#include

If it is an offence to allow a dog to foul, without the owner clearing
it up, why is socially acceptable to allow a cat to do the same with no
responsibility on the owner to clear the mess?

As I understand it a dog is a domestic animal and a cat is a wild
animal. If you've ever lived with both you'll understand the
difference

Rich
--
Richard Parker

Occam was never the target of a conspiracy.

In message , Richard Parker
wrote
#include

If it is an offence to allow a dog to foul, without the owner clearing
it up, why is socially acceptable to allow a cat to do the same with no
responsibility on the owner to clear the mess?

As I understand it a dog is a domestic animal and a cat is a wild
animal. If you've ever lived with both you'll understand the
difference


This sounds like a get out clause for irresponsible cat owners.

Continually treating your cat as a kitten makes it domestic and safe.
Without this it would be wild and you would not be able to get within
ten feet of it without protective clothing.

Even by saying that a pet cat is wild does not prevent responsible
ownership. Those who let pet cats s**t in gardens belonging to others
are not responsible owners and should perhaps be barred from owning any
animals.

Those antisocial individuals that let their pet cats roam shouldn't be
surprised, and shouldn't complain, if other treat their vermin in the
same uncaring way as they do.

--
Alan
news2006 {at} amac {dot} f2s {dot} com

On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 21:54:07 +0000, Alan put finger to keyboard and
typed:

In message e.net,
Mark Goodge wrote
On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 20:21:01 +0000, Alan put finger to keyboard and
typed:

In message , Brian Watson
wrote


Cats roam: get used to it.

Why? I shouldn't have to tolerate other peoples uncontrolled vermin.

For the same reason that the rest of us have to tolerate your
ill-considered opinions:

Do I detect that you are one of those totally irresponsible people that
owns a cat and lets it roam?

No; I'm a responsible cat owner who understands that cats like (and
need) to be given a certain amount of freedom.

Tell me, whose responsibility is it to keep pigeons out of your
garden? Or rats, or blackbirds?

Mark
--
Visit: http://www.MotorwayServices.info - read and share comments and opinons
Listen: http://www.goodge.co.uk/files/dweeb.mp3 - you'll love it!

Broadback wrote:
Bob Hobden wrote:
I didn't understand this comment..."what they don't eat they dig up!"
What do you mean?
Cats don't dig up anything deliberately and the only things they eat in a
garden are mice, rats, and birds.

Oops, bad writing, that comment referred to the rabbits, not the cats!

Oh ... I too thought you were refering to something else, the hedgehogs!

On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 21:54:07 +0000, Alan wrote
(in message ):

Responsible pet ownership is socially acceptable but allowing a cat to
roam and use someone else's front garden as a pet lavatory is not.

Hi- 'scuse me for butting in but this got my attention.

Do you mean that cat owners should keep their cats indoors and only allow
them out on leads, or something along those lines?

If that isn't it, what means of preventing them roaming do you suggest?

--
VX (remove alcohol for email)

"Alan" wrote in message
news snip
If it is an offence to allow a dog to foul, without the owner clearing
it up, why is socially acceptable to allow a cat to do the same with no
responsibility on the owner to clear the mess?

English law.
Means that a dog had to be licenced. (;icence abolished in 1987) but the law
still stands,
owner is held responsible (in law) for animals behaviour.
Car hits a dog - must be reported to police.
Dog fouls path - owner is liable
Dog roams free - Council have a duty to trap it and penalise the owner.

English law defines a cat as a wild animal.
Therefore there is no legal responsibility from the owner.

Social acceptance is a whole different thing.
It was socially acceptable to send children to work in coal mines.
It was socially unacceptable to be seen drunk in public.

Now society has changed.
Acceptance has changed.

I mark my garden as a childrens play area, and in small print I point out
that
any animal caught fouling the area will be subjected to the full weight of
the law.
This means that cats will be trapped and shipped off to the cats protection
league.
Dogs to the local dog rehoming service. Stray/loose dogs are reported to the
council dog warden.
In six years the number of stray dogs on the estate has dropped from over a
dozen
living wild to the occasional animal which has obviously broken free for the
day.

