Thanks Bill and Nina ..... Your last notes are keepers !!

I nominate Bill and Nina as the official "Newbie Responders" for this forum.

Every time someone posts a "How do I get started" or "Which trees grow
indoors" I suggest Bill and Nina send them off these well written notes.


Mark Hill - Mechanicsburg, PA - Zone 6



Nina wrote:

Whee haw, you're stepping into a pile of worms with that question


Bill wrote:

Welcome to the forum .........

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Aw, Mark, where's the fun in that? We don't want to turn the IBC into a
machine. People, even novices (or "newbies," if you insist), want individualized
responses for their seemingly unique situations, not a one size fits all post.
That's the beauty of the responses you cite.
However, as a compromise, we do have a FAQ page at the IBC web site which
does serve the very function you are suggesting. You can find it at:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/faq/faq01.html
Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
http://LCBSBonsai.org http://bonsai-bci.com
===============================
Mark Hill wrote:
Thanks Bill and Nina ..... Your last notes are keepers !!
I nominate Bill and Nina as the official "Newbie Responders" for this forum.

Every time someone posts a "How do I get started" or "Which trees grow
indoors" I suggest Bill and Nina send them off these well written notes.
Mark Hill - Mechanicsburg, PA - Zone 6
=======
Nina wrote:
Whee haw, you're stepping into a pile of worms with that question
=======
Bill wrote:
Welcome to the forum .........

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I didn't mean to turn the forum into a "machine" Alan.
I thought both Bill and Nina's responses where well though out and equally
well written.

Mark

-----Original Message-----
From: Internet Bonsai Club ] On Behalf Of
Alan Walker
Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 12:26 PM
To:
Subject: [IBC] Another beginner to Bonsai(help?)

Aw, Mark, where's the fun in that? We don't want to turn the IBC
into a
machine. People, even novices (or "newbies," if you insist), want
individualized
responses for their seemingly unique situations, not a one size fits all
post.
That's the beauty of the responses you cite.
However, as a compromise, we do have a FAQ page at the IBC web site
which
does serve the very function you are suggesting. You can find it at:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/faq/faq01.html
Alan Walker, Lake Charles, LA, USA
http://LCBSBonsai.org http://bonsai-bci.com
===============================
Mark Hill wrote:
Thanks Bill and Nina ..... Your last notes are keepers !!
I nominate Bill and Nina as the official "Newbie Responders" for
this forum.

Every time someone posts a "How do I get started" or "Which trees
grow
indoors" I suggest Bill and Nina send them off these well written notes.
Mark Hill - Mechanicsburg, PA - Zone 6
=======
Nina wrote:
Whee haw, you're stepping into a pile of worms with that question
=======
Bill wrote:
Welcome to the forum .........

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****
++++Sponsored, in part, by Mike Page ++++
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****
-- The IBC HOME PAGE & FAQ: http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/ --
+++++ Questions? Help? e-mail +++++

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Luke:

What trees are indoor and what trees are outdoor trees is a topic in
many books...HOWEVER...my preference was to take a more local approach.
You see there are some varieties or trees that can be indoor in some
climates and outdoors in other or some combination thereof. You'll also
find some disagreement on whether a tree is indoor or outdoor. For
example many sites list Chinese Elm as indoor, however after the advice
of someone on this list that lives near my Zone 4-5 location I leave my
Chinese Elm outdoors all year.

My local approach, at least at first was this. I visited the home
centers and local nurseries and trees that were in the greenhouse were
mostly indoor and trees outside were mostly outside. Now that may
simplify it a little and I certainly recommend asking at the nursery or
checking a book on a specific tree but it is a fairly safe guideline.

With that said if you find a tree you are in doubt about ask here on the
list. Just post what the tree is and where you are and you'll get
information.

As far as what I have for indoor trees...
Ficus (benjamina, green island, golden gate, nerifolia/willow-leaf,
kiki, too-little)
Jade
Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia Theezan sp?)
Chinese Privet
Serissa (many varieties)
Fukien Tea (Carmona Macrophylla sp?)

These are the most common and I'm sure others will chime in.

Let me know if that doesn't help...I have a book somewhere dedicated to
indoor trees.

wmcorcor


== Which are indoor ones?

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Thanks Mark....

I'll accept that title...although I may lose that actual post by the
time someone asks...

