oldmolly wrote:
"Jason Pope" wrote in message
...

Erm, you could be opening yourself up to legal problems!
If someone was to come on your property and get shocked you could be sued!


How do you imagine land owners all over the country manage? People who keep
livestock have electric fences.If someone comes onto *my* property, and
tries to get through what is obviously an electric fence, and get shocked,
how could they sue me?


The law is different in the town and in the country!
Even a sign up saying "electric fence" wouldn't be enough in the town
cos some people cannot read!

Jason


--
Check out my ebay auctions for Passifora caerulea and edulis seeds and
Morning Glory (Star of Yelta) seeds.
http://cgi6.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....sort=3&rows=50

oldmolly wrote:
"Jason Pope" wrote in message
...

If electrification was legal, people would be doing it to their cars to
stop them from being broken into.


It *is* legal you melon.Can I assume you live in a town? Go out to the
countryside, and take a look to see what is keeping livestock in their
fields if they aren't hedged.

You try doing the same thing in the town!


Also what happens if a guy with a heart condition gets shocked and dies?

Well what was the twit doing climbing into someone's garden and touching
the electric fence? If he dies, how can he sue?

He can't,..........his family can,.....as in that case wheret he farmer
shot the burgler!!

Jason


--
Check out my ebay auctions for Passifora caerulea and edulis seeds and
Morning Glory (Star of Yelta) seeds.
http://cgi6.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....sort=3&rows=50

Victoria Clare wrote:
"Mary Fisher" wrote in
t:


"oldmolly" wrote in message
news
"Jason Pope" wrote in message
...

Erm, you could be opening yourself up to legal problems!
If someone was to come on your property and get shocked you could
be

sued!

How do you imagine land owners all over the country manage? People
who keep
livestock have electric fences.If someone comes onto *my* property,
and tries to get through what is obviously an electric fence, and get
shocked, how could they sue me?

Because in English law you have a duty of care towards a trespasser.


Fine, but we are not talking about something that kills human beings on
contact!

It could if they have an underlying heart condition, and I'm not talking
about pacemakers!


A standard stockproof electric fence will cause you to jump backwards
and go 'ow!' if you touch it. It will not burn you or kill you.


Unless you have a heart condition!

Someone in this thread has alleged that someone with a pacemaker might
feel more serious effects, but that's a tiny proportion of the
population, that tend to lead fairly sedate and law-abiding lives.

Yeah right, having a haert condition stops you from breaking the law!
LOL



(I'm not entirely convinced anyway: presumably pacemakers need to have a
certain amount of resilience, at least to 'static'? Would a pacemaker
owner really be killed by a mild shock?)

Nowhere did I say anything about pacemakers!
Even magnets can take out a pacemaker!


The legal risks of, say, owning a car which you might accidentally drive
into someone, or a dog, which might bite someone, strike me as much
greater than those of installing a humble electric fence in your garden.

Victoria

That might be the case, but it doesn't negate that having an electric
fence in your garden is illegal!

Try it and see!

Jason




--
Check out my ebay auctions for Passifora caerulea and edulis seeds and
Morning Glory (Star of Yelta) seeds.
http://cgi6.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....sort=3&rows=50

The message
from Jason Pope contains these words:

Oh c'mon. The English countryside is littered with electric fences. My
sister has one to keep her horses from eating a whole field at a time,
and I see them keeping cows in order quite often. It's a widely used
form of stock control.

The countryside yes, but you try putting it in your back garden/front
garden and see how quick the police get on your case!

Please try not to be any more stupid than absolutely necessary! A friend
of mine has her garden ringed with an electric fence to stop her young dog
from dashing out onto the main road. She hasn't had a visit from the police
yet....still it has only been there for eight months, I suppose there's
time yet for the police to respond?

--
AnneJ
ICQ #:- 119531282

The message is clear.....
If you live in an area where you are likely to have a visit from an intruder
who has a heart condition and a pacemaker and who crawls around on his/her
hands and knees then forget the electric fence.
With a fence height of 9 to 12 inches you wont even feel a thing if you are
wearing trousers, jeans etc.
--
David Hill
Abacus nurseries
www.abacus-nurseries.co.uk

Jason Pope wrote in news:3F9E24EF.1090002
@virgin.net:

It is illegal to fit anything, security wise, in your front/back garden
that could injure another person who is on the property!
Harsh I know, but that is definately the case!


********.

My greenhouse could injure someone. My pond could injure someone. I have
a patio raised 3 feet above a concrete surface: that could injure someone.
I have some irregular paving, over which people might trip.

All of those are far more likely to cause injury than an electric fence,
which according to you might just conceivably be dangerous to someone who:
- is colourblind, AND
- has a heart problem, AND
- has broken into the garden rather than being invited (so has not been
warned), AND
- cannot read a warning sign, AND
- then goes rummaging about in the hedges!

As I understand it, householders have a duty of reasonable care, (which
includes things like not deliberately shooting people).

