I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type structure
and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own thing.
3. Pumpkins and other cucurbits planted too close not realising their
ability to grow.
3. Onions planted late and not weeded so they got large spring onions in
effect as they grew to the light.
4. Tender plants bought from Garden Centres and planted immediately, much
too early. (they were very lucky we had no late frosts here) The very end of
May beginning of June is early enough.
5. Runner Beans planted up bamboo canes that are too short and again not
strong enough to take the weight and wind without sturdier help (wood or
steel poles) so they all collapse.
6. No compost bin made so weeds are thrown away on a spare plot.
7. No manure used (as far as we could see) so plot will suffer in the long
term.
8. Too much of one thing planted, probably used the whole packet of lettuce
seeds in one go, so most go to waste.


--
Regards
Bob H
17mls W. of London.UK

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type structure
and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own
thing.
3. Pumpkins and other cucurbits planted too close not realising their
ability to grow.
3. Onions planted late and not weeded so they got large spring onions in
effect as they grew to the light.
4. Tender plants bought from Garden Centres and planted immediately, much
too early. (they were very lucky we had no late frosts here) The very end
of May beginning of June is early enough.
5. Runner Beans planted up bamboo canes that are too short and again not
strong enough to take the weight and wind without sturdier help (wood or
steel poles) so they all collapse.
6. No compost bin made so weeds are thrown away on a spare plot.
7. No manure used (as far as we could see) so plot will suffer in the long
term.
8. Too much of one thing planted, probably used the whole packet of
lettuce seeds in one go, so most go to waste.


I've done several of those, especially the first year I got the plot. I
expect you did a couple yourself, no?

But hey, the man who never made a mistake, never made anything.

Steve

Martin wrote:
and dumping rubbish on the communal compost heap

and not locking the gates when leaving ...

In reply to Bob Hobden ) who wrote this in
, I, Marvo, say :

I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type
structure and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own
thing. 3. Pumpkins and other cucurbits planted too close not realising
their
ability to grow.
3. Onions planted late and not weeded so they got large spring onions
in effect as they grew to the light.
4. Tender plants bought from Garden Centres and planted immediately,
much too early. (they were very lucky we had no late frosts here) The
very end of May beginning of June is early enough.
5. Runner Beans planted up bamboo canes that are too short and again
not strong enough to take the weight and wind without sturdier help
(wood or steel poles) so they all collapse.
6. No compost bin made so weeds are thrown away on a spare plot.
7. No manure used (as far as we could see) so plot will suffer in the
long term.
8. Too much of one thing planted, probably used the whole packet of
lettuce seeds in one go, so most go to waste.

Plus tomato canes miles too short for climbers, not anticipating the weather
making the plants grow to nearly six feet! They are still producing fine
tomatoes though, perhaps they like laying on the ground? Perhaps the only
reason why tomatoes are climbed up long poles is "that's the way we've
always done it".

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 09:51:26 +0100, "shazzbat"
wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type structure
and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own
thing.
3. Pumpkins and other cucurbits planted too close not realising their
ability to grow.
3. Onions planted late and not weeded so they got large spring onions in
effect as they grew to the light.
4. Tender plants bought from Garden Centres and planted immediately, much
too early. (they were very lucky we had no late frosts here) The very end
of May beginning of June is early enough.
5. Runner Beans planted up bamboo canes that are too short and again not
strong enough to take the weight and wind without sturdier help (wood or
steel poles) so they all collapse.
6. No compost bin made so weeds are thrown away on a spare plot.
7. No manure used (as far as we could see) so plot will suffer in the long
term.
8. Too much of one thing planted, probably used the whole packet of
lettuce seeds in one go, so most go to waste.


I've done several of those, especially the first year I got the plot. I
expect you did a couple yourself, no?

Well exactly - I'm afraid I read the list as people being "told off".
There is a way to write these sorts of things which would be much more
helpful and supportive rather than condemnatory. It is unrealistic to
expect brand new allotment gardeners to avoid mistakes and to have
garnered all relevant experience. Also who's to say there is only one
method of doing something - the GW programme on allotments showed a wide
range of practices being used and yet everyone seemed to be able to
grown the stuff they wanted. Isn't that the point?

I don't have an allotment but I worked on my Dad's two allotments for a
number of years so I have a little bit of knowledge and experience
before I get "jumped on" as a "know nothing" person.

But hey, the man who never made a mistake, never made anything.

*ding*
--
Paul C

I've done several of those, especially the first year I got the plot. I
expect you did a couple yourself, no?

Well exactly - I'm afraid I read the list as people being "told off".
There is a way to write these sorts of things which would be much more
helpful and supportive rather than condemnatory. It is unrealistic to
expect brand new allotment gardeners to avoid mistakes and to have
garnered all relevant experience. Also who's to say there is only one
method of doing something - the GW programme on allotments showed a wide
range of practices being used and yet everyone seemed to be able to
grown the stuff they wanted. Isn't that the point?

