what foxes do. Kill your stock and that's why they need to be
controlled in some way. The only fox control for the moment is hunting.
If
I could ring up the local council and say, look, get this fox that is
killing my stock and they would do something about it, which they won't,
I
would be quite in favour of that, as an alternative.


Ah! But if they did react what method would they then use to kill said
fox/foxes and would it be guaranteed to be always more humane than hunting
with dogs?

--
Regards


They would send a person experienced in the control of rats, mice,
cockroaches, and wasp's nests, who would probably be useless in this case.
He would probably suggest live trapping and then go and release the fox
somewhere else "in the countryside" to cause another the same problem.

Tina

Tom Warner wrote in message
...

"Christina Websell" christina.websell@zoomdotcodotuk wrote in message
news:3fd0f442$0$13872$afc38c87@vipnews...


That's what foxes do. Kill your stock and that's why they need to be
controlled in some way. The only fox control for the moment is hunting.


If you have a fox at your livestock you sit up all night and shoot it.
My neighbour did just this and shot 3 in a week, all the hunt does is
distribute the foxes round the countryside.
If you don't want to do this yourself there are plenty of sports hunters
out
there who will do it for you for nothing.
Just enter "vermin" and "pest control" into a search engine.
Tom


I live trap and shoot the fox inside the trap. At least I did, until I
started to have a problem with my right eye a year or two ago. It's
surprising how finding stock slain during the daytime can make you angry
enough to do it. Now I bait the trap and if a fox is in it in the morning,
I ring up a private vermin controller whom I have used for a while, an old
countryman.

The trap is inside my hen run. If a fox is in my hen run, he is up to no
good. If he passes through my place on his way somewhere, then he won't go
near the trap and is in no danger at all from me. Since 1994 when I got
really cross about it, the tally is 40+
I'd much rather live and let live, but the foxes won't let me.
It's been quite successful, until I got complacent and didn't trap at all in
the winter of 2001/2. I shan't do that again, had a bad hit last November.

Tina

Mary Fisher wrote in message
...



"Tom Warner" wrote in message
...

"Christina Websell" christina.websell@zoomdotcodotuk wrote in message
news:3fd0f442$0$13872$afc38c87@vipnews...


That's what foxes do. Kill your stock and that's why they need to be
controlled in some way. The only fox control for the moment is
hunting.


If you have a fox at your livestock you sit up all night and shoot it.
My neighbour did just this and shot 3 in a week, all the hunt does is
distribute the foxes round the countryside.
If you don't want to do this yourself there are plenty of sports hunters
out
there who will do it for you for nothing.

It would be illegal in my garden.

Mary


How wide/long is your garden? How far is the furthest part of your garden
from your nearest neighbour?
It is impossible to miss a fox in a live catch trap with a 22 rifle pointing
downwards. Not a good idea though, to try it by staying up at night to shoot
a free one, those bullets can travel 2 miles if you miss.
You need my foxman, Mary, he's a dying breed.

Tina

On Sat, 6 Dec 2003 17:56:03 -0000, "Christina Websell"
christina.websell@zoomdotcodotuk wrote:


Tom Warner wrote in message
...

"Christina Websell" christina.websell@zoomdotcodotuk wrote in message
news:3fd0f442$0$13872$afc38c87@vipnews...


That's what foxes do. Kill your stock and that's why they need to be
controlled in some way. The only fox control for the moment is hunting.


If you have a fox at your livestock you sit up all night and shoot it.
My neighbour did just this and shot 3 in a week, all the hunt does is
distribute the foxes round the countryside.
If you don't want to do this yourself there are plenty of sports hunters
out
there who will do it for you for nothing.
Just enter "vermin" and "pest control" into a search engine.
Tom


I live trap and shoot the fox inside the trap. At least I did, until I
started to have a problem with my right eye a year or two ago. It's
surprising how finding stock slain during the daytime can make you angry
enough to do it. Now I bait the trap and if a fox is in it in the morning,
I ring up a private vermin controller whom I have used for a while, an old
countryman.

The trap is inside my hen run. If a fox is in my hen run, he is up to no
good. If he passes through my place on his way somewhere, then he won't go
near the trap and is in no danger at all from me. Since 1994 when I got
really cross about it, the tally is 40+
I'd much rather live and let live, but the foxes won't let me.
It's been quite successful, until I got complacent and didn't trap at all in
the winter of 2001/2. I shan't do that again, had a bad hit last November.

Tina

Lying fat slag, least I hope you're lying, I'd hate the thought of
vigilantes discovering what you were up to and knowing where you
lived, is your surname spelt correctly?






