"'Mike'" wrote in message
...

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 11:04:42 +0000, K wrote:

Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why
GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have
paid
some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web
was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a
few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether
you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they
know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more
'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.

and copying without permission and archiving material when posters have
specifically specified that their posts are not to be archived.
--

Martin


and you have warned them have you? Solicitor's letter with a 'don't do it
again or else' warning?

Or is it all just glib talk on here?

Kindest regards

Mike


And there's me thinking I had put a block on your posts!

"alan.holmes" wrote in message
...

"'Mike'" wrote in message
...

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 11:04:42 +0000, K wrote:

Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why
GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have
paid
some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web
was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a
few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether
you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they
know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more
'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.

and copying without permission and archiving material when posters have
specifically specified that their posts are not to be archived.
--

Martin


and you have warned them have you? Solicitor's letter with a 'don't do it
again or else' warning?

Or is it all just glib talk on here?

Kindest regards

Mike


And there's me thinking I had put a block on your posts!




Why on earth would you want to do that?

Afraid of the truth and honest speaking?

Not an MP by any chance are you?

Kindest possible regards

Mike

First of all this is the header for UK Gardening section on Garden Banter

"(uk.rec.gardening) Based in the British Isles for gardening within those islands. Some are quite experienced gardeners, others are (or were when they first joined urg) complete beginners.
Threads: 27,113 Posts: 194,982"

Secondly this is how your post appears on GB:

" Today, 01:35 PM posted to uk.rec.gardening
Rusty_Hinge[_2_]
external usenet poster

Posts: 15
Default How to get onto urg
The message
from Rusty_Hinge contains these words:

Correction - any newsreader worth its salt will indicate newer bits by
indenting preceding blocks. Colour is non-compliant with Usenet
protocols.

Oops!

I suspect it is the newsreader rather than the writer which does this,
in which case it has nothing to do with protocols.

Having used a friend's reader once, I find the practice totally
counter-intuitive - and to some types of colour-blindnesses, I'd guess
that it might be a visual drawback.

Still, I suppose it's what you're used to. While my newsreader has
sprouted a lot more bells and whistles since it was first written, it is
to the first glance very similar to version 1.0

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig"

I think that there is a great deal of credit to uk rec gardening on the GB site.

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 17:20:16 -0000, "alan.holmes"

wrote:


"'Mike'" wrote in message

snip

And there's me thinking I had put a block on your posts!

Please don't quote him I and most others have successfully filtered him.
--

Martin

Another one who hides from the truth :-((((

Rusty_Hinge writes

I dislike posts being separated into subthreads - for two reasons: the
first is that some posts will contain reference to two or more points,
which have caused the thread to be split, and if, for instance, I am not
interested in one of the aspects and am not following that sub-thread,
I'll miss something which is apposite to the thread I *AM* following.

Ah ... I guess there's more than one way of splitting. I'm thinking of
the scenario where A and B both reply to the original poster, then C and
D reply to A, E relies to C. N replies to B, P replies to N.

My newsreader shows this heirarchy clearly, and just hitting the space
bar gives me the posts in the order:
Original, A,C,E
D
B, N P

That means I follow a complete chain of responses to the end before
getting into the next response.

The second is that at least one of the clients which split things thus
split hairs too, and I get up to half a dozen threads all with a
different number of spaces added somewhere in the subject line,

No spaces at all in the subject line. In fact the list of threads
doesn't show the sub-threads at all, unless I double click on a
particular thread, when it expands to list all the posts with a sort of
'family tree' showing who replied to who.


--
Kay

"Rusty_Hinge" wrote in message
. uk...
The message
from Martin contains these words:

Some news servers react quickly to spam attacks by deleting spam.
news.individual.net is one.

I've not heard any bad reports on NIN.

I started to use NIN when my ISP dumped Usenet a while ago. I was going to
change ISP's but it seems most UK ISP's were about to do the same. I am
very impressed with NIN, it's worth every penny of the 10 euros/year it
costs and is easily paid for via BT, it's just added to my phone bill once a
year.
They are brilliant at filtering out offensive posts or flooding and if you
have any problem you just email them and get a reply very quickly from a
*real* person. I once mailed them about malicious flooding on one my Usenet
groups, I had a reply within 10 minutes thanking me for drawing it to their
attention and assuring me they would have noticed it themselves shortly.
I cannot fault news.individual.net in any way.
Binaries not allowed though and continual cross-posting will get you struck
off!

Thank you for a very interesting debate. If die-hard urglers are not paying anything for their newsgroup access and GB acknowledges urg's provenance, I don't see the problem. I just want to read about other people's gardening queries and to reply if I think I can help and to post my own problems as they arise. As mentioned before, some of the GB sites for other parts of the world are very informative and there is a wonderful photos section. As to the relative merits of the GB versus the urg format, I have no idea what urg looks like on the screen, but find GB easy to use.

"Rusty_Hinge" wrote in message
. uk...
The message
from Charlie Pridham contains these words:

I had not realised that some isps had discontinued newsgroups.

I'm afraid that most of them have.

Groups where a few years ago I had to pick and choose which threads to
follow are very often devoid of posts for up to a week now.


Gosh !
You are obviously in to the wrong groups.
I find it a full time job keeping up !
Try uk railway - they are at it 25/8/53 !!