I don't have an allotment but I worked on my Dad's two allotments for a
number of years so I have a little bit of knowledge and experience
before I get "jumped on" as a "know nothing" person.

But hey, the man who never made a mistake, never made anything.

*ding*
--
Paul C

I agree with Paul, here. I'm still waiting for my first allotment (any
day now) & started reading this thread with some anticipation but it
seems to have decended into a rather unpleasant "tut-tut" listing.

If those more experienced allotmenteers have some tips to offer or
common pitfalls to avoid I'll be extremely grateful, but I'm sure that
the selfish behaviour listed above is in no way dictated by the length
of time someone has had an allotment - rather more due to the sort of
person they are...

Barry

Uncle Marvo writes

Plus tomato canes miles too short for climbers, not anticipating the weather
making the plants grow to nearly six feet! They are still producing fine
tomatoes though, perhaps they like laying on the ground? Perhaps the only
reason why tomatoes are climbed up long poles is "that's the way we've
always done it".

I was looking at a small field of tomatoes in Greece last week - not a
stake in sight, just all scrambling on the ground. And this on an island
famed for the quality of its tomatoes.

It might be that the tomato's natural habit is to scramble over low
shrubs (it doesn't have the apparatus for serious climbing). But isn't
it able to put out roots from stems? - that would suggest it naturally
scrambles over soil.

I presume we stake them because they take up less space and are easier
to pick.



--
Kay

Paul Corfield writes
On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 09:51:26 +0100, "shazzbat"
wrote:

I've done several of those, especially the first year I got the plot. I
expect you did a couple yourself, no?

Well exactly - I'm afraid I read the list as people being "told off".
There is a way to write these sorts of things which would be much more
helpful and supportive rather than condemnatory. It is unrealistic to
expect brand new allotment gardeners to avoid mistakes and to have
garnered all relevant experience. Also who's to say there is only one
method of doing something - the GW programme on allotments showed a wide
range of practices being used and yet everyone seemed to be able to
grown the stuff they wanted. Isn't that the point?

One of the things that puts me off an allotment (although I did have one
for several years) is the thought of public scrutiny of my gardening
practices! I know that I don't grow any of my stuff to the optimum
standard - but I put in to it as much as I wish to, and get results that
please me and more than justify the effort I've put in.

Most of my learning has been practical - don't follow accepted advice,
see what happens, and you learn. Simply follow advice, and you may
produce good crops, but you don't learn anything. For some people, the
good crop is most important, for others, it's the learning that's most
important.
--
Kay

In reply to K ) who wrote this in
, I, Marvo, say :

Uncle Marvo writes

Plus tomato canes miles too short for climbers, not anticipating the
weather making the plants grow to nearly six feet! They are still
producing fine tomatoes though, perhaps they like laying on the
ground? Perhaps the only reason why tomatoes are climbed up long
poles is "that's the way we've always done it".

I was looking at a small field of tomatoes in Greece last week - not a
stake in sight, just all scrambling on the ground. And this on an
island famed for the quality of its tomatoes.

It might be that the tomato's natural habit is to scramble over low
shrubs (it doesn't have the apparatus for serious climbing). But isn't
it able to put out roots from stems? - that would suggest it naturally
scrambles over soil.

I presume we stake them because they take up less space and are easier
to pick.

I presume that too. I was amazed at the tastiness of the crop though, they
were like real tomatoes. Haven't had anything like it in years. But then I
sort of guessed that the weather this year meant all tomatoes were like
that.

Which is true?

Probably both.

"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type structure
and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own
thing.

That's nothing. Tomatoes were first introduced into the UK in the 16th
century from South America. However up until the early 1800's they were
regarded as poisonous and of decorative interest only*. Both on account of
their membership of the nightshade family and maybe (guess) the fact that
they're not eaten by any birds or animals. In the UK at least.


michael adams

*unlike in Italy and Greece apparently

--
Regards
Bob H
17mls W. of London.UK

Snip

I agree with Paul, here. I'm still waiting for my first allotment (any
day now) & started reading this thread with some anticipation but it
seems to have decended into a rather unpleasant "tut-tut" listing.

If those more experienced allotmenteers have some tips to offer or
common pitfalls to avoid I'll be extremely grateful, but I'm sure that
the selfish behaviour listed above is in no way dictated by the length
of time someone has had an allotment - rather more due to the sort of
person they are...

Ok, to be fair, Bob did say his aim was to help, and I'm certainly not going
to have a go at him,. I just have a more relaxed attitude. When you look
round our allotment site, the plots range from practically jungle to neatly
manicured with not weed in sight. A lot depends on your circumstances. One
of ours is retired and spends almost every day on his plot, openly admitting
he goes there to get away from 'er indoors. Some others work full time and
squeeze in an hour or two when they can.
Make mistakes and don't worry about them, for two reasons -

1- It's just gardening, nobody dies.

2.- When you've dug it up and eaten it or composted it, the evidence is
gone.

