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#1
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
hey permie friends world wide?
lets cut the crap hey or should i say cut to the chase hey? what do we really want hey? permacultuer is about the best tool we have to encourage the common man(women) to think serious;y about how we treat this only planet we are ever gong to have to call home ok? SO LETS CUT THE CRAP HEY????????? lets get back to grass roots hey? lets keep race. creed colour, voting style, politics and all that other stuff people want and have the right to believe in hey. we others don't need to know whether you stand up to pee or squat to pee get the message? OK FOLKS LETS KEEP it to K.I.S.S ................OK Keep It Simple Stoopid!!!!!! (substitute silly if you are a seppo)[sorry just how i see it] ok getting the message hey? cut the crap hey get diplomas, courses, people making money and all that other SHIT out of something that is so simple and so close to the heart of those that SIMPLY want to preserve this one and only planet we are likely to have to live on. so my message to you FOOLS that want to turn as dollar get out while the getting IS good you are killing the best thing us common folk ever had. ok that means you pv in nsw and all your mates. i'm sure this is not what bill and his co-horts had in mind OK. so in short **** OFF unless your really want to save this planet and forget the bloody money ok! let that come later. you are really shitting me and lots of others like me off. and to you yuppies who f-u-c-k things up post this one around to your mates hey, please provide pictures as they just simply won't understand. so lets SUCK it and SEE hey. to all you genuine people i apologise but this has been a long time coming for the chardeney set ok. len proudly trying to tip the balance. -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#2
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
The message
from len gardener contains these words: ok getting the message hey? No, I have absolutely no idea what you're going on about. you are really shitting me and lots of others like me off. Speak for yourself. I haven't seen anything to complain about, or anybody else complaining. You certainly don't represent me. Altpc doesn't need another Lawrence laying down crazed foul-mouthed smutty edicts about who can post here. Janet |
#3
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
i'm not laying anything down janet and i'm no whomever, and this
response is about your standard. and the only thing i am addicted to is passing on this planet to the next generations in as good a condition as it can be. get eyes wide open all this selling pc and making money from it is killing the goose so to say. sometimes we need to get outside the square. this forum is a good example of the demise. len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#4
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
The message
from len gardener contains these words: i'm not laying anything down janet Telling people who post here to **** off and **** off isn't "laying it down"? and i'm no whomever, and this response is about your standard. What does that mean? get eyes wide open all this selling pc and making money from it is killing the goose so to say. Aren't you also trying to make money by selling something on this group? this forum is a good example of the demise. Rubbish. The demise of this forum had nothing whatever to do with the commercial side of permaculture. It happened because one idiot attempted to dictate the agenda of a newsgroup and drive out anyone who had different views from his; just as you're doing now. Janet |
#5
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
"len gardener" wrote in message
get eyes wide open all this selling pc and making money from it is killing the goose so to say. Len I'd have to say that your post came like a bolt from the blue. I can understand why you object to the "get certified, make money from pc" approach but then I have seen nothing like that here for ages. In fact all I have seen here for ages is smut from slimy porn posters - absolutely nothing to do with pc at at all. And as far as pc stuff goes here well it is more a matter of keeping things hanging there so that they can survive this bloody drought. I'm sick to death of hauling our shoer water to keep my plants alive. this forum is a good example of the demise. Well in tha case you might like to help by suggesting a few drought strategies and see if we can get this ng back from the smutters and pornsters.........hmmmmm? |
#6
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
g'day fran,
i didn't post this as a personal thing, i am involved in a few permy forums etc.,. and this news group up to a couple or so years ago was a vibrant forum of people sharing ideas and discussing what they were doing and how. that all stopped and in my opinion which i am voicing ok sorry it came out a bit strong, but there is an undercurrent of these diploma yuppies out there and all they see pc as is a way to a healthy bank account or some sort of notoriety. this group which was attracting new players which is needed to keep the flow going has slowly but surely ground to a halt, and the way i see largely due to this premise that unless you have a diploma and set up and institute you just aren't doing permaculture (this was not necessarily caused by posters in this group but surely it has been by other forums). yes i know that some sort of bad politics played it's part here as well and from where i see it not all that can be pointed one way there was lots of bad karma going on between what appeared to be factions. permaculture is people interested in the betterment of the planet, what their personal perferences or biases are do not count. now for those who do not believe in freedom of speech i stick to my opinion, so if the shoe fits you wear it, i'm afraid to me it looks like there are those that cannot handle the resposibilty that comes with the anonimity that the 'net guarantees. i have never been this vocal before but i hold the right to say it as i see it as everyone has that right. i feel for all our friends and otehrs who are sharing this drought, yes we ahve been lucky this last summer and gotten some good falls and some good falls alst year as well, and a lot of the practises we have incorporated here have maximised those falls of rain. we bought and lost lots of trees in the early stages there was just no way know we coyuld keep the water up to them, that has now truned around, but it was very distressing especially when not only water was short but so was money, not counting the tiem & effort involved. we too keep our plants going with our grey water and our night water, our main supply is tanks one is already shut down so we are on the last 2, we are hoping and praying for rain for one and all in the coming summer. the otehr down side that is disheartening is ok (no accolades sort) but in the time we have planted 500 trees just around us our estimate is that anywhere up to or mere than 1000+ trees have been pushed over or felled for the mill or the chippers, so when our mr jack thompson illustrious actor and tree ambassador says we are a bit behind the 8 ball boy have i got a message for, he mentions 8 million trees planted but no mention that maybe there is around 10 times that amount destroyed in the same period of time. if we don't start getting some common sense land management going in this country alone and pc was maybe still is if we can get it back to grass roots, the best way to instil that need in people, for if we don't in simple terms i can't see our rain situation returning to normal. take care len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#7
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
that's our janet,
tucked inside your comfort zone, not daring to come outside the square and taking cheep shots from behind the protective anonimity curtain that the 'net provides all of us. i don't recall using yours or anyones name in my post or should i say open letter, but you seem to revel in turning things into a personal afront. i will say 'if the shoe fits then you wear it'. len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#8
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
Anyone wanna biscuit ?
