Crundy

I am asking that you withdraw your assertion that the people who have
singed their names to the petition are 'idiots'
Also that I am by association an 'idiot'

I would also ask that you cease using swear words when answering my
posts.

I will accept that in the heat of the moment words may be ill chosen
and will bear no grudge regarding past occurrences.

Mike

Mikesndbs wrote:
Crundy

I am asking that you withdraw your assertion that the people who have
singed their names to the petition are 'idiots'
Also that I am by association an 'idiot'

I would also ask that you cease using swear words when answering my
posts.

Oh dear. I fear you're not really cut out for the cut-and-thrust of Usenet
debate.

"Mikesndbs" wrote in message
ups.com...
I urge others to click the message options and report these mails to
google.

Hmm, you're new to the internet I'm guessing?

I will also be consulting my solicitor today to see if any action can
be taken regarding deformation or slander.

Good luck with that.

"Amethyst Deceiver" wrote in message
...
Mikesndbs wrote:
Crundy

I am asking that you withdraw your assertion that the people who have
singed their names to the petition are 'idiots'
Also that I am by association an 'idiot'

I would also ask that you cease using swear words when answering my
posts.

Oh dear. I fear you're not really cut out for the cut-and-thrust of Usenet
debate.

Yes, I would like to see how they get on in alt.os.windows-xp.

Tell you what Mikendbs, I will retract my statements if you, yourself, can
provide three workable laws or rules for your petition. You already
specified bells, but please also bear in mind I was once told by an RSPCA
employee that collars on cats are generally a bad idea, as they get many
cases of cats getting trapped or hung because of them (apparently including
the quick release ones) and that microchipping your cat is sufficient.

The simple fact is, you are starting a petition with no point to it. The
reason I referred to you and the others who signed it as idiots is because
you are being stupid if you think your petition as it stands will be taken
seriously. Let's look at dog laws, for example, it is illegal to leave your
dog's mess on the pavement. It is illegal to take some breeds outside
without a muzzle. These are fixed solutions to genuine concerns, which is
exactly what your petition does not have. Simply saying 'Cat owners should
have more control over their pets' is not sufficient. I completely agree
with you that there should be some way of stopping cats straying into other
people's gardens. I would love to be able to stop my cats from doing this.

OK Crundy

That seems very fair.

My petition was made deliberately vague!
The idea behind that was that I did not know what the answer is and
wanted those in a better position to make the choices.

The agreed bell that I refer to would of course be one approved by the
RSPCA.
At one time they recommended a particular type that would release
itself if the cat became trapped by the associated collar.
Such a device does exits but the RSPCA had to stop recommending it as
it was seen as a commercial interest which they could not be
associated with.

I paid attention to the other petitions regarding cats and found them
to be 'extreme' in many cases! Many demanding all sorts of controls
and abuses.
I did not want to be associated with any of that so stuck to the
basics in that I wanted non cat owners to have some redress upon the
cat owner if they were inconvenienced by an animal that roams free.

At the moment as the law stands a cat is not deemed to be owned if it
is free!

Maybe this law needs to be changed.
If it was it would have advantages for the cat owners as well!
The reason being if a cat was hit by a car the car owner would have to
stop and check and try to find the owner.
But from my point of view I could then ask my neighbour to keep his
animals out of my garden and the onus would be on them to take
reasonable steps.
Such a fencing, or buying me a cat scare.

26 other people seem to think my petition is a good one.
And I hope that by the close I will have at least 100 so that the
government will be obliged to look at it and then at least know its a
concern!

After that its up to them but at least I will have attempted to do
something rather than just being cruel to cats as some advise.

But here and in many areas the domestic cat population has exploded
due to in the main 'families' moving away from what they see as high
maintenance dogs to low maintenance cats! of course this means the
cats have to be put up with by all those around and the distress of
having the wildlife killed for fun and finding cats mess with the
associated diseases and unpleasantness in your garden has become more
of a problem than it may have been 10 years ago or so.

I hope this enlightens as to my views?

Cheers

Mike

"Mikesndbs" wrote in message
ups.com...
My petition was made deliberately vague!
The idea behind that was that I did not know what the answer is and
wanted those in a better position to make the choices.