It was something I wish I had when I started. I wanted to get to the
trees and not spend a month reading books. Then again I'm really
hands-on.

PS I'm a few hours away from you in Northeastern PA. (Outside W-B).

wmcorcor

== Thanks Bill ..... this is a keeper
==
== I nominate you as the official "Newbie Responder"
== Every time someone posts a "How do I get started" post I suggest you
== send
== them off this note.
== It'll certainly save the rest of us a lot of typing !!
==
==
== Mark Hill - Mechanicsburg, PA - Zone 6

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True...and thanks Nina. I did neglect to mention all of my indoor trees
spend summers outdoors. I am lucky enough to have huge south facing
windows and a ton of humidity from the nearby lake so mine may tolerate
a little better.

Great information and great suggestions...

==
== Which are indoor ones?
==
==
== Whee haw, you're stepping into a pile of worms with that question.
== There is no such thing as an "indoor plant"; just plants that can
== tolerate indoor conditions better than others.

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However, as a compromise, we do have a FAQ page at the IBC web site which
does serve the very function you are suggesting. You can find it at:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/faq/faq01.html

Yep, actually, the URI is going to be changing within the next couple weeks
and shall be:
http://www.internetbonsaiclub.org/faq.php (this will be live as of August
10th at the latest, so don't go there yet ;-) )

FWIW, I have just added Nina's response on the Indoor tree thing, I thought
it was the best response on this topic in a long time.

Nic
"You must deal with me as I think of myself" J. Hockenberry
http://bmee.net

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Thanks Mark and Alan...

I think with the FAQ's, saved posts (like Mark is doing) and "fresh"
individualized answers we have the best of both world. Being in the
computer industry I have days where I want to talk to an individual and
days when I want to talk to a machine only. I suspect that applies to
Bonsai people as well. I also see many times there are days when people
don't have time to reply with an individual message to me or I don't
have time to reply to them. There's room out here for both I think and
I am always interested in reading both.

wmcorcor

== -----Original Message-----
== From: Mark Hill ]
== Sent: Tuesday, July 29, 2003 12:47 PM
== To:
== Subject: [IBC] Another beginner to Bonsai(help?)
==
== I didn't mean to turn the forum into a "machine" Alan.
== I thought both Bill and Nina's responses where well though out and
== equally
== well written.
==
== Mark
==
== Aw, Mark, where's the fun in that? We don't want to turn
the
== IBC
== into a
== machine.

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"Corcoran. Bil" wrote in message
news:96A100189C3E2146ACC218C4D7A53DF016CCE4F7@ms02 .kings.edu...
Luke:

What trees are indoor and what trees are outdoor trees is a topic in
many books...

Waste of paper and time. There are no indoor plants. Period. There are
plants that live under what we call "indoor" _conditions_. But that's
another matter. Those conditions are't just "a room with a roof, a
window and a door", but much more.

As far as what I have for indoor trees...
Ficus (benjamina, green island, golden gate, nerifolia/willow-leaf,
kiki, too-little)
Jade
Chinese Sweet Plum (Sageretia Theezan sp?)
Chinese Privet
Serissa (many varieties)
Fukien Tea (Carmona Macrophylla sp?)

Have you discussed this list with, say, Budi Sulistyo? I'm sure he'd
disagree. Partly at least.

And now... a wish (for everyone in this NG and on IBC): please
don't
dismiss people asking which trees they can grow inside with a
short and
definitive "they'll all die". Because it simply isn't true.
Provided
that certain conditions are met, they can even be made into
decent
bonsai. And since beauty is in the eye of the beholder, even
more so.

Hmmm.

You have to consider, of course, that 99.999% of these "indoor
tree" questions come from rank newcomers to the bonsai world.
Ninety percent of THESE may have grown a Philodendron at some
time in their lives, but little else. Given those kinds of
givens (and it is easy to tell when you have one of these folks),
the answer that a juniper will die when kept inside verges on
prophesy.

Jim (the Prophet) Lewis - - Tallahassee,
FL - The phrase 'sustainable growth' is an oxymoron. - Stephen
Viederman

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Luke...

I don't claim to be the indoor bonsai expert but I will say it is not a
waste of paper or time when a beginner asks a question. That sounds a
little polarized to me. If I'm wrong or inexperienced the group will
set me and him straight. I think you're splitting hairs here and yes it
is harder to keep an indoor plant/bonsai happy but people do it all the
time without a greenhouse or special lighting. I have great south
facing windows that open for circulation and I have a lake in my back
yard that provides humidity. With that said I also have flourishing
ficus in my office in the city with no open windows and severe
air-conditioning. Regardless of the definition there are indoor bonsai.