**********************************************




'You can't win 'em all.'
Lord Haw Haw.

Since I stopped donating money to CONservation hooligan charities
Like the RSPB, Woodland Trust and all the other fat cat charities
I am in the top 0.801% richest people in the world.
There are 5,951,930,035 people poorer than me

If you're really interested I am the 48,069,965
richest person in the world.

And I'm keeping the bloody lot.

So sue me.

http://www.globalrichlist.com/

Newsgroup ettiquette

1) Tell everyone the Trolls don't bother you.
2) Say you've killfiled them, yet continue to respond.
3) Tell other people off who repsond despite doing so yourself.
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10) Pretend you're a hard ******* when in fact you're
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11) Become the laughing stock of Usenet like Mabbet
12) Die of old age
13) Keep paying Dr Chartham his fees and hope one day you
will have a penis the girls can see.

---------------------------------------

"If you would'nt talk to them in a bar, don't *uckin' vote for them"

"Australia was not *discovered* it was invaded"
The Big Yin.

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...


True, but as it's difficult, to say the least, to get a certificate for a
rifle for use in the open, I have a problem if someone tries to kill
foxes
with a shotgun having come across one that had just died having been
badly
wounded in the hind legs. It must have starved to death in agony over
some
weeks.


You may have a problem with it, but the LACS, the Labour Animal Welfare
Group, and the majority of MPs do not. They wish to ban hunting with dogs,
and only hunting with dogs. Clearly other methods of control are by
definition less cruel because if they were more cruel the Government would
be breaking its own rules used to test the need for a ban based on cruelty
and utility. If there were no utility in killing foxes then killing foxes
would be banned as is killing badgers, if other methods of killing are more
cruel than hunting with dogs then these would have been considered for
bans - they were not.

I am therefore quite content to use snares and shotgun to control foxes and
I'm confident that it's no more cruel than necessary.

Michael Saunby

On Sat, 6 Dec 2003 19:12:44 -0000, "Michael Saunby"
wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...


True, but as it's difficult, to say the least, to get a certificate for a
rifle for use in the open, I have a problem if someone tries to kill
foxes
with a shotgun having come across one that had just died having been
badly
wounded in the hind legs. It must have starved to death in agony over
some
weeks.


You may have a problem with it, but the LACS, the Labour Animal Welfare
Group, and the majority of MPs do not. They wish to ban hunting with dogs,
and only hunting with dogs. Clearly other methods of control are by
definition less cruel because if they were more cruel the Government would
be breaking its own rules used to test the need for a ban based on cruelty
and utility. If there were no utility in killing foxes then killing foxes
would be banned as is killing badgers, if other methods of killing are more
cruel than hunting with dogs then these would have been considered for
bans - they were not.

I am therefore quite content to use snares and shotgun to control foxes and
I'm confident that it's no more cruel than necessary.

Stop dreaming saunby, we know you live on a ******** postage stamp
plot, you'd no more get a shotgun licence or trapping licence then the
chance of anyone taking you seriously, unless it was to accept the
fact you shag animals, that we all believe, still if all the women
down your way where like that fat old trout tina I think I might
prefer to shove a pig too, certainly the small talk would be better.


!





**********************************************




'You can't win 'em all.'
Lord Haw Haw.

Since I stopped donating money to CONservation hooligan charities
Like the RSPB, Woodland Trust and all the other fat cat charities
I am in the top 0.801% richest people in the world.
There are 5,951,930,035 people poorer than me

If you're really interested I am the 48,069,965
richest person in the world.

And I'm keeping the bloody lot.

So sue me.

http://www.globalrichlist.com/

Newsgroup ettiquette

1) Tell everyone the Trolls don't bother you.
2) Say you've killfiled them, yet continue to respond.
3) Tell other people off who repsond despite doing so yourself.
4) Continually talk about Trolls while maintaining
they're having no effect.
5) Publicly post killfile rules so the Trolls know
how to avoid them.
6) Make lame legal threats and other barrel scraping
manoeuvres when your abuse reports are ignored.
7) Eat vast quantities of pies.
8) Forget to brush your teeth for several decades.
9) Help a demon.local poster with their email while
secretly reading it.
10) Pretend you're a hard ******* when in fact you're
as bent as a roundabout.
11) Become the laughing stock of Usenet like Mabbet
12) Die of old age
13) Keep paying Dr Chartham his fees and hope one day you
will have a penis the girls can see.

---------------------------------------

"If you would'nt talk to them in a bar, don't *uckin' vote for them"

"Australia was not *discovered* it was invaded"
The Big Yin.

On Sat, 6 Dec 2003 19:12:44 -0000, "Michael Saunby"
wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...