Ya can have a coffee too ...everyone except Len ... I'm putting you on a caffeine free diet mate :-) "len gardener" wrote in message ... hey permie friends world wide? lets cut the crap hey or should i say cut to the chase hey? what do we really want hey? permacultuer is about the best tool we have to encourage the common man(women) to think serious;y about how we treat this only planet we are ever gong to have to call home ok? SO LETS CUT THE CRAP HEY????????? lets get back to grass roots hey? lets keep race. creed colour, voting style, politics and all that other stuff people want and have the right to believe in hey. we others don't need to know whether you stand up to pee or squat to pee get the message? OK FOLKS LETS KEEP it to K.I.S.S ................OK Keep It Simple Stoopid!!!!!! (substitute silly if you are a seppo)[sorry just how i see it] ok getting the message hey? cut the crap hey get diplomas, courses, people making money and all that other SHIT out of something that is so simple and so close to the heart of those that SIMPLY want to preserve this one and only planet we are likely to have to live on. so my message to you FOOLS that want to turn as dollar get out while the getting IS good you are killing the best thing us common folk ever had. ok that means you pv in nsw and all your mates. i'm sure this is not what bill and his co-horts had in mind OK. so in short **** OFF unless your really want to save this planet and forget the bloody money ok! let that come later. you are really shitting me and lots of others like me off. and to you yuppies who f-u-c-k things up post this one around to your mates hey, please provide pictures as they just simply won't understand. so lets SUCK it and SEE hey. to all you genuine people i apologise but this has been a long time coming for the chardeney set ok. len proudly trying to tip the balance. -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#9
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
thanks pete,
yeh maybe i am drinking a little too much of it nowadays caffeine that is. len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#10
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
The message
from len gardener contains these words: now for those who do not believe in freedom of speech i stick to my opinion, Straw man. so if the shoe fits you wear it, i'm afraid to me it looks like there are those that cannot handle the resposibilty that comes with the anonimity that the 'net guarantees. i have never been this vocal before but i hold the right to say it as i see it as everyone has that right. Really? Don't forget that "everyone" includes me, those you disrespect in your post, and people who value permaculture courses, diplomas, and earning a living from teaching. Telling them to **** off and shut up, shows you're a blinkered hypocrite who doesn't give a damn about other peoples' freedom to express their opinion. Your appalling lie that I post anonymously to avoid responsibility for what I say, is just pitiful. A year back you emailed me to arrange for your friend's wife to visit me on her trip to Scotland; and you have spoken to her since she did. You know perfectly well that this my real name, and exactly where I live. Janet |
#11
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
The message
from len gardener contains these words: that's our janet, tucked inside your comfort zone, not daring to come outside the square and taking cheep shots from behind the protective anonimity curtain that the 'net provides all of us. Liar. There's nothing anonymous or behind the curtain about my posts and never has been. You're the one sounding off behind the protective curtain of altpc, aiming your bile at OTHER FORUMS safe in the knowledge that they won't see it here. i don't recall using yours or anyones name in my post or should i say open letter, but you seem to revel in turning things into a personal afront. When you said " **** OFF ...(..)you are really shitting me and lots of others like me off", you intended the targets of your views to believe that other users of this group share that opinion. Other users of altpc includes me. For you to behave like that while pretending to represent other people, is dishonest, and an affront to all of us. Freedom of speech applies equally to all, Len. That includes me and anyone else who disagrees with you, and people who want to discuss aspects of permaculture that don't appeal to you. Freedom of speech does not mean a license to abuse people and it does not mean that you can dictate who posts in this group. Janet. |
#12
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
"Pete" wrote in message
Now that couldn't be Wibbers the fisher person could it? If it is, then the rumours that you were swallowed by a whale must have been exaggerated. |
#13
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
"len gardener" wrote in message