Although that sounds like a good idea, if you do not provide details it will
be ignored and disregarded as nonsense by the council (as I initially
disregarded it). It's a bit like someone starting a petition to solve the
problems in Iraq by just saying "we need to solve all the problems in Iraq".
I'm sure you'd get many more people signing that petition, and yet you'd
still be in the same situation, that is, still asking the question "How?"

The agreed bell that I refer to would of course be one approved by the
RSPCA.
At one time they recommended a particular type that would release
itself if the cat became trapped by the associated collar.
Such a device does exits but the RSPCA had to stop recommending it as
it was seen as a commercial interest which they could not be
associated with.

The bell is OK for birds, but you will still be finding dead frogs, mice,
and various small rodents in your garden that can't get away as quickly as a
bird. Yes, it is a step forward.

I paid attention to the other petitions regarding cats and found them
to be 'extreme' in many cases! Many demanding all sorts of controls
and abuses.
I did not want to be associated with any of that so stuck to the
basics in that I wanted non cat owners to have some redress upon the
cat owner if they were inconvenienced by an animal that roams free.

The main problem is, you appear to be under the delusion that a cat can be
trained in the same way as a dog. I'm guessing you don't own a dog, but
perhaps did own one at some point, and you have never owned a cat (or if you
did, it was for a short period)?
/DerrenBrown
If your pet dog wanders into the neighbour's garden, you can angrily call
them back and tell them off. After doing this a couple of times they won't
do it again. Cat's do not respond in the same way. If you did the same to a
cat, the first thing they would do would be to run into the neighbour's
garden and hide.

Maybe this law needs to be changed.
If it was it would have advantages for the cat owners as well!
The reason being if a cat was hit by a car the car owner would have to
stop and check and try to find the owner.
But from my point of view I could then ask my neighbour to keep his
animals out of my garden and the onus would be on them to take
reasonable steps.
Such a fencing, or buying me a cat scare.

Personally, if my neighbour complained about my cats in their garden, I
would be considerate enough to buy them some repellant to keep them out of
their flowerbeds. Not everyone would be as accomodating though, and
introducing a law like this would cause an increase in neighbour disputes,
and a subsequent reduction in housing values (as you are by law obliged to
disclose any disputes). Cheaper or subsidised repellants would be better.

26 other people seem to think my petition is a good one.
And I hope that by the close I will have at least 100 so that the
government will be obliged to look at it and then at least know its a
concern!

This is my main problem, and the reaon for my 'idiots' comment. Just because
a number of people have signed a petition, does not make the points valid.
Take the example of the kid in America who managed to convince 84% of the
people he spoke to to ban the chemical 'Dihydrogen Monoxide' (water) by
using generalised arguments, or the TV prank show that got loads of women to
sign a petition to 'Stop women suffring'. We could even take it one step
further and look at the National American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA)
who have far more people signing their petition than you trying to make it
legal for a fully grown man to have sex with a small boy!! I'm obviously not
equating your petition to any of the examples I give, but my point is that
people will sign anything.

But here and in many areas the domestic cat population has exploded
due to in the main 'families' moving away from what they see as high
maintenance dogs to low maintenance cats!

I hate it when people buy pets and don't look after them. My first cat was
found as a few-day-old kitten dumped in a roadside ditch. I do wonder what
happened to the rest of the litter. Perhaps it would be better to impose
heftier fines on households who are not responsible with neutering their
cats or leaving them out for prolonged periods of time?

I hope this enlightens as to my views?

Indeed. I appreciate the amicable (and rational) response and hope you can
see my point of view also.

On 10 Jul, 00:06, "Crundy" wrote:

"Denise" wrote in message

Starting a stupid petition with no real resolutions and then getting a
couple of like minded idiots to sign it does not solve the problem.

HEL-LO...I did NOT write that!!

Denise

Tour my gardens:

http://web1.in4web.com/mtcdrc

In reply to Crundy ) who wrote this in
, I, Marvo, say :

[snip snap]

The reason I referred to you and the others who signed it as idiots

Interestingly, the word "idiot" was originally used by parliamentarians to
mean "non-parliamentarian", the word would probably now be proleteriat.

Or something.

Isn't it funny how the word now describes those who coined it in the first
place :-)

"Denise" wrote in message
...
On 10 Jul, 00:06, "Crundy" wrote:

"Denise" wrote in message

Starting a stupid petition with no real resolutions and then getting a
couple of like minded idiots to sign it does not solve the problem.

HEL-LO...I did NOT write that!!

Heh, bad indentation and clipping!!