True, but as it's difficult, to say the least, to get a certificate for a
rifle for use in the open, I have a problem if someone tries to kill
foxes
with a shotgun having come across one that had just died having been
badly
wounded in the hind legs. It must have starved to death in agony over
some
weeks.


You may have a problem with it, but the LACS, the Labour Animal Welfare
Group, and the majority of MPs do not. They wish to ban hunting with dogs,
and only hunting with dogs. Clearly other methods of control are by
definition less cruel because if they were more cruel the Government would
be breaking its own rules used to test the need for a ban based on cruelty
and utility. If there were no utility in killing foxes then killing foxes
would be banned as is killing badgers, if other methods of killing are more
cruel than hunting with dogs then these would have been considered for
bans - they were not.

I am therefore quite content to use snares and shotgun to control foxes and
I'm confident that it's no more cruel than necessary.

Stop dreaming saunby, we know you live on a ******** postage stamp
plot, you'd no more get a shotgun licence or trapping licence then the
chance of anyone taking you seriously, unless it was to accept the
fact you shag animals, that we all believe, still if all the women
down your way where like that fat old trout tina I think I might
prefer to shove a pig too, certainly the small talk would be better.


!





**********************************************




'You can't win 'em all.'
Lord Haw Haw.

Since I stopped donating money to CONservation hooligan charities
Like the RSPB, Woodland Trust and all the other fat cat charities
I am in the top 0.801% richest people in the world.
There are 5,951,930,035 people poorer than me

If you're really interested I am the 48,069,965
richest person in the world.

And I'm keeping the bloody lot.

So sue me.

http://www.globalrichlist.com/

Newsgroup ettiquette

1) Tell everyone the Trolls don't bother you.
2) Say you've killfiled them, yet continue to respond.
3) Tell other people off who repsond despite doing so yourself.
4) Continually talk about Trolls while maintaining
they're having no effect.
5) Publicly post killfile rules so the Trolls know
how to avoid them.
6) Make lame legal threats and other barrel scraping
manoeuvres when your abuse reports are ignored.
7) Eat vast quantities of pies.
8) Forget to brush your teeth for several decades.
9) Help a demon.local poster with their email while
secretly reading it.
10) Pretend you're a hard ******* when in fact you're
as bent as a roundabout.
11) Become the laughing stock of Usenet like Mabbet
12) Die of old age
13) Keep paying Dr Chartham his fees and hope one day you
will have a penis the girls can see.

---------------------------------------

"If you would'nt talk to them in a bar, don't *uckin' vote for them"

"Australia was not *discovered* it was invaded"
The Big Yin.

Pink. Except for the Berkeley Hunt, they wear yellow.

And the Exmoor amongst others - don't they wear green?

Could be - but I didn't know about them. I bow to your greater experience -
and I'm not being snide :-)

Mary

Pink. Except for the Berkeley Hunt, they wear yellow.

And the Exmoor amongst others - don't they wear green?

Could be - but I didn't know about them. I bow to your greater experience -
and I'm not being snide :-)

Mary

It would be illegal in my garden.

Mary


How wide/long is your garden? How far is the furthest part of your garden
from your nearest neighbour?

Right next to it.

It is impossible to miss a fox in a live catch trap with a 22 rifle
pointing
downwards.

I know.

Not a good idea though, to try it by staying up at night to shoot
a free one, those bullets can travel 2 miles if you miss.

That's probably why there are laws about having such weaponry close to the
highway in the inner city ...

You need my foxman, Mary, he's a dying breed.

Well, thanks for the offer, Tina, but we SEEM to have managed to have solved
our problem - at great expense of money and effort and time. Never mind,
it's working crossing everything.

No hens killed (not taken, not eaten, one can only assume for sport) in the
last nine (or thereabouts) months. The last fox (very mangy) was seen then,
it gave us an indignant look but we watched where it casually strolled off
and put up an effective and permanent barrier to it and its ilk.

Mary

Tina

Since 1994 when I got
really cross about it, the tally is 40+

Oh Tina ...

:-(((((


Mary

Mary Fisher wrote:
Not a good idea though, to try it by staying up at night to shoot
a free one, those bullets can travel 2 miles if you miss.

That's probably why there are laws about having such weaponry close
to the highway in the inner city ...

It only really illegal if you actually cause concern to anyone using the
public highway.
So in theory you can do as you please, just as long as no one complains.
For close shooting in a trap, nothing beats a .410. Not so long ago, some
folk used to tip hot wax in to the lead balls as to make an almost solid
"slug", these were especially effective against close range fox and would
never give an exit wound.

John


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