IMNHO there is no such thing as a proven deterrent.

Dave

In article m, VX
writes

Hi- 'scuse me for butting in but this got my attention.

Do you mean that cat owners should keep their cats indoors and only allow
them out on leads, or something along those lines?

If that isn't it, what means of preventing them roaming do you suggest?



Well if cat owners argue that their pets must be allowed to roam and
'visit' next door's garden how come the same cat owners don't afford dog
owners the same facility?

I have to say they don't come in my back garden but then the dogs would
deter them presumably. However the people who have rented the house next
door have a HUGE black and white cat that has been relieving itself in
my front garden for the last few weeks. As a non-cat owner I can't say
I'm very happy about this and wouldn't dream on allowing my dogs to do
this on anyone else's land, though I would not like to actually harm a
cat.

To keep the thread helpful what do I have to do to 'deter' the cat from
depositing in my flower beds? can I spray something or will it be
attracted to a particular soil such as newly dug etc?

I guess dog and cat owners will never see eye to eye as it seems that
there's one law for one type of pet and another for a different pet.

It's okay to decide that cats are 'wild' in nature but surely 'wild'
animals shouldn't be kept in homes?


janet
--
Janet Tweedy
Amersham Gardening Association
http://www.amersham-gardening.net

Janet Tweedy wrote:
To keep the thread helpful what do I have to do to 'deter' the cat from
depositing in my flower beds? can I spray something or will it be
attracted to a particular soil such as newly dug etc?

There's many things you can do - there's silent roar pellets made out
of tiger dung. They're useless to my cats and any of the 12 cats in my
streets alone. There's those scented lemon stick - they're useless. My
dogs chew them. There's pepper/chilli - eventually the rain wash it off
and the cats return. There's twigs that I put around newly planted
seedlings - it works but eventually the sticks get moved (wind, rot ...
pixies).

As Monty said, the only deterrent to cats is a Jack Russell )

I guess dog and cat owners will never see eye to eye as it seems that
there's one law for one type of pet and another for a different pet.

I have both, cats and dogs. I collect my dogs mess at the water park we
go and any other mess in my street (which is not my dogs) but I don't
want my kids and visitors to bring it to my house. I also don't want
people thinking it's my dogs. Cats - I haven't a clue where they go,
but for the amount I get around my apple tree, amongst my grasses and
usually anywhere I just dug, they go in my garden which I deal with
myself. However - any cats on my property get to be chased by one of my
dogs because I usually open the door and say 'go and get the cat'.

It's okay to decide that cats are 'wild' in nature but surely 'wild'
animals shouldn't be kept in homes?

Cats are domesticated. This 'wild' thing is ridiculous. I have one of
my cat fetching bits of wires and it brings it back. My other cat go
for walks as far as he can until we tell him to go back home. They
behave like my dogs. If they use next door garden, I am entirely happy
with the neighbours to deal with it as they wish. Though don't hurt the
cats. It's cruel. I go to one lady at the corner who has told me my
Lilly enjoys her wooden bench in the sun. I often clean mess I see for
her, but that might not even be my Lilly doing it.

We must control our animals. If your cats go next door expect them to
be scared off, screamed at, watered with pistols (which I do too on my
cats) when they fool your garden. It's only fair. If you don't want
this to happen to your cats, keep them indoors or don't have cats at
all.

"Janet Tweedy" wrote in message
...

To keep the thread helpful what do I have to do to 'deter' the cat from
depositing in my flower beds? can I spray something or will it be
attracted to a particular soil such as newly dug etc?

Lemon juice from a Jif lemon, as I suggested a few days ago.
--
Brian
"Fight like the Devil, die like a gentleman."

"Brian Watson" wrote in news:488l88Fi9et1U1
@individual.net:

"Janet Tweedy" wrote in message
...

To keep the thread helpful what do I have to do to 'deter' the cat from
depositing in my flower beds? can I spray something or will it be
attracted to a particular soil such as newly dug etc?