g'day fran, i didn't post this as a personal thing, i am involved in a few permy forums etc.,. and this news group up to a couple or so years ago was a vibrant forum of people sharing ideas and discussing what they were doing and how. Yes it was that all stopped and in my opinion which i am voicing ok sorry it came out a bit strong, but there is an undercurrent of these diploma yuppies out there and all they see pc as is a way to a healthy bank account or some sort of notoriety. this group which was attracting new players which is needed to keep the flow going has slowly but surely ground to a halt, and the way i see largely due to this premise that unless you have a diploma and set up and institute you just aren't doing permaculture (this was not necessarily caused by posters in this group but surely it has been by other forums). Len, the group here has ground to a halt BUT none of the regular posters here ever had a permie cert, or ever (from what I remember) sought to make money from pc. I don't know what is going on in other forums and what is happening there may be the reason why you are cross now and posted such a heavy comment. There has been no pc activity here in this newsgroup from the regulars for so long now that you couldn't possibly still be cross about anything that happened in the dim past. I still can't understand why we all got a blast from you in this newsgroup. Obviously there are a few of us old regulars who are still hanging around here and checking in here regularly. It would seem that Pete, Tara, Janet and myself are all lurking. Because we are all still checking this ng regularly that should tell you that we are still interested in both pc and this newsgroup. We (Janet, Pete, Tara and myself) didn't do or say anything nasty to you but suddenly you have given us a serve whether we deserved it or not. Janet got cross with you in response to your post. She hadn't posted here for so long that nothing she previously posted could have caused you to post what you did. Has something happened that upset you in another forum? Or are you just shitty with life generally? I don't think we deserved your post. We were all lurking here very very quietly. We weren't posting so how could you be cross with a bunch of lurkers? Why don't you have that cup of coffee that Pete won't give you and have a biscuit and then post and tell us all why you are really shitty. No-one here has ever claimed to be interested in money or certificates or looked down on anyone for being interested in pc. We have had a go at people who have lied but then I don't recall ever thinking that you had ever lied. yes i know that some sort of bad politics played it's part here as well and from where i see it not all that can be pointed one way there was lots of bad karma going on between what appeared to be factions. Yes Len but that is ancient history. What is up now? if we don't start getting some common sense land management going in this country alone and pc was maybe still is if we can get it back to grass roots, the best way to instil that need in people, for if we don't in simple terms i can't see our rain situation returning to normal. Now ain't that the truth! |
#14
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
g'day fran,
it wasn't directed an any particular person in the group, there are so few of us who lurk here now anyway. but when you get involved around the 'net and try to do any research all you get is certificates, diplomas, institutes and the call for it to be a uni degree and a senior school curriculum. and it all spells money and they are not promoting pc as something everyone can do to some degree you along with pete and others i hope we can count ourselves in as well are out there doing it and untill all that factional garbage this group was full of help and ideas going back and forth but now that the only thrust is from those chardinay yuppies looking for an easy buck. but please fran i think you and pete and others would know that i did not aim this personaly, just as others have said and what the feed back i get from the common man pc is rapidly turning into a here today gone tomorrrow yuppie fad. i love sharing ideas and experiences and as you would know am not known for getting into personal afronts like some others live for. i'm with fukuoka he says plant the trees/plants and the rain will come, i believe that is our only hope to reversing what is occuring trouble is it won't happen over night it took us 200 hundred years to get to this stage so guess it is going to take us some of that time to get some of the way back. so if this form of pc that is gets out of the reach of the common man the grass roots people then it will lose it's relevence and change will never come or when people realise that they can't afford to buy food then it will be too late. like i said we alone have planted 500 trees in this area on our block but it is a mere spit in the bucket to what is ripped out of the place. people are of the opinion if they own it then they can do what they like with it. i think if we don't get more responsible and say ok we are the custodians of these resources then the situation cannot change. so if we get a benefit from selling and our land is more attractive due to pc principlas well so be it that to us shows others that pc is tangible and beneficial, just imagine if everyone who bought land like tis could see those benefits and turn them into a benefit for them thibngs would start to change, but that is not about to happen anytime soon. and for discenteres just do a search under pc and see what you get lots and lots of certificates and diplomas, none of here is how simple pc can be so get started today. pc is a mind set not a design course. take care len snipped -- happy gardening 'it works for me it could work for you,' "in the end ya' gotta do what ya' gotta do" but consider others and the environment http://members.optusnet.com.au/~gardenlen1/ my e/mail addies have spam filters you should know what to delete before you send. |
#15
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open letter to all perma-culturists who realy care - back 2 grass roots
"Fran" wrote in message
... "Pete" wrote in message Now that couldn't be Wibbers the fisher person could it? I think it's me .... Yes it is I just checked wiv the wife If it is, then the rumours that you were swallowed by a whale must have been exaggerated. The whale would have to be pretty big these days cos the good life is erm catchin up with me ...if ya know what I mean... |
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