And since you asked for tips to offer and pitfalls to avoid, here are a
couple.-

Grow small amounts of lots of different things, if you grow loads of one
thing, you get a massive surplus which probably won't keep and has to be
given away or dumped. Also, If you concentrate on one thing and that thing
has a bad year, you're toast. Every year you will have successes and
failures. You will learn with experience, we all are.

Ask the other allotmenteers what grows well in the soil you've got, and what
doesn't. there's no reason you shouldn't benefit from the mistakes they made
twenty years ago.

Avoid trying to do too much too soon, you just get disheartened. It's much
better to have half a plot of weeds and a couple of rows of veg than a plot
with no weeds but no crops.


I hope you get your allotment soon and it gives you as much satisfaction as
mine gives me.

And finally, remember there are three things you should do whenever you
visit your allotment -


1 A bit of gardening.

2 A bit of talking.

3 A bit of nothing.

Steve
See our plot (and admire our weeds) here-

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/steveandmaggiesplot

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 11:58:42 +0100, Janet Baraclough
wrote:

The message
from Paul Corfield contains these words:

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 09:51:26 +0100, "shazzbat"
wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...

Well exactly - I'm afraid I read the list as people being "told off".

How could Bob be telling people off for their mistakes? This is a
newsgroup, not his allotment. He makes it clear he's posting tips for
people on this group.

But it comes across as smug - sorry but that is the tone I pick up from
the way it is written.

There is a way to write these sorts of things which would be much more
helpful and supportive rather than condemnatory.

Pot, kettle, black.

A not unexpected response from you. Are you capable of not making such
remarks?
--
Paul C

"Janet Baraclough" wrote in message
...
The message
from "Bob Hobden" contains these words:

I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

(snip)

I would add, rotovating the whole thing then not being able to keep up
with planting and weeding the whole area.

Janet

Indeed. I would have thought there were rules against the use of powered
machinery on allotments - which of necessity would have to be petrol-driven
and thus even noisier still. But apparently not.


michael adams

....

On 14/9/06 14:41, in article , "michael adams"
wrote:


"Bob Hobden" wrote in message
...
I though I'd mention this to help any budding allotment growers.

Seen on our site this year...
1. Tomatoes not staked sufficiently strongly for the more exposed open
allotment site so they collapse when covered in fruit, it rains adding
weight and it's windy. Make a sturdy wooden/steel goal post type structure
and tie the canes to that.
2. Indeterminate Tomatoes not pinched out and allowed to do their own
thing.

That's nothing. Tomatoes were first introduced into the UK in the 16th
century from South America. However up until the early 1800's they were
regarded as poisonous and of decorative interest only*. Both on account of
their membership of the nightshade family and maybe (guess) the fact that
they're not eaten by any birds or animals. In the UK at least.

You're kidding about birds not eating them, aren't you?! Blackbirds
especially seem to go mad for them!

--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/

On 14/9/06 12:35, in article
, "Bazzler"
wrote:

I've done several of those, especially the first year I got the plot. I
expect you did a couple yourself, no?

Well exactly - I'm afraid I read the list as people being "told off".
There is a way to write these sorts of things which would be much more
helpful and supportive rather than condemnatory. It is unrealistic to
expect brand new allotment gardeners to avoid mistakes and to have
garnered all relevant experience. Also who's to say there is only one
method of doing something - the GW programme on allotments showed a wide
range of practices being used and yet everyone seemed to be able to
grown the stuff they wanted. Isn't that the point?

I don't have an allotment but I worked on my Dad's two allotments for a
number of years so I have a little bit of knowledge and experience
before I get "jumped on" as a "know nothing" person.

But hey, the man who never made a mistake, never made anything.

*ding*
--
Paul C

I agree with Paul, here. I'm still waiting for my first allotment (any
day now) & started reading this thread with some anticipation but it
seems to have decended into a rather unpleasant "tut-tut" listing.

If those more experienced allotmenteers have some tips to offer or
common pitfalls to avoid I'll be extremely grateful, but I'm sure that
the selfish behaviour listed above is in no way dictated by the length
of time someone has had an allotment - rather more due to the sort of
person they are...


Let's get back to basics. Bob did not tut at anyone and didn't describe
selfish behaviour. He described some common errors made by people new to
allotments, as observed by someone very experienced on an allotment. If I
was a new allotment holder, I'd be grateful to receive some time, labour and
money saving advice such as this. Personally, I think it would be a good
inclusion in the FAQs. I can't count how many posts we've had here from now
allotment holders, asking "how do I start" sort of questions.
Remarks about closing gates and not stealing other peoples' produce, which
should be elementary to any half decent person anywhere, were not from Bob.
Once people have more experience I'm sure they can and will experiment with
different methods, times of sowing, fertiliser, ground management etc. but
these basic tips to get you started came from a helpful and knowledgeable
member of urg. We're lucky to have him and if people take offence at
receiving impartial and helpful advice, I can't imagine what they're doing
on a group which is stiff with both.
--
Sacha
www.hillhousenursery.co.uk
South Devon
http://www.discoverdartmoor.co.uk/