Lemon juice from a Jif lemon, as I suggested a few days ago.

http://tinyurl.com/n4ctw

Established in 2005, the fences keep everything out. These were
primarily designed to dissuade white tail deer.

Also works well against cats, rabbits, skunks, raccoons, and dogs.

Presently I have another wire at the top of the posts sporting a
1/2 inch white horizontal PVC pipe as a deterrent against deer
inclined to jump over the fence, an easy hop for a larger adult.

Cats have discovered that I keep a pile of loose top soil at one
corner of my property, and avail themselves of that pile as their
private haven. The cats aren't mine but belong to my only nearby
neighbor. In exchange they do a very good job of keeping the
local field mouse and shrew population at very low levels. What
they miss is caught and eaten by ravens which regularly patrol
my meadow next the house.

Cats seem to prefer kitty litter (also sold to garages as oil
dry.) If I had a small place with a cat problem I'd put out and
maintain a kitty litter box under small roof (to keep the rain
out) as a compromise with neighborhood cats. Anger, animosity
and chemicals don't do a very good job of keeping them away
in the long term.

"Sheldon Harper" wrote

Established in 2005, the fences keep everything out. These were
primarily designed to dissuade white tail deer.

Also works well against cats, rabbits, skunks, raccoons, and dogs.

snipped

I love it when the racoons return to URG :~))))
Jenny

PS Looks like a good fence. I shall be needing one like that myself...........

"someone here" wrote in message
.uk...

"Alan" wrote in message
news snip
If it is an offence to allow a dog to foul, without the owner clearing
it up, why is socially acceptable to allow a cat to do the same with no
responsibility on the owner to clear the mess?

English law.
Means that a dog had to be licenced. (;icence abolished in 1987) but the
law
still stands,
owner is held responsible (in law) for animals behaviour.
Car hits a dog - must be reported to police.
Dog fouls path - owner is liable
Dog roams free - Council have a duty to trap it and penalise the owner.

English law defines a cat as a wild animal.
Therefore there is no legal responsibility from the owner.

Social acceptance is a whole different thing.
It was socially acceptable to send children to work in coal mines.
It was socially unacceptable to be seen drunk in public.

Now society has changed.
Acceptance has changed.

I mark my garden as a childrens play area, and in small print I point out
that
any animal caught fouling the area will be subjected to the full weight of
the law.
This means that cats will be trapped and shipped off to the cats
protection
league.
Dogs to the local dog rehoming service. Stray/loose dogs are reported to
the
council dog warden.

wandering kid sent to the local poor house?

rob

In article .com, La
Puce writes
myself. However - any cats on my property get to be chased by one of my
dogs because I usually open the door and say 'go and get the cat'.

That's a dangerous thing to do nowadays. I know one of mine would chase
a cat, (she's killed rats, mice, squirrels, the odd bird and rabbit )
but I would never actively encourage her to do so.
By so doing, if anyone could prove it, you could, in theory, be charged
under the 'encouraging your dog to hunt' laws.

Or so I have been led to believe by two people who own dogs and know
something about legal issues.

--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

In article , Brian Watson
writes

"Janet Tweedy" wrote in message
...

To keep the thread helpful what do I have to do to 'deter' the cat from
depositing in my flower beds? can I spray something or will it be
attracted to a particular soil such as newly dug etc?

Lemon juice from a Jif lemon, as I suggested a few days ago.


Tried that but didn't work on this new cat from next door Brian. Don't
mind it crossing the front flowers beds, just don't want it leaving
anything as a calling card!

Jeyes fluid on the doorstep deterred a male cat that used to spray near
it several years ago but it might kill the plants
--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk

In article , Sheldon Harper
writes

http://tinyurl.com/n4ctw

Established in 2005, the fences keep everything out. These were
primarily designed to dissuade white tail deer.

Hmmm it doesn't look as strong as stock fencing that I have on the
inside of my 8 foot hawthorn hedges which might lead one to presume that
it will rot in a couple of years. Fine if it's free-standing like the
one on the site but you don't want to have to fasten fencing into
hawthorn hedging too often

--
Janet Tweedy
Dalmatian Telegraph
http://www.lancedal.demon.co.uk