My indoor guys do great and have for years. I have more outdoor than
indoor and my indoor spend summers outside. Call them whatever you
want. For simplicity I called them indoor bonsai. I base this on the
few years experience I have with about two dozen plants and some info
from Werner M. Busch's book (Indoor Bonsai for beginners).

I had these trees long before I found this list so I haven't discussed
them with anyone on the list. I just bought them and they are doing
great. I'd love to hear Budi join the discussion and hear his opinions
on these trees. Isn't that what this list is all about? It's
apparently too late for me, assuming that these trees thriving is
anyone's definition of "too late." Maybe Budi can jump in here and set
us both straight on the topic and help out these beginners (like me)
seeking this sort of information.

I agreed with Nina that this is a can or worms...but like Nina I gave it
a whirl and tried to answer someone that was asking for information that
doesn't have a definitive answer.

Thanks Luke...I can't wait to more opinions.

wmcorcor

Luke:
== Waste of paper and time. There are no indoor plants. Period. There
are
== plants that live under what we call "indoor" _conditions_. But
that's
== another matter. Those conditions are't just "a room with a roof, a
== window and a door", but much more.

== Have you discussed this list with, say, Budi Sulistyo? I'm sure he'd
== disagree. Partly at least.

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"Corcoran. Bil" wrote in message
news:96A100189C3E2146ACC218C4D7A53DF016CCE500@ms02 .kings.edu...
Luke...

I don't claim to be the indoor bonsai expert but I will say it is not
a
waste of paper or time when a beginner asks a question.

I didn't say that. I said it was a waste of paper if people "argued"
about which trees are "indoor" and which "outdoor".

That sounds a
little polarized to me. If I'm wrong or inexperienced the group will
set me and him straight. I think you're splitting hairs here

Not at all. "Indoor" isn't a universal term. I know people who can't
keep figs alive through winter in their living rooms while mine thrive.
And I don't do anything but water while they mist and wax and whatnot.
Their "indoors" differs from mine _a_lot_. Bottomline: it's about
conditions, not in-/out-doors.

Good Day to All,

I believe that any tree can be grown indoors,but
you will end up re-creating the atmosphere of the
outdoors.Most cannot afford to do this.

You would probably end up with a very successful
biosphere.
Essentially an apartment dweller on the moon or a
spaceship would have to do this.
That's what computers are for.

So,as far as I am concerned any tree is an indoor
tree.
Khaimraj
[West Indies/Caribbean,
the soggy lands]

*As with most things in life,you reap what you sow.

-----Original Message-----
From: Luke Tulkas
To:
Date: 30 July 2003 2:46
Subject: [IBC] Another beginner to Bonsai(help?)


Luke Tulkas,
Not at all. "Indoor" isn't a universal term. I know people who can't
keep figs alive through winter in their living rooms while mine thrive.
And I don't do anything but water while they mist and wax and whatnot.
Their "indoors" differs from mine _a_lot_. Bottomline: it's about
conditions, not in-/out-doors.

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Quite a few genera / species of temperate plants can
be grown on ordinary windowsills (inside!) all year round. They might
not make superb bonsai, they might not even thrive, but they live. A few
of them are quite happy with our living room conditions and can be made
into quality bonsai.

I don't have a problem telling people how to care for indoor bonsai,
but I do worry about the "quality" part. I think indoor bonsai,
except lucky ones provided with exceptional growing conditions, are
only going to be mediocre at best. I guess beginners don't need to
worry about this (their outdoor trees will probably be mediocre, too,
at first!), but I never feel I am doing justice to the hobby by
implying it is just about keeping the tree alive. An indoor bonsai
kept alive is simply a house plant. All of *my* indoor bonsai are
essentially really pretty and well-pruned houseplants. Not one evokes
"treeness".

Nina, who has moved into her very first house with her very first
yard, and went to a nursery and bought her first tree in a whole
year! A whole year!

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8
Nina, who has moved into her very first house with her very first yard, and
went to a nursery and bought her first tree in a whole year! A whole year!
8

Congradulations! Congradulations! Congradulations!

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