The above scenario is ridiculously unlikely, and should only concern people
who are so worried about legal issues that they have already cleared up all
the other perils in their house or garden that could ensnare the incautious
burglar.

Victoria

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 08:13:46 +0000, Jason Pope
wrote:

oldmolly wrote:
"Jason Pope" wrote in message
...

Erm, you could be opening yourself up to legal problems!
If someone was to come on your property and get shocked you could be sued!


How do you imagine land owners all over the country manage? People who keep
livestock have electric fences.If someone comes onto *my* property, and
tries to get through what is obviously an electric fence, and get shocked,
how could they sue me?


The law is different in the town and in the country!
Even a sign up saying "electric fence" wouldn't be enough in the town
cos some people cannot read!

some of them buy holiday cottages in the country.
--
Martin

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:21:16 -0000, "David Hill"
wrote:

The message is clear.....
If you live in an area where you are likely to have a visit from an intruder
who has a heart condition and a pacemaker and who crawls around on his/her
hands and knees then forget the electric fence.
With a fence height of 9 to 12 inches you wont even feel a thing if you are
wearing trousers, jeans etc.

unless one urinates on it, whilst trying to get the compost going.
--
Martin

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:32:49 +0000, Victoria Clare
wrote:


All of those are far more likely to cause injury than an electric fence,
which according to you might just conceivably be dangerous to someone who:
- is colourblind, AND
- has a heart problem, AND
- has broken into the garden rather than being invited (so has not been
warned), AND
- cannot read a warning sign, AND
- then goes rummaging about in the hedges!

or does it in the dark.


--
Martin

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:32:49 +0000, Victoria Clare
wrote:

Jason Pope wrote in news:3F9E24EF.1090002
:

It is illegal to fit anything, security wise, in your front/back garden
that could injure another person who is on the property!
Harsh I know, but that is definately the case!


********.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/martin/art...214670,00.html
The current law already provides substantial protection to people who
kill or inflict harm while defending themselves, their property or
other people, or to prevent a crime. If a defendant argues, as Tony
Martin did at his trial, that he was acting in self-defence, the jury
must acquit him of any crime if it believes the force he used was
reasonable in the circumstances.

The onus is on the prosecution to convince the jury that the force
used went beyond what was reasonable. "Reasonable force" is not
defined in law but is left to the common sense of the jury.

Making the presumption that the defendant acted in self-defence any
stronger would mean sanctioning a disproportionate response,
encouraging householders to use guns, electric fences and rottweilers.
It might also fall foul of the right to life guarantee in the Human
Rights Act, which comes into force this October.

and

http://www.securitypark.co.uk/articl...articleid=1670
--
Martin

martin wrote in
news
On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:32:49 +0000, Victoria Clare
wrote:


All of those are far more likely to cause injury than an electric
fence, which according to you might just conceivably be dangerous to
someone who: - is colourblind, AND
- has a heart problem, AND
- has broken into the garden rather than being invited (so has not
been warned), AND
- cannot read a warning sign, AND
- then goes rummaging about in the hedges!

or does it in the dark.

.... while not wearing any trousers!

I hope this garden doesn't have a pyracantha hedge. That would do the
trouserless nightime burglar a lot more harm than a quick zap.

Victoria

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 10:40:39 +0000, Victoria Clare
wrote:

martin wrote in
news
On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:32:49 +0000, Victoria Clare
wrote:


All of those are far more likely to cause injury than an electric
fence, which according to you might just conceivably be dangerous to
someone who: - is colourblind, AND
- has a heart problem, AND
- has broken into the garden rather than being invited (so has not
been warned), AND
- cannot read a warning sign, AND
- then goes rummaging about in the hedges!

or does it in the dark.

... while not wearing any trousers!

Keep it clean, kids read this group :-)


I hope this garden doesn't have a pyracantha hedge. That would do the
trouserless nightime burglar a lot more harm than a quick zap.

oo-er missus!
--
Martin

So what about the local MOD site which has razor wire and high fences all
around surely if I was to climb up this and hurt my self on the razor wire I
could sue the MOD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I think NOT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Rich

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 11:34:46 -0000, "Rich"
wrote:

So what about the local MOD site which has razor wire and high fences all
around surely if I was to climb up this and hurt my self on the razor wire I
could sue the MOD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The MOD have their own legislation that allows them to keep out the
public. You could sue, but I doubt if you would win :-)
--
Martin

On Tue, 28 Oct 2003 09:32:49 +0000, Victoria Clare wrote:

My greenhouse could injure someone. My pond could injure someone.
I have a patio raised 3 feet above a concrete surface: that could
injure someone.

True enough but in themselves not hazards.

I have some irregular paving, over which people might trip.

Ah now you have left a hazard unrepaired/marked/fenced off. You have a
duty of care to *everyone* who visits your property. If someone did
trip on that paving and break a leg/ankle WHY they *do* have a claim
against you.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail