Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an instant. I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

"Janet Conroy" wrote in message
...

Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an instant.
I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all
the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still
unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it
because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?




--
Janet Conroy

Janet some of the 'owners' of this site regard it as 'theirs' and use it as
an open email medium and general conversation channel. They 'object' to
their conversations, AND gardening tips, being posted onto another site
which they do not subscribe to.

The fact that this IS an open site and an open medium seems to be ignored.
It is THEIRS and only those who 'follow their rules' are allowed into the
clique.

Kind regards

Mike

Janet Conroy wrote:
Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an instant.
I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all
the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still
unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it
because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

It's not hated Janet, just that it's a bit irksome that some
fly-by-night website pinches the advice given here and then passes it
off as its own. The impression given is that URG is part of GB and that
annoys a good many on here. In any case, a GB-only 'contributor' may
ask in vain about a thread trawled from urg. since no-one here will see
that question.

In article ,
says...

Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an instant.
I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all
the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still
unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it
because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?




--
Janet Conroy

Unlike some others I am only mildly annoyed by the re use of any posts I
make, but I do find that when people are posting via garden banter its
rather like being in a room with someone on the phone ie you are only
involved in part of the conversation! Had I started here via garden
banter I like you would not have seen the problem. Although news groups
have many good points they do suffer from time to time from spam attacks
which is why I moved to a dedicated news reader so I can filter these
out. I had not realised that some isps had discontinued newsgroups.
--
Charlie Pridham, Gardening in Cornwall
www.roselandhouse.co.uk
Holders of national collections of Clematis viticella cultivars and
Lapageria rosea

In message , Granity
writes

geo;823639 Wrote:
Janet Conroy wrote:
-
Here I am, replying to myself. I've tried twice to get a response to
this. Please don't tick me off or write snotty comments when I
mention
something I've seen elsewhere on GardenBanter if none of you urglers
is
prepared to give me guidance on how to access urg other than via GB.-

As others have said, you need to be able to use a newsreader. I have
just followed the instructions he-
http://news.aioe.org/spip.php?article77
to set up a (free) account with nntp.aioe.org - you do not have to
register with them at all.




Using news groups is ok IF it's only one or two of them, if, as I do,
you subscribe to quite a lot then it becomes almost a full time
occupation to read all of the posts.

You don't have to read all the posts, I'm on quite a few groups, but I
only read all posts on low traffic ones.

Since in most cases only about 40%
of posts have any interest to anyone person, the time, effort and
trouble becomes too much and the whole thing implodes.

Not really, read what you want, ignore the others (a newsreader as
opposed to a web interface makes it quick and easy to make those you are
interested in, and ignore those you aren't etc.)

Most of the
sites I receive in digest form via 2 or 3 emails a day which means I
can at least pick out the posts of interest to me from the digest
headers.

You are probably talking about email lists rather than newsgroups here,
personally I hate digests, but some people like them.

The beauty of garden banter is that the forum layout enables
me to see at a glance what is new, what interests me,

Which a newsreader does as well. Much better IMO.

and above all I
don't have to wade through yards of quotes from the start of the thread
trying to find the one line reply buried in there somewhere, in a forum
you don't need to use quotes to show what you are talking about as the
thread has a title that tells you. /rant. :-)

I have subject headers as well...

The main reason for quoting is that the nature of Usenet is that it is
possible that you might receive a reply without receiving the original,
or you might not have the original any more. So a bit of quoting gives
context. Lack of snipping though is annoying eitherway.

My problems with web forums and interfaces is that it is just so slow
and clunky. I can only put up with it on places which are low traffic or
that I want to use enough to overcome the effort required. Dealing with
groups on the web with lots of traffic is much harder than via my
newsreader.
--
Chris French

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more 'usable' technology. :-)

On Thu, 27 Nov 2008 21:51:58 +0000, Janet Conroy
wrote:


Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an instant.
I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all
the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still
unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it
because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

Janet, once you get working with newsgroups so that you are seeing
uk.rec.gardening directly rather than through gardenbanter's copy, you
will find that there are many other newsgroups you might find
interesting.
There are subjects like cooking, diy, pets, you name it!

Granity writes
in a forum
you don't need to use quotes to show what you are talking
about as the
thread has a title that tells you. /rant. :-)

How does that differ from a newsgroup?

Any newsreader worth its salt will highlight new bits in a different
colour so they are easy to find, a poster who is quoting properly will
merely quote the relevant bits, which saves you having to read all
through the previous post to try and dig out the tiny piece that relates
to the reply. Finally, using my newsreader I can just hit the space bar
to move from one new post to another - much less trouble than all this
clicking on particular topics.

But it all depends on how often you pick up posts and how many you want
to read. I don't mind if people want to get their gardening chat from a
website, I just object to my posts being creamed off into a website
where the majority of posters are totally unaware that what they are
reading is stuff that has been generated elsewhere (to be fair to
gardenbanter, it does have a tiny notice at the top saying it is a
portal to newsgroups)
--
Kay

Janet Conroy writes

Blimey - I seem to have gone from no response to a deluge in an
instant.
I was OK with the first couple of replies but now I'm blinded by all
the techy stuff. I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still
unclear as to why GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it
because you have paid some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

If I had written some article in the newsletter of my local gardening
club, and later I found someone had published a book made up completely
of my article and that of other gardening club members who had also
contributed to the newsletter from time to time, I would be annoyed.

Even if the book was for charity, I would still be annoyed that my work
had been used without the courtesy of asking my permission.

I am annoyed that gardenbanter is building up its brandname on the basis
of my articles (and those of others in urg and in other newsgroups)
without ever having asked our permission.



--
Kay

Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why
GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have
paid
some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web
was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a
few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether
you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they
know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more
'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.

--
Kay

Incidentally, I have just been on to GB to look at this thread - 16
posts

While on urg - 24 posts.

I haven't time to see whether the missing posts are all to do with time
lag.

And re ease of use - in GB, all the posts in the thread are in one long
chain arranged according to time of arrival. In a newsreader, all the
posts are sort into their subthreads, so you can read all secondary
responses to one answer before reading the next answer and its secondary
responses. Saves an awful lot of dodging about trying to work out
exactly what point someone is responding to.
--
Kay

"K" wrote in message
...
Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why
GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have
paid
some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web
was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a
few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether
you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they
know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more
'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.

--
Kay

You have the answer :-))

Kind regards

Mike

"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 28 Nov 2008 11:04:42 +0000, K wrote:

Granity writes

Janet Conroy;823685 Wrote:
I will try to do the newsgroup thing, but I'm still unclear as to
why
GardenBanter is so hated by some posters. Is it because you have
paid
some cash to access a kosher newsgroup?

I think it's a hang up from the old dial up days when browsing the web
was costed by the minute, and downloading from a news group took only a
few moments to do. Nowadays, with broadband it costs the same whether
you are on for 2mins or 24/7 but people like to stay with what they
know rather than embrace what some of us see as better and more
'usable' technology. :-)


In my case, and in the case of others who have expressed their views
clearly in this thread, it is nothing to do with dial up.

It is precisely to do with an operation building its reputation on
material published by others without asking permission to do so.

and copying without permission and archiving material when posters have
specifically specified that their posts are not to be archived.
--

Martin


and you have warned them have you? Solicitor's letter with a 'don't do it
again or else' warning?

Or is it all just glib talk on here?

Kindest regards

Mike

The message
from Martin contains these words:
On Thu, 27 Nov 2008 17:23:43 GMT, Rusty_Hinge

wrote:

The message
from Charlie Pridham contains these words:

again your ISP may have this listed and you can subscribe for free
or you can buy annual subscription from outfits like News.Individual.

Nope - not AOL any longer.

Why can't an AOL subscriber buy a subscription from news.individual.net ?

I was referring to the 'your ISP', but I have a sort-of dim memory of
someone complaining that they couldn't get access to Usenet through AOL.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig

The message
from Granity contains these words:

Using news groups is ok IF it's only one or two of them, if, as I do,
you subscribe to quite a lot then it becomes almost a full time
occupation to read all of the posts. Since in most cases only about 40%
of posts have any interest to anyone person, the time, effort and
trouble becomes too much and the whole thing implodes. Most of the
sites I receive in digest form via 2 or 3 emails a day which means I
can at least pick out the posts of interest to me from the digest
headers. The beauty of garden banter is that the forum layout enables
me to see at a glance what is new, what interests me, and above all I
don't have to wade through yards of quotes from the start of the thread
trying to find the one line reply buried in there somewhere, in a forum
you don't need to use quotes to show what you are talking about as the
thread has a title that tells you. /rant. :-)

Ah, that might explain the irritating replies that don't indicate what
is the reply and what being replied to, but just continue from the end
of the last quoted text.

IMO, such replies should be dumped somehow, so the posters behave with
due netiquette if they want their contributions to be seen.

--
Rusty
Direct reply to: horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co period uk
Separator in search of a sig