Regards
Pete
www.thecanalshop.com

Rusty_Hinge wrote:
The message
from Martin contains these words:

Some news servers react quickly to spam attacks by deleting spam.
news.individual.net is one.

I've not heard any bad reports on NIN.

Most spam I don't see, because my killfile deals with it - and looking
at the log, there's not much for it to deal with. I think most of it
is done by e-mail these days, and the bots tend to trawl the WWW
rather than Usenet.

I think NIN is brilliant. For e10, I get very little in spam posts.
--
Pete C
London UK

K wrote:
Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you
have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the
web was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took
only a few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same
whether you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with
what they know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and
more 'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.
You copyright your posts?
--
Pete C
London UK

In message , Martin
writes
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 17:18:16 GMT, Rusty_Hinge

wrote:

The message
from Martin contains these words:

AFAIK the display presentation is not part of the protocol.

I think you'll find it is, as are a lot of other things which most
people now take for granted.

I think you'll find you told K you were mistaken. )

Which protocol defines usenet screen presentation?
take your pick from

RFC 822 specifies the format of messages; RFC 1036 uses this.
RFC 977 specifies NNTP, the Network News Transfer Protocol.
RFC 1036 specifies the format of Usenet articles.
RFC 1123 amends RFC 822.
RFC 1153 specifies the digest format some moderated groups use.


I notice that top-posting replies is on the wane.

Only because sensible people like us don't subscribe to such groups.

That's it - I'm off!

I joined this group a few months ago, lurking and mainly enjoying and
appreciating the advice and comments made on gardening. However I have
noticed that it appears to have become the preserve of a clique of
individuals who treat it as their private debating chamber. Like a bunch
of smug, bickering, spoiled children, obviously educated and with
exceedingly high opinions of their individual cerebral worth, they stamp
their feet and shout, insult and sulk. They are unhelpful, rude,
cynical, argumentative and nitpicking, trying to impose opinions -
mainly on matters unrelated to gardening. You (who know who you are but
would never admit it without arguing) - should be ashamed of yourselves!
You have so much to offer to those needing help and advice (like me) but
object to the method of asking the question or attribute a non existent
commercial motive to the post. This thread is a classic example. Just
review the OP's remarks in the 1st 2 posts. 60 plus posts later the
thread is a plate of spaghetti and still going nowhere and wasting time
and space.
--
Gopher .... I know my place!

"Martin" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 22:14:19 -0000, "Pete C" wrote:

You copyright your posts?
http://www.gardenbanter.co.uk/showth...=179669&page=3

They copy your posts.

Exactly. And pretend it is theirs. That's what annoys us.

The message
from K contains these words:
Rusty_Hinge writes

I dislike posts being separated into subthreads - for two reasons: the
first is that some posts will contain reference to two or more points,
which have caused the thread to be split, and if, for instance, I am not
interested in one of the aspects and am not following that sub-thread,
I'll miss something which is apposite to the thread I *AM* following.

Ah ... I guess there's more than one way of splitting. I'm thinking of
the scenario where A and B both reply to the original poster, then C and
D reply to A, E relies to C. N replies to B, P replies to N.

My newsreader shows this heirarchy clearly, and just hitting the space
bar gives me the posts in the order:
Original, A,C,E
D
B, N P

That means I follow a complete chain of responses to the end before
getting into the next response.

Seems unnecessarily complicated to me, and prone to hiccups...

The second is that at least one of the clients which split things thus
split hairs too, and I get up to half a dozen threads all with a
different number of spaces added somewhere in the subject line,

No spaces at all in the subject line. In fact the list of threads
doesn't show the sub-threads at all, unless I double click on a
particular thread, when it expands to list all the posts with a sort of
'family tree' showing who replied to who.

See comment above.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

The message
from "Christina Websell" contains
these words:
"Rusty_Hinge" wrote in message
. uk...
The message
from Martin contains these words:

Some news servers react quickly to spam attacks by deleting spam.
news.individual.net is one.

I've not heard any bad reports on NIN.

I started to use NIN when my ISP dumped Usenet a while ago. I was going to
change ISP's but it seems most UK ISP's were about to do the same. I am
very impressed with NIN, it's worth every penny of the 10 euros/year it
costs and is easily paid for via BT, it's just added to my phone bill
once a
year.
They are brilliant at filtering out offensive posts or flooding and if you
have any problem you just email them and get a reply very quickly from a
*real* person. I once mailed them about malicious flooding on one my
Usenet
groups, I had a reply within 10 minutes thanking me for drawing it to their
attention and assuring me they would have noticed it themselves shortly.
I cannot fault news.individual.net in any way.
Binaries not allowed though and continual cross-posting will get you struck
off!

I don't think I could live with that last condition - when I post to
urmc I often crosspost to urm - and join threads so crosspostedby
others.

Otherwise I seldom crosspost.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

The message
from "Pete Stockdale" contains these words:
"Rusty_Hinge" wrote in message
. uk...
The message
from Charlie Pridham contains these words:

I had not realised that some isps had discontinued newsgroups.

I'm afraid that most of them have.

Groups where a few years ago I had to pick and choose which threads to
follow are very often devoid of posts for up to a week now.


Gosh !
You are obviously in to the wrong groups.
I find it a full time job keeping up !
Try uk railway - they are at it 25/8/53 !!

I have a spy in ur, and I know they are at it - unlike today's railways...

Wave at Dave Jackson...

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig